How Small Can You Clone?

[Skunk Baxter]

As some may have noted from some of my other posts, I'm currently growing out 50 seeds in a pheno hunt. As soon as they started showing sex, I selected 7 of them based on various characteristics and cloned them. I had limited space for the clones, and opted to take several cuts of each of those 7 rather than clone every female.

I'm now coming to the end of Week 6, and a couple of the plants that looked quite ordinary and even sub-par a month and a half ago are coming on very strong and showing characteristics I wouldn't have expected when they were babies. One of them is an absolute frost monster with excellent early bud development, and the second is adding bud mass twice as fast as any other plant. At this rate, it may well turn out to be the biggest yielder in the room. We're pretty far along, but I still want to preserve these genetics in case they turn out to be the best mum candidates after all is said and done.

On the first plant, I sacrificed a branch that only had a few grams of bud on it and cut a 12-inch clone a few days ago. I know it's deep into flower, but I typically have a 100% strike rate with clones, and it's doing well. But on the second plant, all the short, stubby branches are loaded with buds, and even the smallest one has at least a half ounce of dry weight on it already. I don't want to cut a whole branch off of that one.

But this plant does have 4 small sucker shoots popping out of the base of the stem. On other plants in the past, I've cut those suckers and gotten excellent clones from them, but on this one the sucker shoots are only about an inch long. I've never cloned anything that small before. Has anyone ever had any luck cloning something that short? Any tips on how to make that work, or should I just bite the bullet and slice off a few inches of bud? I really want to save the genetics on this one.

Thanks, guys.

 

[Thefarmer12]

I've cloned small before with good results. Doesn't hurt to try.

Can't guarantee anything though it's ultimately your call to make. I will say that even though clones are exact replica of their mother/father, the quality of the cut does make a difference in the end plant and therefore product.

 

[GreenLogician]

Here's my smallest, 13 days old and still strong. Taken at start of week 4 of 12/12

 

[Skunk Baxter]

Thanks, guys, I appreciate the input. Actually, that one in the photo is larger than the biggest sucker I have to work with, but I'm thinking that if I arrange the plants so that more light gets through to the suckers they might grow a bit more and I can take some cuts next week.

GreenLogician, did you just dip your cut in cloning powder and stick it right into the medium? Because that's what I'm doing with all the other cuts I've taken; Clonex powder and right into a plastic cup full of coco.

At any rate, I have 4 suckers to cut. If even one makes it, I can at least preserve the genetics and know that I'll get better clones on future cuts.

 

[Skunk Baxter]

Hey, I just had a quick thought - because I'm so far into flower, my nute ratio is low on nitrogen. What if I dosed the small sucker shoots with foliar feedings of veg nutes? I never tried to boost growth selectively on a small portion of a plant before, but might that not work?

 

[GreenLogician]

I haven't been cloning long, just a couple months. I've taken about 8 with bare stems in soil, and more recently 8 with clonex gel. 100% success rate on all so far, although it might be a bit too early to say for some of the clonex gel cuts, which are more recent.

My bare stem cuts did great
My clonex gel cuts seem to be doing great, all still perky and stable, a few yellowing off from the bottom as if they are rooting. No roots out the bottom of the soil yet.

For most I use domes for the first 4 days, unless background humidity is above 70% those first four days, and they are small cuts.
The cut in the photo was never domed

 

[GreenLogician]

I've heard some people say they think cuttings root faster in a slightly nitrogen deprived state, it drives their roots to search it out quick. Old wives tale maybe, look for a carefully designed experimental test

People sometimes put flower ferts into their aero-cloners, not veg ferts.
That could be a helpful research starting point.

 

[Skunk Baxter]

Yeah, I never dome mine ether. Never had to. I just dip them in powder, insert them into damp coco, and then water very lightly with a tiny amount of SuperThrive to keep the cut happy for the first few days. After that, light watering until the leaves show me that the roots are developing, and then a light nute mix for about one more watering. Then when the root system is developed enough that I see it through the sides of the cup, full nute mix - because after all, they're fully adult plants. Just very small ones.

As far as the nitrogen is concerned, what I'm talking about is foliar feeding of the sucker shoots before I cut them, so they'll grow a little more before I slice. Then I'll have more stem to work with. Just spritz the sucker shoots lightly with a veg nute mix for a few days and see if they get a small growth spurt. I mean, even if they only grow a half inch, it'll be 50% more stem to work with on the cloning.

