Majority Backs ‘Medicare for All’ Replacing Private Plans, if Preferred Providers Stay

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
What UK and Canada do has no bearing on the idiocy running for President on a policy of making people in the US give up health are plans they like in favor of an unknown and hypothetical healthcare system. You Bernie babies aren't much different from US Libertarians who simply believe without the need for facts or proof.

The devil is in the details. Unlike you, most people want those details to be available for examination and debate.
In fact, @ttystikk could fit in well with these assholes. He could show up and proudly proclaim, "I forced my girlfriend to engage in hazardous and unpleasant sex work and took most of her money!" and he would get a standing ovation and a "Free Market General" medal.

Then they would ask him what it is like to have sex with a woman. What street cred!
 

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
@Unclebaldrick

i've been stating my opinion. I've been feeling that your inquisitiveness has been more condescending than curious. It's the same, "because I've lived longer I know better" mentality of senile age seniority.

You enjoyed projecting your rage about other people raging about Rothschilds.

Are you going to compose yourself into greater civility so I can address your perceptions from my perspective or should we just save our time & energy by letting go of our discussion? I'd for sure benefit from not having to read your continued tantrum of passive-aggressiveness.
it's option B, save your time on the Projection Master..he's just here to troll.
 

Bear420

Well-Known Member
I wonder why we can't take 1% 2% or even 3% of the Military Budget for Health Care for all. After all we aren't Primitive and should be able to get by without spending Trillions every single year on things that Kill other Humans.

I surely didn't like George W Bush, But at this time it would be an honor to have hm as our Prez. Over the dote we have now. Trump does not care about anyone but himself. That's a Fact.... The first President in the History of the U.S that thinks we work for him.
Go ahead and keep him in that position and we will all know what it's like to actually have a King. Bow your heads to the New King.
 

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
I wonder why we can't take 1% 2% or even 3% of the Military Budget for Health Care for all. After all we aren't Primitive and should be able to get by without spending Trillions every single year on things that Kill other Humans.

I surely didn't like George W Bush, But at this time it would be an honor to have hm as our Prez. Over the dote we have now. Trump does not care about anyone but himself. That's a Fact.... The first President in the History of the U.S that thinks we work for him.
Go ahead and keep him in that position and we will all know what it's like to actually have a King. Bow your heads to the New King.
because lockhead-martin our nations biggest employer..try to pry that money out of their cold, clenched 1% fists..
 

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
it's option B, save your time on the Projection Master..he's just here to troll.
Here is the translation into ORW: "As I have explained in the half dozen PMs, he is very mean to me. So is everybody else. It sometimes takes me two dozen posts just to get somebody to respond to me. Please be my friend. Most sock puppet crypto-right-wingers have been. I am not very choosy about who I am friends with - RT.com is my favorite news source because I am A Progressive and it totally makes sense that my news comes from a website completely controlled by Putin."
 

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
"WE"? lol Who are "we"? Why was he afraid of a debate? It's a quarter of this economy and 365 million people depend on it. "We" the people demand a debate.

Face it, chump, Bernie didn't include enough details in his healthcare plan for the CBO to perform a firm cost analysis because even your kind would reject his plan when you see the bill that you would pay. There are too many assumptions built into Bernie's claims about his healthcare plan for most but the hopelessly naive to believe.

Bernie hasn't even adequately explain his plan well enough. Only now are those people you love to cite in outdated polls coming around to the fact that Bernie's plan would permanently strip them of the private plan they like. When they do learn about that, support drops to 38%. For good reason too. There are better ways to get everybody the care they need without putting them at risk.

The best path to universal healthcare is to make healthcare affordable for everybody without forcing them out of plans they like: Strengthen the ACA. Return the funding to the ACA that Republicans withheld when they failed to honor the government's commitment to subsidize those who can't afford it. Add the public option so that people can choose Medicare. Make Medicare a great service at a good price.
He thinks he speaks for WE THE PEOPLE, all three of them do.
 

