All BS set aside CMH yields

is it true or not

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mr4tune

mr4tune

Well-Known Member
Interesting info on here and some great pics. I switched from SE 1k HPS to 630w dual bulbs... My experience is the quality is better but they do not replace a 1k as I had been told by a few guys. The heat is a serious turn off for me... No air cooled hoods meant adding AC and keeping the fixtures further away from the canopy compared to say even a 600w air cooled so at the end of the day idk...

I personally found that 630's over a 4x4 was good but not ideal. It left allot to be desired in the corners and penetration was lack luster for me. Again, just my personal experience. Lotsa guys crushing it to contradict my opinion.

I'm currently running x2 4x8 10-site UC systems.. Decided to drop some coin and try LED panels compared to the CMH. I have x2 8 bar 650w panels over one system, and x3 630w CMH over the other. Im $2k CAD for x2 LED panels, and $2100 for x3 CMH with Philips bulbs. So far the LED's are winning honestly and they are doing it at say 25% of the heat the x3 CMH are putting out. If I were to cut out the x3 CMH and replace with LED panels I wouldn't need my AC. By doing so I could gain an extra 4x8 canopy with the watts reallocated.

Again, just my experience and room variables. Keep the lid on your haterade...

I will say the plants vegged under CMH are amazing.
 
tripleD

tripleD

Well-Known Member
mr4tune said:
Interesting info on here and some great pics. I switched from SE 1k HPS to 630w dual bulbs... My experience is the quality is better but they do not replace a 1k as I had been told by a few guys. The heat is a serious turn off for me... No air cooled hoods meant adding AC and keeping the fixtures further away from the canopy compared to say even a 600w air cooled so at the end of the day idk...

I personally found that 630's over a 4x4 was good but not ideal. It left allot to be desired in the corners and penetration was lack luster for me. Again, just my personal experience. Lotsa guys crushing it to contradict my opinion.

I'm currently running x2 4x8 10-site UC systems.. Decided to drop some coin and try LED panels compared to the CMH. I have x2 8 bar 650w panels over one system, and x3 630w CMH over the other. Im $2k CAD for x2 LED panels, and $2100 for x3 CMH with Philips bulbs. So far the LED's are winning honestly and they are doing it at say 25% of the heat the x3 CMH are putting out. If I were to cut out the x3 CMH and replace with LED panels I wouldn't need my AC. By doing so I could gain an extra 4x8 canopy with the watts reallocated.

Again, just my experience and room variables. Keep the lid on your haterade...

I will say the plants vegged under CMH are amazing.
Click to expand...
Heat is a huge issue for me here in Texas as well, so I switched to the Spydr600 LED several years ago and it made a huge improvement, not only in my electric bill, but also how many grows I can get, since I can grow well into the late spring time now before heat becomes an issue. When I was using CMH or HPS bulbs I couldn’t grow past early March due to heat, but w LED I’m able to grow until Late May.
 
mr4tune

mr4tune

Well-Known Member
Right? I was running x4 CMH and my 8k BTU window banger was running full tilt for 12 hours a day. I couldn't get my room below 85F. That's the room, not the canopy temp lol. Granted this unit is a few years old, but still... thats fucking 800w all day...fml.

I put in 2 LED panels and removed only 1 CMH and I'm down to 80F now with the AC cycling as needed. That's disgusting. I'm just waiting for one of the trolls to start with the "LED panels are bullshit" speeches. The technology has far surpassed the shitty blurple units. Granted I haven't chopped yet to see the final quality or numbers, I have met a few other guys running these same panels and swearing that the quality and weight is there. TIme will tell. Regardless, you can't argue that the fact is clear... The watts saved in cooling and the spread of the panels allows a guy to drastically increase numbers...
 
Horselover fat

Horselover fat

Well-Known Member
mr4tune said:
Interesting info on here and some great pics. I switched from SE 1k HPS to 630w dual bulbs... My experience is the quality is better but they do not replace a 1k as I had been told by a few guys. The heat is a serious turn off for me... No air cooled hoods meant adding AC and keeping the fixtures further away from the canopy compared to say even a 600w air cooled so at the end of the day idk...

I personally found that 630's over a 4x4 was good but not ideal. It left allot to be desired in the corners and penetration was lack luster for me. Again, just my personal experience. Lotsa guys crushing it to contradict my opinion.

I'm currently running x2 4x8 10-site UC systems.. Decided to drop some coin and try LED panels compared to the CMH. I have x2 8 bar 650w panels over one system, and x3 630w CMH over the other. Im $2k CAD for x2 LED panels, and $2100 for x3 CMH with Philips bulbs. So far the LED's are winning honestly and they are doing it at say 25% of the heat the x3 CMH are putting out. If I were to cut out the x3 CMH and replace with LED panels I wouldn't need my AC. By doing so I could gain an extra 4x8 canopy with the watts reallocated.

Again, just my experience and room variables. Keep the lid on your haterade...

