The far red thread

[Mildewman]

Hoping for some advice on using my 660 & 730 LEDs ...

Doing a 4x4 SCROG grow, 4 plants (all 50/50 ind/sat hybrids) in Coco. 600w HPS light. I have a 42w 660 LED and 2x 10w 730's. How should i use these led's to improve my buds?

Should i run them both all day from start of 12/12 with 15 mins of just 730 after lights out and go for 14/10 ?

Should i just use the HPS during stretch then add the LED's for rest of bud cycle?

thxinadv

 

[ChrispyCritter]

Don't forget that another benefit of 730 far red at end of the day is if you stay 12/12 flowering, the number of day for flowering is shortened. Or like what's been mentioned a lot also, gradually moving from 12/12 to 14 on and 10 off will help create more yield on the normal number of days flowering (strain dependent of course). Captain obvious here, sorry.

 

[Rocket Soul]

Hoping for some advice on using my 660 & 730 LEDs ...

Doing a 4x4 SCROG grow, 4 plants (all 50/50 ind/sat hybrids) in Coco. 600w HPS light. I have a 42w 660 LED and 2x 10w 730's. How should i use these led's to improve my buds?

Should i run them both all day from start of 12/12 with 15 mins of just 730 after lights out and go for 14/10 ?

Should i just use the HPS during stretch then add the LED's for rest of bud cycle?

thxinadv

15 mins is usually a bit too much. 10w of decent far red leds per m2 is good for 5mins

 

[Mildewman]

Thanks for replies, yes read the post about starting 12/12 / 730, going to 14/10 /730 then finishing back on 12/12. So is my best bet leaving my 660 and 730 LED's on for full duration of daytime for extra frequency bands (and possibly Emerson), separate to the quicksleep 730 stuff?

Also, is it true that you can minimize stretch by using your MH light for the first 2 weeks of 12/12, and can increase stretch (say to open up an overly dense screen) by using 660 and 730 during the stretch time?

 

[Mildewman]

Im still veging under 600w MH at the mo, but i thought i would add my (turned out to be 54w) 660nm LED just for shiggles. Found it was far too focused on one spot, then discovered that all i had to do was pop off the spring steel ring holding the end on to remove the focusing part. Dont mind if it causes stretch, ill call it "filling the screen more quickly"

 

[cobshopgrow]

it could be that the 660nm wont cause you much stretch, its more the far red who do this.
or in contrary, high deep red to far red ratio inhibit stretch.

if youre using a HPS you have lots far red allready in your spectrum.

the high blue amount of a hps helps to minimize the stretch if you want that.

 

[Mullumbimby]

So, after 86 pages of the famous Far Red Thread, is there a consensus on what a grower with up-to-date, high-efficiency white LEDs at 3,000 or 3,500 Kelvin, good climate control and well-adjusted feeding program should add to either:

1. Speed-up his rate of flowering,
2. Increase yield or
3. Improve quality
4. All of the above (we can hope, right?)

 

[Kassiopeija]

the high blue amount of a hps helps to minimize the stretch if you want that

???

 

[Airwalker16]

Have far reds come on 5 mins before main lighting turns off and have then continue to stay on for a remaining 10mins after. With this, you can do 12.5/11.5 or even 13/11(On/Off) lighting schedule for extra photosynthesis time and your plants will still get the 11hrs of true sleep they usually get without far red, on account of it takes about an hour for them to fully go to sleep.

 

[Airwalker16]

it could be that the 660nm wont cause you much stretch, its more the far red who do this.
or in contrary, high deep red to far red ratio inhibit stretch.

if youre using a HPS you have lots far red allready in your spectrum.

the high blue amount of a hps helps to minimize the stretch if you want that.

There's damn near ZERO blue in HPS bruh, Dafuq u mean?

 

[Gond00s]

There's damn near ZERO blue in HPS bruh, Dafuq u mean?

I think he might have meant mh?

 

[cobshopgrow]

exactly

 

[Mullumbimby]

Have far reds come on 5 mins before main lighting turns off and have then continue to stay on for a remaining 10mins after. With this, you can do 12.5/11.5 or even 13/11(On/Off) lighting schedule for extra photosynthesis time and your plants will still get the 11hrs of true sleep they usually get without far red, on account of it takes about an hour for them to fully go to sleep.

Thanks for that - it looks like a straight answer to my question.
Is that really all there is though, 8% more daylight, after 5 years and 86 pages?

 

[Airwalker16]

Thanks for that - it looks like a straight answer to my question.
Is that really all there is though, 8% more daylight, after 5 years and 86 pages?

Some people claim quicker overall growth with a bit more stretch using them for the full 12hrs too.

 

[PSUAGRO.]

Thanks for that - it looks like a straight answer to my question.
Is that really all there is though, 8% more daylight, after 5 years and 86 pages?

You can mess around with it. I've done 14/10 with photo hybrids using fr& mechanical timer , boosted weight in my unscientific runs....

 

[Airwalker16]

You can mess around with it. I've done 14/10 with photo hybrids using fr& mechanical timer , boosted weight in my unscientific runs....

Whoa you went clear to 14on/10off with 15min of far red at lights out?!?

 

[PSUAGRO.]

Whoa you went clear to 14on/10off with 15min of far red at lights out?!?

Yes sir, from seed vs 12/12 noticeable difference ime....... Different cultivars, so take with a grain of salt

 

[Kassiopeija]

So, after 86 pages of the famous Far Red Thread, is there a consensus on what a grower with up-to-date, high-efficiency white LEDs at 3,000 or 3,500 Kelvin, good climate control and well-adjusted feeding program should add to either:

1. Speed-up his rate of flowering,
2. Increase yield or
3. Improve quality
4. All of the above (we can hope, right?)

not sure on 3, for that you'd have to look more into UV.

In the video Bugbee explains FR causes the Emmerson Effect - more efficient light usage, resulting in increased harvest. and stretching.

then there is sleep initiation, which either gives you 1 hour more light or night.

FR on a separate channel is a powerful tool to increase the photosynthetic efficiency of your system, two-fold.

Does anybody know if UV or blue light at good strength could suppress the extra stretching caused by FR?

 

[cobshopgrow]

as far i read the emmerson effect gives diminishing returns after a certain light level (was it 600ppfd?).

UVA or blue should supress the stretch, problem is uv and blue is absorbed easily by the top leaves far red not, that really goes through the leaves.
So basically you need some kind of blue,uv under the canopy also, or, i think as bruce is saying 660nm should work also.

 

[Kassiopeija]

Whoa you went clear to 14on/10off with 15min of far red at lights out?!?

I've flowered under HPS with 14/10 - works.
The HPS has a strong FR endpeak which should send the tent to sleep.

The other lamps that do not initiate sleep, like e.g. MH, loose about an hour or 90 mins and so, only build up the florigen for 11 hours.

How can one dial FR properly in? How much % of electricity should be diverted to FR in either a constant daylight setting or sleep initiation?