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
The king of trolls. I wouldn't be surprised if he made 4 accounts to build his forum troll battalion!

Trolls are how the ignore button came into existence
Right. I'll give you a chance to redeem yourself.

Why would you prefer to fiat Currency? Why? Please be specific.

You said: "i like the convention of states but that organization has a long journey ahead".
What do you expect a convention of states to do? Why do you think it is a good idea? What long journey do you mean?



You said: i think the debt crisis shouldn't be oversimplified.

Yeah :roll:, I guess we all agree that it shouldn't be. What debt crisis, please explain it? How did we get a debt crisis? Exactly when did it become a crisis? Can you explain what your fiscal policy guidelines are during times of prosperity versus times of financial crisis?

You said: i know that in life there are seasons where reality has to get worse before it can get better. i think Utopian solutions , whether it be capitalism's market utopia or socialist's social utopia are difficult to formulate, equalize & sustain on a long-term basis.

What do you mean? Say something that is actually specific. What utopian solutions are you talking about? How does a utopian solution differ from a functional economic system? What system do you prefer? What needs to get worse before it gets better?



Believe it or not, I consider you a troll. You came in here and said a bunch of things that are typical alt-right talking points like "fiat currency is the problem" and then by your third or fourth point brought the Rothschilds up out of nowhere. I realize that @schuylaar i
s dumb as a post (for example, she wrote you "welcome free thinker" despite the fact that you literally have made no point whatsoever - your posts make less sense than reading the transcript of an extemporaneous Trump speech) and so utterly lonely that she will literally talk to anybody, but you show every indication of a person who has aberrant political beliefs and also a whole lot of evidence that you don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about.

Go ahead and ignore me, I do not care. There are plenty of people here who will take care of the likes of you and you ignoring me will not stop me from making commentary on your shitty, nebulous and, inevitably racist posts. You are an ill-informed dabbler whose foundation rests on some very specious ground in my opinion - prove me wrong.

Oh, and @Padawanbater2, I am still waiting for you to make good on your claim that "these people" attack anybody who makes a point by attacking their person. What points has this guy made? It isn't too hard a question, he's only been here one day. I pointed the fact that he made no points and asked him what he meant. So please, enlighten me - what were these points that I failed to address? (I know this is rhetorical, you are a coward and will not answer.)
 

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
Right. I'll give you a chance to redeem yourself.

Why would you prefer to fiat Currency? Why? Please be specific.

You said: "i like the convention of states but that organization has a long journey ahead".
What do you expect a convention of states to do? Why do you think it is a good idea? What long journey do you mean?



You said: i think the debt crisis shouldn't be oversimplified.

Yeah :roll:, I guess we all agree that it shouldn't be. What debt crisis, please explain it? How did we get a debt crisis? Exactly when did it become a crisis? Can you explain what your fiscal policy guidelines are during times of prosperity versus times of financial crisis?

You said: i know that in life there are seasons where reality has to get worse before it can get better. i think Utopian solutions , whether it be capitalism's market utopia or socialist's social utopia are difficult to formulate, equalize & sustain on a long-term basis.
What do you mean? Say something that is actually specific. What utopian solutions are you talking about? How does a utopian solution differ from a functional economic system? What system do you prefer? What needs to get worse before it gets better?



Believe it or not, I consider you a troll. You came in here and said a bunch of things that are typical alt-right talking points like "fiat currency is the problem" and then by your third or fourth point brought the Rothschilds up out of nowhere. I realize that @schuylaar i
s dumb as a post (for example, she wrote you "welcome free thinker" despite the fact that you literally have made no point whatsoever - your posts make less sense than reading the transcript of an extemporaneous Trump speech) and so utterly lonely that she will literally talk to anybody, but you show every indication of a person who has aberrant political beliefs and also a whole lot of evidence that you don't have the slightest idea of what you are talking about.

