First grow - pale leaves slow growth early flowering

[bonapartemtl]

Hi,

Total newbie, first grow ... I was given a baby clone plant (cookies n cream) with all the equipment (tent, led light, 4in inline exhaust, humidifier, etc.) and I'm really doing this for fun. I read a bunch of articles and am generally very good with plants. I was given the baby plant right before christmas and it grew very well (I think) until about 2 weeks ago (so roughly 7-8 weeks). I used a mix of regular potting soil, compost and perlite and added organic slow-release "all-purpose" fertilizer. Temperatures are always pretty much around 73-78F and humidity between 40 and 60%. Everything was going great. It was growing fast and had a nice deep green. I trained it to flatten it and it responded very well. I thought "if it ain't broke, dont fix it", so I never really checked pH and continued using the same fertilizer. 2 weeks ago, I think my gf played with the timer and left the light open for 48 hours. The leaves started getting paler (not sure if it had already started before the timer incident, but I think so), and I found brownish spots on a few leaves. 1 week later (so 1 week ago), perhaps stupidly, I decided to switch to 12/12 lighting to initiate flowering, even though i was a bit worried about the paleness of my plant. It's been a week and I think my plant hasn't grown at all. Zero growth. And I thought it would shoot up during the first week of flowering. So I started getting paranoid about nutrients and pH so I added a different kind of fertilizer (blooming 2-8-10) and a tiny bit of another one that I knew had zinc (because i thought it might be a zinc deficiency). And I checked the pH of my water but I think my phmeter is broken (wildly different readings in same liquid). I'm kind of worried. I'm very attached to the plant now haha and I'd be really disappointed if it ends up not producing or producing almost nothing. I'm posting a picture of the plant from this morning, but it could be from a week ago, because it hasn't changed at all. You can see the light green color and the brown spots. No new brown spots since the timer incident btw. If any of you have any advice, it would be great. Can I salvage it ? Is it okay and i should just chill out ? Is it screwed ? Thanks !

 

[JimmiP]

Hi,

Total newbie, first grow ... I was given a baby clone plant (cookies n cream) with all the equipment (tent, led light, 4in inline exhaust, humidifier, etc.) and I'm really doing this for fun. I read a bunch of articles and am generally very good with plants. I was given the baby plant right before christmas and it grew very well (I think) until about 2 weeks ago (so roughly 7-8 weeks). I used a mix of regular potting soil, compost and perlite and added organic slow-release "all-purpose" fertilizer. Temperatures are always pretty much around 73-78F and humidity between 40 and 60%. Everything was going great. It was growing fast and had a nice deep green. I trained it to flatten it and it responded very well. I thought "if it ain't broke, dont fix it", so I never really checked pH and continued using the same fertilizer. 2 weeks ago, I think my gf played with the timer and left the light open for 48 hours. The leaves started getting paler (not sure if it had already started before the timer incident, but I think so), and I found brownish spots on a few leaves. 1 week later (so 1 week ago), perhaps stupidly, I decided to switch to 12/12 lighting to initiate flowering, even though i was a bit worried about the paleness of my plant. It's been a week and I think my plant hasn't grown at all. Zero growth. And I thought it would shoot up during the first week of flowering. So I started getting paranoid about nutrients and pH so I added a different kind of fertilizer (blooming 2-8-10) and a tiny bit of another one that I knew had zinc (because i thought it might be a zinc deficiency). And I checked the pH of my water but I think my phmeter is broken (wildly different readings in same liquid). I'm kind of worried. I'm very attached to the plant now haha and I'd be really disappointed if it ends up not producing or producing almost nothing. I'm posting a picture of the plant from this morning, but it could be from a week ago, because it hasn't changed at all. You can see the light green color and the brown spots. No new brown spots since the timer incident btw. If any of you have any advice, it would be great. Can I salvage it ? Is it okay and i should just chill out ? Is it screwed ? Thanks !
View attachment 4826926

What size container are you using?
You might have ran out of root space.
If it were mine I would increase the temperature to 82f and give it a foliar spray with epsom salt (1 tsp/gallon) 2-3 times a week. That could help green it back up. Next time though, don't flip to a flowering cycle until the plant is healthy. It's big enough that it should be able to pull out of this.
Still, ou may need to change to a larger container. If that's the case, since you have flipped to flowering, it should be done asap.
Good luck friend!