 

[GreenLogician]

Ah for extra stem to work with, that's a good motivation.
I did get that you meant foliar feeding before cutting, I was thinking about the angle that a nitrogen enriched branch might not be as vigorous a rooter as if you didn't top it up with nitrogen first.

 

[Skunk Baxter]

Yeah, I was thinking about that ever since I posted. One of the reasons I don't dome is because the roots seem to develop faster and stronger when their only source of moisture is the coco, and ever since I read your post I was kicking around whether dosing them up with nitrogen before cutting would have any negative effect after they're in the coco. Too late at night to think that one through...

 

[GreenLogician]

As late as week 6 in flower, another concern is that stem growth might be in pause mode, regardless of nutrient levels.
Adding nitrogen may just make leaves darker

 

[Skunk Baxter]

I know! I'll buy little tiny LED lights, build a 4-inch tall shack around the base of the plant, and kick the sucker shoots back into an 18/6 light cycle!

Just kidding. But yeah, that's right - I can't believe I didn't think of that. Damn, you're right; that should have been so obvious, but I was so busy being clever I overthought it and never considered that. One inch may be all I have to work with, and that's that.

Well, I'll give the foliar feeding a whirl, and watch them closely every day. If there's no change in 3 or 4 days, I'll just assume that's the way it is and slice 'em. Like I said, with 4 shoots, I should be able to get at least 1 to take. I'll just have to treat them very tenderly and closely monitor their moisture levels, because there'll only be about a half inch below the coco.

 

[johnmac240]

I know! I'll buy little tiny LED lights, build a 4-inch tall shack around the base of the plant, and kick the sucker shoots back into an 18/6 light cycle!

Just kidding. But yeah, that's right - I can't believe I didn't think of that. Damn, you're right; that should have been so obvious, but I was so busy being clever I overthought it and never considered that. One inch may be all I have to work with, and that's that.

Well, I'll give the foliar feeding a whirl, and watch them closely every day. If there's no change in 3 or 4 days, I'll just assume that's the way it is and slice 'em. Like I said, with 4 shoots, I should be able to get at least 1 to take. I'll just have to treat them very tenderly and closely monitor their moisture levels, because there'll only be about a half inch below the coco.

Did they ever root I'm in a similar situation.

 

[dabus171]

Did they ever root I'm in a similar situation.

If you cant get them to root wait until the plant is done. Harvest the majority and leave just a bunch of small popcorn nugs. Put back into veg and they will reharvest. I just did it with a Cherry Fritter I wanted to save. Worked amazing. The node intervals stayed super tight and looks like it's going to be a beast when I flip it into flower again. I also transplanted into a larger fabric pot and top dressed with Worm Castings. Since the original soil was more than likely depleted.

 

[bk78]

If you cant get them to root wait until the plant is done. Harvest the majority and leave just a bunch of small popcorn nugs. Put back into veg and they will reharvest. I just did it with a Cherry Fritter I wanted to save. Worked amazing. The node intervals stayed super tight and looks like it's going to be a beast when I flip it into flower again. I also transplanted into a larger fabric pot and top dressed with Worm Castings. Since the original soil was more than likely depleted.

Dude hasn’t been online in 4 years. Stop bumping old posts and telling people how to grow

 

[Nutty sKunK]

Dude hasn’t been online in 4 years. Stop bumping old posts and telling people how to grow

I wonder if this replying to old post phenomenon has something to do with that fact most folk are stoned our their minds? Haha

 

[dabus171]

Dude hasn’t been online in 4 years. Stop bumping old posts and telling people how to grow

My bad I thought I was still on a thread from late 2020. Although if it was recent that is what every single other person is doing bud.

 

[dabus171]

I wonder if this replying to old post phenomenon has something to do with that fact most folk are stoned our their minds? Haha

I was just on another thread that was from late 2020, didnt realize I was in the other thread. So yeah pretty much I cant argue that point.

 

[Star Dog]

He's a new member when he looks at new posts everything is bold.

Your at 6 weeks iirc from your largest clone posts ?

Air layering is a safe bet at that age, you can clone from that age it just takes a bit longer to root.
For cloning I'd look in the the plant for some fresh/fresher green shoots, imo they 1" suckers are well clone able.