Go ahead and ignore me, I do not care. There are plenty of people here who will take care of the likes of you and you ignoring me will not stop me from making commentary on your shitty, nebulous and, inevitably racist posts. You are an ill-informed dabbler whose foundation rests on some very specious ground in my opinion - prove me wrong.

Oh, and @Padawanbater2, I am still waiting for you to make good on your claim that "these people" attack anybody who makes a point by attacking their person. What points has this guy made? It isn't too hard a question, he's only been here one day. I pointed the fact that he made no points and asked him what he meant. So please, enlighten me - what were these points that I failed to address? (I know this is rhetorical, you are a coward and will not answer.)

do you not have employment, MeltMan?
 

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
Bernie didn't include enough details in his healthcare plan for the CBO to perform a firm cost analysis
CBO cost analysis of Medicare for All

"But multipayer systems tend to have higher total spending than single-payer systems for several reasons: Single-payer systems typically have stronger purchasing power than multipayer systems to achieve lower prices. As a result, payment rates under multipayer systems tend to be higher. Control of health care spending in such systems could be enhanced by adopting an all-payer rate-setting system. Under such a system, all insurers typically pay providers using the same payment method and price for each service.."
because even your kind would reject his plan when you see the bill that you would pay.
I'd happily pay more in taxes to be able to provide healthcare to every American citizen in this country. Because the reality is, Americans today already pay a high private tax to see their doctor called a copay, they're taxed further with their deductible, only getting the healthcare they need after they pay a certain amount first. Not to mention the monthly premium Americans pay just to be told they can't receive coverage for lung cancer because they've had skin cancer 15 years previously, and skin cancer is a "preexisting condition". Only for the majority of bankruptcies in America to be had because people couldn't pay their medical bills..

All of this to prop up insurance companies who rely on the profit motive to deny their sick and dying customers they promised to provide coverage for at the acceptance of every single one of the checks they received any unforeseeable ailments they might experience.

There are too many assumptions built into Bernie's claims about his healthcare plan for most but the hopelessly naive to believe.
Bernie hasn't even adequately explain his plan well enough. Only now are those people you love to cite in outdated polls coming around to the fact that Bernie's plan would permanently strip them of the private plan they like. When they do learn about that, support drops to 38%.
According to the Morning Consult poll in the OP, the overwhelming majority of Democrats support phasing out private insurance if they can keep the same doctors. The majority of Independents support it. The only minority comes from Republicans. Are you suggesting the Democratic party should ignore what their own Democratic base overwhelmingly supports to placate Republican voters? Don't you think that would turn off a lot of Democratic voters just like it did in 2016 when Hillary Clinton used the exact same tactic?
The best path to universal healthcare is to make healthcare affordable for everybody without forcing them out of plans they like
How do you make healthcare affordable for everyone under a for profit rapacious system that cuts ~20% on average?
 

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
CBO cost analysis of Medicare for All

"But multipayer systems tend to have higher total spending than single-payer systems for several reasons: Single-payer systems typically have stronger purchasing power than multipayer systems to achieve lower prices. As a result, payment rates under multipayer systems tend to be higher. Control of health care spending in such systems could be enhanced by adopting an all-payer rate-setting system. Under such a system, all insurers typically pay providers using the same payment method and price for each service.."

I'd happily pay more in taxes to be able to provide healthcare to every American citizen in this country. Because the reality is, Americans today already pay a high private tax to see their doctor called a copay, they're taxed further with their deductible, only getting the healthcare they need after they pay a certain amount first. Not to mention the monthly premium Americans pay just to be told they can't receive coverage for lung cancer because they've had skin cancer 15 years previously, and skin cancer is a "preexisting condition". Only for the majority of bankruptcies in America to be had because people couldn't pay their medical bills..

All of this to prop up insurance companies who rely on the profit motive to deny their sick and dying customers they promised to provide coverage for at the acceptance of every single one of the checks they received any unforeseeable ailments they might experience.



