Lower water temps without chiller?

L

Lockem

Active Member
Hey, just started my first DWC grow and all is going well. I'm a bit concerned about my water temps once my plants mature from sproutlings though.

My setup:

2 x QB 288 (260W, running at 50%)
2.5' x 2.5' x 6' grow tent
2 x 5 - gallon bubble buckets with 2 large airstones each
250 GPH air pump
RO Water

Room temp: 72F
RH: 50% (getting a humidifier)
Water temp: 71 - 73F

Should I be concerned about my temps rising once roots start to reach the water and I turn my lights up? I just covered my lids with reflective tape which helped a bit. Is it worth wrapping the bucket itself in reflective insulation, or are there any other non-chiller methods to reduce water temps aside from frozen water bottles?

If a chiller is my best bet, can someone recommend a good value one for my setup?

Thanks!
 
Way2-High

Way2-High

Well-Known Member
I’m not a hydro guy but I can tell you how to make a cheap chiller. Get a old bar fridge and some hose or copper pipe and coil it inside the fridge. Connect a pump and let her circulate the water from your rez, should work pretty well. I used a setup like that on a cold water aquarium I had years ago and it worked well and cost me not a penny as I had the materials laying around already.
Hope that helps
 
GBAUTO

GBAUTO

Well-Known Member
Grown hydro for the past 3 years. Because you are dealing with a relatively small volume of water in the bucket, it's impractical to put frozen bottles in there. My runs ALWAYS have the rez temps in the 70's. Would I see some small benefit in growth using a chiller? Perhaps, but my main concern is root rot-pythium. That's why I use beneficial microbes like Hydroguard or GFF to inhibit pythium from colonizing. Like I mentioned, I've been using this method from the start and zero issues.
Keeping the container light proof helps to keep algae from growing
 
L

Lockem

Active Member
GBAUTO said:
Grown hydro for the past 3 years. Because you are dealing with a relatively small volume of water in the bucket, it's impractical to put frozen bottles in there. My runs ALWAYS have the rez temps in the 70's. Would I see some small benefit in growth using a chiller? Perhaps, but my main concern is root rot-pythium. That's why I use beneficial microbes like Hydroguard or GFF to inhibit pythium from colonizing. Like I mentioned, I've been using this method from the start and zero issues.
Keeping the container light proof helps to keep algae from growing
Click to expand...
Hydroguard and other fungicides seem to be near impossible to get at a decent price here in Canada, that's why I'm so concerned moving forward.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Way2-High said:
I’m not a hydro guy but I can tell you how to make a cheap chiller. Get a old bar fridge and some hose or copper pipe and coil it inside the fridge. Connect a pump and let her circulate the water from your rez, should work pretty well. I used a setup like that on a cold water aquarium I had years ago and it worked well and cost me not a penny as I had the materials laying around already.
Hope that helps
Click to expand...
No. That's a waste of electricity.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Lockem said:
Hey, just started my first DWC grow and all is going well. I'm a bit concerned about my water temps once my plants mature from sproutlings though.

My setup:

2 x QB 288 (260W, running at 50%)
2.5' x 2.5' x 6' grow tent
2 x 5 - gallon bubble buckets with 2 large airstones each
250 GPH air pump
RO Water

Room temp: 72F
RH: 50% (getting a humidifier)
Water temp: 71 - 73F

Should I be concerned about my temps rising once roots start to reach the water and I turn my lights up? I just covered my lids with reflective tape which helped a bit. Is it worth wrapping the bucket itself in reflective insulation, or are there any other non-chiller methods to reduce water temps aside from frozen water bottles?

If a chiller is my best bet, can someone recommend a good value one for my setup?

Thanks!
Click to expand...
First, your room is cold. For optimal growth under LED lighting, you need to be up near 30C, that's 85F. The reason comes down to the lack of infrared coming from the lighting so the plants need the heat to transpire properly.

Second, I always had shit luck with air stones. I redesigned my own RDWC to use waterfalls and my pythium problems vanished.

Waterfalls can be done many ways but the essential component is to be sure that water falls at least a few inches from your outlet into the water, churning the res and breaking surface tension. This has several benefits including eliminating any skin on top of the water, aeration and it encourages some evaporation which cools the water. A small pump is fine as long as it flows continuously.

When I went to waterfalls my root health improved and I never worried about root root issues again. No chiller required!

Oh, and listening to the happy gurgle of waterfalls is so soothing lol

Hope that helps!
 