I will say the plants vegged under CMH are amazing.
Click to expand...
I've used a 315 in 2x4 and at the time it felt like 1.5 x 315 would be perfect for the area. Now that I understand ppf it seems I was right on the nose. 2 x 315 is about 2/3 of the light output of a 1000w hps. Three would be perfect for a 4x4 and match a 1k for output with a better spectrum.
 
hillbill

hillbill

Well-Known Member
Horselover fat said:
I've used a 315 in 2x4 and at the time it felt like 1.5 x 315 would be perfect for the area. Now that I understand ppf it seems I was right on the nose. 2 x 315 is about 2/3 of the light output of a 1000w hps. Three would be perfect for a 4x4 and match a 1k for output with a better spectrum.
Click to expand...
Adding a 135w or 100w HLG Quantum Board Will make you very happy!
 
Dividedsky

Dividedsky

Well-Known Member
mr4tune said:
Interesting info on here and some great pics. I switched from SE 1k HPS to 630w dual bulbs... My experience is the quality is better but they do not replace a 1k as I had been told by a few guys. The heat is a serious turn off for me... No air cooled hoods meant adding AC and keeping the fixtures further away from the canopy compared to say even a 600w air cooled so at the end of the day idk...

I personally found that 630's over a 4x4 was good but not ideal. It left allot to be desired in the corners and penetration was lack luster for me. Again, just my personal experience. Lotsa guys crushing it to contradict my opinion.

I'm currently running x2 4x8 10-site UC systems.. Decided to drop some coin and try LED panels compared to the CMH. I have x2 8 bar 650w panels over one system, and x3 630w CMH over the other. Im $2k CAD for x2 LED panels, and $2100 for x3 CMH with Philips bulbs. So far the LED's are winning honestly and they are doing it at say 25% of the heat the x3 CMH are putting out. If I were to cut out the x3 CMH and replace with LED panels I wouldn't need my AC. By doing so I could gain an extra 4x8 canopy with the watts reallocated.

Again, just my experience and room variables. Keep the lid on your haterade...

I will say the plants vegged under CMH are amazing.
Click to expand...
You're definitely right, though I like the 630 dual bulb cmh there's no way it gets near outperforming my s/e 1000w. At times/ dialed in I can pull 2 elbows under my s/e 1000w, I can't do that with a 630cmh. I also like that I can switch out the hps bulb for a MH at beginning and end of flower and in that sense it makes completely switching over to cmh kind of pointless. I have a friend who's all about trying to cut down his electric consumption but wants results. He using 315s for veg 1 in each 4x4 space...630s for flower. His veg plants are getting lanky, im telling him 315w cmh is not enough for a 4x4 veg but he's not hearing it. I'd rather have my 12 bulb/ 4ft/ 54w t5s bulbs for veg all day. Run 16 t5 bulbs in a 5x5 veg, he has a 315cmh in a 5x5 in veg. Dont get it. He thinks 2 630 cmh in flower will outperform 2 se 1000w hps...just don't think so
 
NukaKola

NukaKola

Well-Known Member
To me, CMH vs HPS is similar to QB vs COB. They both have their pros and cons and are better suited for different growing styles.

If you are going with short veg cycles with shorter plants CMH's are great, the required distance to canopy is a huge bonus if headroom is limited. Longer veg with larger plants a 1000w HPS is a clear winner.

A more suited comparison would be 3 315w CMH (990w actual) vs a 1000w DE HPS (1200w actual). It would be hard to do a comparison though as they would both require completely different grow methods and footprints.
 
Dividedsky

Dividedsky

Well-Known Member
NukaKola said:
To me, CMH vs HPS is similar to QB vs COB. They both have their pros and cons and are better suited for different growing styles.

If you are going with short veg cycles with shorter plants CMH's are great, the required distance to canopy is a huge bonus if headroom is limited. Longer veg with larger plants a 1000w HPS is a clear winner.

A more suited comparison would be 3 315w CMH (990w actual) vs a 1000w DE HPS (1200w actual). It would be hard to do a comparison though as they would both require completely different grow methods and footprints.
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For sure. I was thinking of updating my flower room. I'm running 4- se1000w hps/mh and a 1-630cmh in the middle. I run a sealed room with 2 ton minisplit and co2, so I have some wiggle room, and can pretty much switch around to whatever I want and maybe add some light, though I'm not really trying to add wattage with the lights.
I've thought of getting rid of the 4-se 1000w and running 8-630cmh dual bulb, it would get some very nice coverage in my room. Even thought of splitting it up and running 16-315cmh but that a lot of lights to hang and alot of wires. Think I'm going to pick up a gavita 1700e gen 2 to test em out and see how I like the LED's these days, ran them years ago when the tech wasn't were it is now. Not opposed to running all leds in my flower room though that would be a bigger investment. Also been looking into the d/e 630 cmh which there's not alot of info about on those. They seem like they would do the trick. Guess I'm old school though- I still love my s/e 1000s especially since throwing mine in the extra large adjusta wing(bat wings) open hoods.
 