 

[bonapartemtl]

Thanks a lot for your reply ! It's in a 2 gallon container. I can probably get my hands on a larger container and get some additional soil and replant it. I would had thought 2 gallons would have been enough, but that's based on growing tomatoes and hot peppers, so probably different. I'll also get epsom salts and try spraying the leaves as you mentioned.

 

[JimmiP]

Thanks a lot for your reply ! It's in a 2 gallon container. I can probably get my hands on a larger container and get some additional soil and replant it. I would had thought 2 gallons would have been enough, but that's based on growing tomatoes and hot peppers, so probably different. I'll also get epsom salts and try spraying the leaves as you mentioned.

I thought that might be the case. Just to make things easier on you and your plant I would recommend a complete potting soil mix like fox farm ocean forest (or something similar) and a 7-10 gallon container, (I'm a big fan of fabric pots). Just do it soon and as carefully as you can.

 

[bonapartemtl]

Alright, I'll try to take care of that today. Thanks a lot ! I'll send some pictures !

 

[Gentlemencorpse]

I actually think your pot size is okay but I've spent a lot of time dialing in my grow to use small containers. But on the whole I agree with @JimmiP. I wouldn't up pot now myself, I don't like doing it once flower has begun.

I also think your leaf discoloration was caused by low temps under LEDs. You need canopy temps around 82 with LEDs otherwise the plants don't take up nutrients properly, especially calcium and Magnesium, which is the most common cause of those little rust spots your seeing. Usually it's fine once in flower but it can grow a little slow. If possible I'd try to get the temps up a bit, but personally I'd just power through. But I'm kind of a savage.

 

[JimmiP]

Thanks a lot for your reply ! It's in a 2 gallon container. I can probably get my hands on a larger container and get some additional soil and replant it. I would had thought 2 gallons would have been enough, but that's based on growing tomatoes and hot peppers, so probably different. I'll also get epsom salts and try spraying the leaves as you mentioned.

Also, try and get the temps up in there. LED doesn't have enough IR radiation to keep plants as happy as they could be. Also check the temperature in the root zone. You really want the root system to stay in the mid 70s.

 

[JimmiP]

I actually think your pot size is okay but I've spent a lot of time dialing in my grow to use small containers. But on the whole I agree with @JimmiP. I wouldn't up pot now myself, I don't like doing it once flower has begun.

I also think your leaf discoloration was caused by low temps under LEDs. You need canopy temps around 82 with LEDs otherwise the plants don't take up nutrients properly, especially calcium and Magnesium, which is the most common cause of those little rust spots your seeing. Usually it's fine once in flower but it can grow a little slow. If possible I'd try to get the temps up a bit, but personally I'd just power through. But I'm kind of a savage.

Yeah I'm not a big fan of changing containers during flower either. But it's only been a week into 12/12. I have done it 3 weeks in, indoors and had no ill effects. That's one of the reasons I love fabric pots so much. I can just set them into the new, larger pot and let them go. The roots just grow right through the first pot.

 

[bonapartemtl]

Ok, I added a little heater in the room. It does get pretty cold in my apartment... I never really checked the night temperatures, but it seems highly possible that the temperatures drop too much ... I live in montreal, canada. It was 5F outside all weekend so... Ok, I'll get some epsom salts today, raise the temp in the room and if that doesn't work, I'll try to change containers, but I understand that's riskier...

 

[bonapartemtl]

Thanks a lot for your replies !

 

[Southernontariogrower]

I've got two plants one in 2g one in 4, same cultivar, both looked exact going into flower, 2g is throwing buds approx half the size as 4g. So I believe size does make a difference. 10 g fabric pot plants are way bigger. 5 gal buckets are perfect size for indoor. IMO! But I like to let my plants mature before flipping to flower, till they show sex, I grow with seeds not clones, yet.

 

[bonapartemtl]

I've got two plants one in 2g one in 4, same cultivar, both looked exact going into flower, 2g is throwing buds approx half the size as 4g. So I believe size does make a difference. 10 g fabric pot plants are way bigger. 5 gal buckets are perfect size for indoor. IMO! But I like to let my plants mature before flipping to flower, till they show sex, I grow with seeds not clones, yet.

For sure, next time I'll use larger containers, but I'm a little worried about changing it now, I wouldn't want to screw it up. Especially if it's fragile and not super healthy. If nothing else gets it going again, I will change containers though, that's for sure.