L

Lockem

Active Member
ttystikk said:
First, your room is cold. For optimal growth under LED lighting, you need to be up near 30C, that's 85F. The reason comes down to the lack of infrared coming from the lighting so the plants need the heat to transpire properly.

Second, I always had shit luck with air stones. I redesigned my own RDWC to use waterfalls and my pythium problems vanished.

Waterfalls can be done many ways but the essential component is to be sure that water falls at least a few inches from your outlet into the water, churning the res and breaking surface tension. This has several benefits including eliminating any skin on top of the water, aeration and it encourages some evaporation which cools the water. A small pump is fine as long as it flows continuously.

When I went to waterfalls my root health improved and I never worried about root root issues again. No chiller required!

Oh, and listening to the happy gurgle of waterfalls is so soothing lol

Hope that helps!
Click to expand...
That makes sense about the temps... hadn't heard that before. I like the waterfall idea but I'm not running a res right now (it's the first thing I'm doing for next grow)... I guess that actually makes running a chiller impractical also. Can I make PH'd ice cubes or something? lol... I'd really like to try and drop my water temps by ~5F
 
Airwalker16

Airwalker16

Well-Known Member
Lockem said:
That makes sense about the temps... hadn't heard that before. I like the waterfall idea but I'm not running a res right now (it's the first thing I'm doing for next grow)... I guess that actually makes running a chiller impractical also. Can I make PH'd ice cubes or something? lol... I'd really like to try and drop my water temps by ~5F
Click to expand...
If you want a 5* drop, you'll need a chiller and you'll need to connect both buckets together. Simple enough to do.
Best chiller deal is on amazon for a 1/10HP active aqua. That's a chiller big enough for 40-60 gallons so plenty for you.
 
GBAUTO

GBAUTO

Well-Known Member
Buckets are a PITA for anything other than running a bubbler. Trying to rig up a recirc system is a failure/leak waiting to happen. If your set on using individual containers, I'd stick with a tote or some other container with flat sides.
 
Airwalker16

Airwalker16

Well-Known Member
GBAUTO said:
Buckets are a PITA for anything other than running a bubbler. Trying to rig up a recirc system is a failure/leak waiting to happen. If your set on using individual containers, I'd stick with a tote or some other container with flat sides.
Click to expand...
I gotta disagree with Ya. Uniseals are made for curved surfaces. Although square pails and bulkheads are better.
 
A

Aqua Man

Well-Known Member
GBAUTO said:
Grown hydro for the past 3 years. Because you are dealing with a relatively small volume of water in the bucket, it's impractical to put frozen bottles in there. My runs ALWAYS have the rez temps in the 70's. Would I see some small benefit in growth using a chiller? Perhaps, but my main concern is root rot-pythium. That's why I use beneficial microbes like Hydroguard or GFF to inhibit pythium from colonizing. Like I mentioned, I've been using this method from the start and zero issues.
Keeping the container light proof helps to keep algae from growing
Click to expand...
Without the consideration of pythium you will see faster growth from temps around 77F (Optimal If i am remembering correctly and i'm not a spring chicken). Bacteria also reproduce extremely well around this temp. One more reason hydrogaurd is super beneficial with temps in the 70's.
Lockem said:
Hydroguard and other fungicides seem to be near impossible to get at a decent price here in Canada, that's why I'm so concerned moving forward.
Click to expand...
I feel your pain i ordered mine from amazon. One thing most hydro growers don't yet make a priority is once you have inoculated, is keeping that colony thriving. Really hydrogaurd can be a 1 time investment. I won't go on about it here but in the next month or so I will make a write up on how i do it. There many ways to skin a cat but if you want more info on it just PM me until then.
ttystikk said:
First, your room is cold. For optimal growth under LED lighting, you need to be up near 30C, that's 85F. The reason comes down to the lack of infrared coming from the lighting so the plants need the heat to transpire properly.

Second, I always had shit luck with air stones. I redesigned my own RDWC to use waterfalls and my pythium problems vanished.

Waterfalls can be done many ways but the essential component is to be sure that water falls at least a few inches from your outlet into the water, churning the res and breaking surface tension. This has several benefits including eliminating any skin on top of the water, aeration and it encourages some evaporation which cools the water. A small pump is fine as long as it flows continuously.

When I went to waterfalls my root health improved and I never worried about root root issues again. No chiller required!

Oh, and listening to the happy gurgle of waterfalls is so soothing lol

Hope that helps!
Click to expand...
Good advice on the temp. 25-30C or 75-85F the higher you go the more you want to keep an eye on humidity. I am a big believer in VPD (vapor pressure deficit).