NukaKola

NukaKola

Well-Known Member
Dividedsky said:
For sure. I was thinking of updating my flower room. I'm running 4- se1000w hps/mh and a 1-630cmh in the middle. I run a sealed room with 2 ton minisplit and co2, so I have some wiggle room, and can pretty much switch around to whatever I want and maybe add some light, though I'm not really trying to add wattage with the lights.
I've thought of getting rid of the 4-se 1000w and running 8-630cmh dual bulb, it would get some very nice coverage in my room. Even thought of splitting it up and running 16-315cmh but that a lot of lights to hang and alot of wires. Think I'm going to pick up a gavita 1700e gen 2 to test em out and see how I like the LED's these days, ran them years ago when the tech wasn't were it is now. Not opposed to running all leds in my flower room though that would be a bigger investment. Also been looking into the d/e 630 cmh which there's not alot of info about on those. They seem like they would do the trick. Guess I'm old school though- I still love my s/e 1000s especially since throwing mine in the extra large adjusta wing(bat wings) open hoods.
Click to expand...
I would be interested to see a side by side of the 630w dual bulb vs 630w DE. A lot of the DE’s seem to be discontinued already though so I’d be a bit worried about replacements down the road.

I just went from 600w SE HPS to LED to see what the hype is about. HPS works great and for the cost it is hard to beat.

If you’re interested in the Gavita 1700e, you may want to check out Timbers new Cypress 8, very similar fixture for $300 less.
 
Jakkar

Jakkar

Well-Known Member
I’m currently running a mix of 650w LEDs and 315s. I average in the 9-11oz range per 315 and would like to step up my gram per foot ratio where the 315s are. I love the cmh and been looking at the 630 duels and de but haven’t found much info. I have 7’ ceilings, can I use the 630 DE over a 4x4 or do i need more ceiling height? Do the dual bulbs cover a 4x4 sufficiently?
 
G

Grassizgreener

Well-Known Member
Jakkar said:
I’m currently running a mix of 650w LEDs and 315s. I average in the 9-11oz range per 315 and would like to step up my gram per foot ratio where the 315s are. I love the cmh and been looking at the 630 duels and de but haven’t found much info. I have 7’ ceilings, can I use the 630 DE over a 4x4 or do i need more ceiling height? Do the dual bulbs cover a 4x4 sufficiently?
Click to expand...
Height isn’t the problem it’s the heat, I would say it puts off the same amount of as a 700w hps, I can hang it about 16-18” without bleaching tops. If u can keep the lights at 20-24” throughout flower, your plants will reward you. This is regarding 630s with dual Phillips bulbs
 
Dividedsky

Dividedsky

Well-Known Member
Grassizgreener said:
View attachment 4693810

4 630 duals in a 12x12 pulled a little over 10#,
3 630 staged 4x10 and one off center to the side of the 3. Veg and keeping light height right throughout flower is key along with right vpd and feeding.
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You pulled 10 elbows with 4-630s? That impressive if its so...I've gotten 10 elbows with my 4- 1000w and a 630s, granted I am growing all cookies, wedding cake and gelatos and hit those numbers with my very best yielding phenos.
Jakkar said:
I’m currently running a mix of 650w LEDs and 315s. I average in the 9-11oz range per 315 and would like to step up my gram per foot ratio where the 315s are. I love the cmh and been looking at the 630 duels and de but haven’t found much info. I have 7’ ceilings, can I use the 630 DE over a 4x4 or do i need more ceiling height? Do the dual bulbs cover a 4x4 sufficiently?
Click to expand...
Ya I believe you'll be good with a de 630cmh and with 7ft ceilings. You might want to veg plants to a smaller size before throwing them in flower though. The de 630s give off a bit more heat than the duals but height wise 7ft should suffice.
 
Jakkar

Jakkar

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the reply guys, looks like I’m going the DE direction. It’ll be interesting to see how they do vs the 650w strip Samsung lm301s
 
mr4tune

mr4tune

Well-Known Member
NukaKola said:
I would be interested to see a side by side of the 630w dual bulb vs 630w DE. A lot of the DE’s seem to be discontinued already though so I’d be a bit worried about replacements down the road....
I just went from 600w SE HPS to LED to see what the hype is about. HPS works great and for the cost it is hard to beat.

If you’re interested in the Gavita 1700e, you may want to check out Timbers new Cypress 8, very similar fixture for $300 less.
Click to expand...
My first CMH fixture was a 630 DE with a Silverstar 3XL hood. What a piece of shit that was. Idk I still think there was an issue with the ballast because my yields were horrible compared to the same plants in the room under the dual bulbs. The heat was somehow waaaay less than under the dual bulbs. Had to have been an issue somewhere... The reflector was almost a 4x4 itself and I actually got a reserved pillow effect. The edges got more light than the center due to the angle of the reflectors and the depth of the hood. Made no sense. Piss poor design on many levels.
 
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