 

[Gentlemencorpse]

I've got two plants one in 2g one in 4, same cultivar, both looked exact going into flower, 2g is throwing buds approx half the size as 4g. So I believe size does make a difference. 10 g fabric pot plants are way bigger. 5 gal buckets are perfect size for indoor. IMO! But I like to let my plants mature before flipping to flower, till they show sex, I grow with seeds not clones, yet.

There's just so many variables here. I'm assuming your growing in soil? In that case, especially with organics, yes, pot size can definitely impact plant and bud size because it effects the amount of available nutrients. With coco it's much less impactful. With frequent fertigation you can grow huge plants in really small containers.

Also, since you grow from seed, you could just be seeing a difference in each plants genetics when observing the different bud sizes. If you really want to test the impact of planter size on your harvest using your particular growing methods you'd want to use clones to ensure you were comparinh apples to apples

 

[Southernontariogrower]

There's just so many variables here. I'm assuming your growing in soil? In that case, especially with organics, yes, pot size can definitely impact plant and bud size because it effects the amount of available nutrients. With coco it's much less impactful. With frequent fertigation you can grow huge plants in really small containers.

Also, since you grow from seed, you could just be seeing a difference in each plants genetics when observing the different bud sizes. If you really want to test the impact of planter size on your harvest using your particular growing methods you'd want to use clones to ensure you were comparinh apples to apples

Next run will be monocrop.

 

[JimmiP]

For sure, next time I'll use larger containers, but I'm a little worried about changing it now, I wouldn't want to screw it up. Especially if it's fragile and not super healthy. If nothing else gets it going again, I will change containers though, that's for sure.

I honestly wouldn't worry about it at this point. One week in is nothing to worry about. Just be as careful, as you would any other time you move a plant to a larger container. In a two gallon pot a plant that size has filled the soil completely and would benefit from more space to spread out into. More space for roots in soil leads to much better and bigger harvests. And you won't have to worry about feeding as much. Inside, I go from 4inch square pots, to 2 gallon, to 10 gallon fabric pots to 20+ to finish them if I think they can use the space.

 

[JimmiP]

Here's an example (mid-frame on the right) of dropping the (10 gallon) fabric pot into a larger (18-20 gallon) container. I use 10 gallon square fabric pots and most times they are enough. But sometimes my plants just wanna keep going and need more space. Doing up pots this way during flowering causes no stress and will lessen dependence on Brawndo!
You can also see another plant (lower right) in just a 10g fabric pot. The larger container made a larger plant with larger buds and and of course a larger yield. And they are from clones of the same size from the same mother, that were put into the 10g pots on the same day. I didn't up pot the other one (actually there are two I left in the 10g pots) to make it easier to move it out of the way. The three plants, that did get new containers, were all done at three weeks into flowering or so.

 

[Gentlemencorpse]

Here's an example (mid-frame on the right) of dropping the (10 gallon) fabric pot into a larger (18-20 gallon) container. View attachment 4826994I use 10 gallon square fabric pots and most times they are enough. But sometimes my plants just wanna keep going and need more space. Doing up pots this way during flowering causes no stress and will lessen dependence on Brawndo!
You can also see another plant (lower right) in just a 10g fabric pot. The larger container made a larger plant with larger buds and and of course a larger yield. And they are from clones of the same size from the same mother, that were put into the 10g pots on the same day. I didn't up pot the other one (actually there are two I left in the 10g pots) to make it easier to move it out of the way. The three plants, that did get new containers, were all done at three weeks into flowering or so.

I love your setup. Vertical air cooled hps it looks like?? Nice...

 

[bonapartemtl]

That's awesome. I grow a bunch of vegetables in the summer and I think the fabric pots would be great for those as well. For now, I found a 4-5 gallon ceramic pot that I'll use to repot. Might even to do it tonight, I'm impatient to see if it'll solve the issue.

 

[JimmiP]

Yep. Hps and at times metal halide too. It is in the process of getting widened right now. I need a little more wiggle room in there. Even with the cool tubes, the lights get a little warm on the back, when I'm squeezed in there working. Especially near the end of flowering.
Even with the netting holding them back the buds kept ending up finding their way between the fixtures. Lol! It makes for a tight and sticky squeeze to get to the plant on the back wall.

 

[JimmiP]

I love your setup. Vertical air cooled hps it looks like?? Nice...

Thank you!