According to the Morning Consult poll in the OP, the overwhelming majority of Democrats support phasing out private insurance if they can keep the same doctors. The majority of Independents support it. The only minority comes from Republicans. Are you suggesting the Democratic party should ignore what their own Democratic base overwhelmingly supports to placate Republican voters? Don't you think that would turn off a lot of Democratic voters just like it did in 2016 when Hillary Clinton used the exact same tactic?

How do you make healthcare affordable for everyone under a for profit rapacious system that cuts ~20% on average?
Hi buddy! Hey, remember the other day when you came to the defense of that guy and said that I can't address the "issues" he brought up so I have to attack him personally? I invited you to enumerate the issues he brought up but I have heard nothing from you. How odd.

Please list three of the issues he brought up. It should be easy unless he actually brought no issues up and you were just taking the opportunity to show how intellectually dishonest you are.

Still waiting.
 

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
CBO cost analysis of Medicare for All

"But multipayer systems tend to have higher total spending than single-payer systems for several reasons: Single-payer systems typically have stronger purchasing power than multipayer systems to achieve lower prices. As a result, payment rates under multipayer systems tend to be higher. Control of health care spending in such systems could be enhanced by adopting an all-payer rate-setting system. Under such a system, all insurers typically pay providers using the same payment method and price for each service.."

I'd happily pay more in taxes to be able to provide healthcare to every American citizen in this country. Because the reality is, Americans today already pay a high private tax to see their doctor called a copay, they're taxed further with their deductible, only getting the healthcare they need after they pay a certain amount first. Not to mention the monthly premium Americans pay just to be told they can't receive coverage for lung cancer because they've had skin cancer 15 years previously, and skin cancer is a "preexisting condition". Only for the majority of bankruptcies in America to be had because people couldn't pay their medical bills..

All of this to prop up insurance companies who rely on the profit motive to deny their sick and dying customers they promised to provide coverage for at the acceptance of every single one of the checks they received any unforeseeable ailments they might experience.



According to the Morning Consult poll in the OP, the overwhelming majority of Democrats support phasing out private insurance if they can keep the same doctors. The majority of Independents support it. The only minority comes from Republicans. Are you suggesting the Democratic party should ignore what their own Democratic base overwhelmingly supports to placate Republican voters? Don't you think that would turn off a lot of Democratic voters just like it did in 2016 when Hillary Clinton used the exact same tactic?

How do you make healthcare affordable for everyone under a for profit rapacious system that cuts ~20% on average?
You keep trying to obfuscate instead.

I'll just reply to your first point. The CBO could not arrive at a cost estimate for Bernie's plan because it didn't contain enough detail to do so. If you read the report it says just that. Bernie left that information out because it would have created too much resistance, or as he says "confusion". Bernie is a lying wannabe dictator.
 

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
You keep trying to obfuscate instead.

I'll just reply to your first point. The CBO could not arrive at a cost estimate for Bernie's plan because it didn't contain enough detail to do so. If you read the report it says just that. Bernie left that information out because it would have created too much resistance, or as he says "confusion". Bernie is a lying wannabe dictator.
We already know what it will cost to implement based on the dozen or so other modern nations that have already implemented it. We know we spend twice as much and still fail to cover 30 million Americans while other countries spend half as much and cover everyone, at better results
 

Unclebaldrick

Well-Known Member
We already know what it will cost to implement based on the dozen or so other modern nations that have already implemented it. We know we spend twice as much and still fail to cover 30 million Americans while other countries spend half as much and cover everyone, at better results
Hi buddy! Hey, remember the other day when you came to the defense of that guy and said that I can't address the "issues" he brought up so I have to attack him personally? I invited you to enumerate the issues he brought up but I have heard nothing from you. How odd.

Please list three of the issues he brought up. It should be easy unless he actually brought no issues up and you were just taking the opportunity to show how intellectually dishonest you are.

Still waiting.

Will aligning with the alt-right be an official Progressive policy?
 
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