You know my stance on waterfalls and airstones... I think both work well.
Airwalker16 said:
If you want a 5* drop, you'll need a chiller and you'll need to connect both buckets together. Simple enough to do.
Best chiller deal is on amazon for a 1/10HP active aqua. That's a chiller big enough for 40-60 gallons so plenty for you.
Click to expand...
I'm with you on this even though higher temps yeild a little better growth i won't risk running water temps over 70.
Renfro said:
You may wanna stick an ICE Probe in each bucket.

https://www.amazon.com/IceProbe-Thermoelectric-Aquarium-Chiller/dp/B001JSVLBO

You could put them on an inkbird temp controller if they get the water too cool.
Click to expand...
I have done this for small project air temps. I have a duel unit that one side doesn't work. I think its 90W each I could test the water temp drop in a 5 gal. If the OP is interested but he would also need a controller as you pointed out and a DC power supply. Peltier's are much less efficient than compressor's and give off more heat than cooling if that makes sense but in such a small application its feasible
 
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A

Aqua Man

Well-Known Member
Airwalker16 said:
I gotta disagree with Ya. Uniseals are made for curved surfaces. Although square pails and bulkheads are better.
Click to expand...
I have a personal grudge against unileaks so my opinion is bias. Bulk heads may cost more but its absolutely worth it. They also work on 5gal buckets, I'm running them right now and never had an issue. (my experience only)

I agree with @GBAUTO if you are making new purchases totes all the way. If you already have buckets then bulkheads (again this is my own bias opinion)
 
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ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Aqua Man said:
I have a personal grudge against unileaks so my opinion is bias. Bulk heads may cost more but its absolutely worth it. They also work on 5gal buckets, I'm running them right now and never had an issue. (my experience only)

I agree with @GBAUTO if you are making new purchases totes all the way. If you already have buckets then bulkheads (again this is my own bias opinion)
Click to expand...
I share your animosity towards uniseals!

I have used bulkhead fittings for years with excellent results, improved versatility and reconfigurability on par with my Lego set.
 
L

Lockem

Active Member
Going to insulate my buckets and see how much temps drop, and look into dropping the money on some hydroguard. I'm definitely converting to RDWC with a reservoir for next grow and grabbing a chiller.
 
rkymtnman

rkymtnman

Well-Known Member
Lockem said:
Hydroguard and other fungicides seem to be near impossible to get at a decent price here in Canada, that's why I'm so concerned moving forward.
Click to expand...
grab a bag of HTH pool shock and a scale accurate to 0.01 grams and run a sterile reservoir.
 
OldMedUser

OldMedUser

Well-Known Member
I just gave this as a reply to someone asking how I made my DIY chiller from an old water cooler. How timely.

Copy/paste and two birds with one stone so to say. :)

Pretty simple really. Just a fountain pump in the rez/tub pumping the nutes thru about 15' of 3/8" tubing up to the cooling tank with about 10-12' of the tubing coiled up inside then running back to the rez. I hot-glued plastic window screen around the inlet area of the pump to keep roots out of it and will wrap the clear tubing I used with electrical tape to keep light out as algae grew in the exposed lines from the tub to the tank. Filled the tank with antifreeze instead of water to slow evaporation and keep it from freezing up. Had to use a timer on the cooler so it only ran 15min on, 15 off during the daytime then only 15 min on each hour after light's out.

I had all the tubing and got the cooler for free so just had to pay for the fountain pump which was $14 or so. Might need a suck on the outlet end like when siphoning gas to get it going then it works fine. Really small pump tho. That pump has to run continuously or the nutes would freeze in the tubing that was touching the bottom of the cooler tank.

I drilled holes in the front of the unit for the tubing but could have rigged something at the back to hold them then when it's not being used and sitting in the corner it would be more stealthy.

There were plastic parts inside that I took out first. I was thinking of using 1/2" but had lots of 3/8" and the fitting that comes with the pump can use either but 1/2" is too thick to coil up well in the tank. Some sort of frame to separate the coils would make it work even better as would agitation like an airstone or something to stir it would also increase efficiency. Was more than enough to chill an insulated Rubbermaid tub holding 50L to 65-68F. I'm sure it could do a rez for a decent sized RDWC setup if everything is insulated. I just used white wall insulation and and baling wire but some silver bubble wrap would work and look a lot better too.





Added insulation around the cooler tank too.


Very ghetto but effective. :D


I was going to let you know what capacity fountain pumps I had but damned if I can find them. If doing a larger rez I'd recommend a small pond pump and more tubing for more cooling capacity.

Hope that helped!

:peace:
 
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