Breeding help please

ganga gurl420

ganga gurl420

Well-Known Member
So I made a cross using a jelly pie father with a super frosty berry smelling sativa dom blue dream.

Here is the problem... 2 out of 12 plants have hermied when my buddies grew them out (well technically the current grow is only 3 weeks into flower so we will see if more pop up)

Now with that being said... can the hermi trait be bred out? Or is this just the chance you take any time you pop a bean?

This is my cross being grown out by a friend
Jelly dream... I think she is pretty frosty for being so young.received_4249258271758587.jpeg
 
ganga gurl420

ganga gurl420

Well-Known Member
Beats said:
How experienced are your friends at growing? Anything can go hermaphrodite if its stressed in any way.
Click to expand...
Well both are highly experienced...and I do know that stess will induce it. I guess my question is if I make an s1 or f2 from females that dont show pollen sacs....will It eventually with more breeding become less likely to show the trait?
 
xtsho

xtsho

Well-Known Member
ganga gurl420 said:
Well both are highly experienced...and I do know that stess will induce it. I guess my question is if I make an s1 or f2 from females that dont show pollen sacs....will It eventually with more breeding become less likely to show the trait?
Click to expand...
Disclaimer: I have no formal education in plant genetics and probably don't know what I'm talking about.

Yes but you can never breed it out completely because genetically all cannabis plants can display hermaphroditism. When you make a cross like you did even though you may have used 2 stable strains the cross could show a wide range of different phenotypes some of which could potentially be prone to hermaphrodatism because the genotype of the cross is going to be a combination of both parents and recessive genes can surface. Just like breeding for different smells and plant structure you can breed for plants that don't display hermaphroditism. But you can never breed the potential for a plant to become a hermie out completely.

It's also possible that the hermaphrodatism was caused by some form of environmental stress and it will never happen again with any of the remaining seeds.
 
Kassiopeija

Kassiopeija

Well-Known Member
Hello ganga gurl420,

some of the genes which carry the informations to form sexual organs are conserved into a region which cannot be changed by breeding. They are the same for most highly evolved lifeforms.

That being said, many breeders have done a good job in adapting Cannabis to their indoor setups, thus making these strains much less likely to herm under these artificial conditions.

But if these plants are constantly used for breeding, they'll become weak & sickly over time. Thus, breeders cross in landraces/ "more natural" strains to refresh/ revivify their genes but it may also incorporate new unwanted abilities, like the potential to herm more often.
For Cannabis and many other plants, to form both sexes on one plant isnt that bad of a thing. Plants even have developed methods to evade/nullify a self-pollination.

Proper breeding is difficult. In order to do it right you'd need to learn the techniques from books beforeahead, and second, you'd need to get more info about the parent plants from their breeders.

Some breeders even use this knowledge to create seeds which grow good plants, but only in their generation. All offspring though would come out much weaker or "unstable".

Still, I think, for homegrowers its ok to make seeds on your own. Quite some famous strains came to life like this... if you test them outdoors, not much is wasted if things go south... my advise would be to always cross strains that look differently, and are from different sources/places of the earth.
:weed:
 
ganga gurl420

ganga gurl420

Well-Known Member
Well damn! Well okay then thanks for the answers.
Then only reason i bred them together anyways is because I had the two strains growing already and the j.p was super frosty but not a vigorous grower but had thick tight buds and the b.d. mother was insanely frosty with a lot of vigor but had smaller less dense buds so I thought I'd give it a go and pollinate a small branch and see if bringing the two together would be benificial.

Plus I got the free beans of the blue dream from the single seed centre and when I looked them up...it was no name for the breeder given and I didnt want to lose the genetics because she was soo interesting and smelled and tasted strong of strawberries.

Alls I know is my indoor growing buddy is in awe of them so far and says the smell is out of this world.

I guess we will just see and I will keep breeding it as long as it turns out decent and doesnt keep popping balls.

Thanks again
 
Dabbie McDoob

Dabbie McDoob

Well-Known Member
Hermie alleles are dominant. Thus subsequent progeny will have a tendency to express this trait.
I chop hermies on sight.
I have yet to experience a plant tossing nanners after switching to regular seeds.
Also, breeding w/ Fem seeds is not advantageous.
My 2cents.

Good luck! That plant looks resinous for week 3-4 of flower.
 
ganga gurl420

ganga gurl420

Well-Known Member
Dabbie McDoob said:
Hermie alleles are dominant. Thus subsequent progeny will have a tendency to express this trait.
I chop hermies on sight.
I have yet to experience a plant tossing nanners after switching to regular seeds.
Also, breeding w/ Fem seeds is not advantageous.
My 2cents.

Good luck! That plant looks resinous for week 3-4 of flower.
Click to expand...
Thank you! I'm pretty excited to see what they all will turn out like. Every plant that he popped is just super resinous. We will see how they do because I think I may have made something nice, but wont know for sure for another 7 weeks.
Also wont know If they will throw bananas later on either. Fingers crossed.
 
ApexseasOG

ApexseasOG

Well-Known Member
Yeah she's frosty af alright; can't imagine what she'll look like at harvest. I can see the sativa traits on the leaves, she must be tall; how tall is she? Great work btw.
 
2Hearts

2Hearts

Well-Known Member
Cannabis dosent suffer inbreeding depression, quite the opposite.

Kassiopeija said:
Hello ganga gurl420,

some of the genes which carry the informations to form sexual organs are conserved into a region which cannot be changed by breeding. They are the same for most highly evolved lifeforms.

That being said, many breeders have done a good job in adapting Cannabis to their indoor setups, thus making these strains much less likely to herm under these artificial conditions.

But if these plants are constantly used for breeding, they'll become weak & sickly over time. Thus, breeders cross in landraces/ "more natural" strains to refresh/ revivify their genes but it may also incorporate new unwanted abilities, like the potential to herm more often.
For Cannabis and many other plants, to form both sexes on one plant isnt that bad of a thing. Plants even have developed methods to evade/nullify a self-pollination.

Proper breeding is difficult. In order to do it right you'd need to learn the techniques from books beforeahead, and second, you'd need to get more info about the parent plants from their breeders.

Some breeders even use this knowledge to create seeds which grow good plants, but only in their generation. All offspring though would come out much weaker or "unstable".

Still, I think, for homegrowers its ok to make seeds on your own. Quite some famous strains came to life like this... if you test them outdoors, not much is wasted if things go south... my advise would be to always cross strains that look differently, and are from different sources/places of the earth.
:weed:
Click to expand...
 
Dabbie McDoob

Dabbie McDoob

Well-Known Member
ganga gurl420 said:
Well both are highly experienced...and I do know that stess will induce it. I guess my question is if I make an s1 or f2 from females that dont show pollen sacs....will It eventually with more breeding become less likely to show the trait?
Click to expand...
I re-read this post and saw this comment.
This is my thoughts so obviously PCR would be needed to verify.
Given hermetic genetics are dominant (the plant will adapt to create progeny Jurassic park style) and you make S1 or S2 stock they are very much likely going to create hermetic alleles and be more likely to express dual genitals lol.
I am experimenting now with introducing Land race strains into Selfed gene pools to see if this is enough genetic material to overide selfed genes.
Because lets face it, some of the Selfed plants are incredible specimens.
 
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