Constant nute burn @ Low EC

SMT69

Well-Known Member
Had same probs using rockwool, its btch to work with.... it just stays so saturated and cuts off oxygen, the ideal moisture point in it is very diff to maintain.
I've since bypassed rockwool, just sprout with papertowel - then straight to hydroton ....way easier...gl




3 up 3 on the way...backfill as they grow
 

shawnery

Well-Known Member
Good point about rockwool. I can't be sure it's not my fault but no matter how low the water level was my rockwool was soaked. I even put the rockwool at the top of a 5" net cup surrounded by hydroton.

I just built a little aero cloner and destroyed my plants in hopes of saving the investment.

I know it doesn't help now but you could easily do the same system with no medium at all with a collar and then once you get roots you could drop hydroton in there. This is what I'm currently hoping fixes my root rot issue.
 
Goddamn, I can't believe that I specified everything except the lights that I'm using. I'm vegging with a 600w MH and flowering with a 600w HPS. The light is roughly 18 inches from the plants.
 
Had same probs using rockwool, its btch to work with.... it just stays so saturated and cuts off oxygen, the ideal moisture point in it is very diff to maintain.
I've since bypassed rockwool, just sprout with papertowel - then straight to hydroton ....way easier...gl




3 up 3 on the way...backfill as they grow
Word. I've been told to avoid rockwool. I don't like it one bit. It seems to cause some arbitrary pH fluctuations too. It was just the only "starter" medium available in my area and I was a bit skeptical about planting straight in hydroton (had fears of the seedling slipping through or something).
 
Also, they're not drinking much at all at the moment since they're so young so the EC remains fairly stable. Hasn't really decreased much at all. So, naturally, I never assumed that the amount of light would be a problem.
 

shawnery

Well-Known Member
I you sure about the water loss? Just asking because they could be drinking lots of water and nutes and lots for those babies has to be pretty relative.

I'm not saying that's what it is just asking the question
 

70's natureboy

Well-Known Member
Isn't that way to much light for those babies?
In my experience flourescent lights out perform all other lights in the first 8-10 inches of growth. I can see that high nitrogen fertilizer being an issue with light feeding plants. Some strains may like it and others may not.
 

shawnery

Well-Known Member
I just looked it up and your roughly running about 60,000 lumens, is that right? The info stated at the closest they should be 18" and that's with larger acclimated plants I assume? I agree with florescent lighting at this moment.

Maybe you can move them higher or at the very least move them out of its direct light. You get get a lumen meter for your phone to get an idea. I would think no more than 20,000 lumens at max?
 

shawnery

Well-Known Member
What water temp are you running max in your cloner? Starting to hit 72 which with constant hth pool shock added should be fine but it's getting up there?
 
I you sure about the water loss? Just asking because they could be drinking lots of water and nutes and lots for those babies has to be pretty relative.

I'm not saying that's what it is just asking the question
Absolutely sure yeah. They're not drinking much at all yet. The water level isn't visibly subsiding.


What water temp are you running max in your cloner? Starting to hit 72 which with constant hth pool shock added should be fine but it's getting up there?
The water temp usually remains fairly constant at 70-72.


I just looked it up and your roughly running about 60,000 lumens, is that right? The info stated at the closest they should be 18" and that's with larger acclimated plants I assume? I agree with florescent lighting at this moment.

Maybe you can move them higher or at the very least move them out of its direct light. You get get a lumen meter for your phone to get an idea. I would think no more than 20,000 lumens at max?
I have since moved the light a bit further away just to decrease the amount of heat at the root space, below the covers of the totes. Will gradually lower it while they grow bigger.
 
I'm honestly still confused. I've gotten recommendations everywhere that seedlings of 8-10 days old can get at LEAST 250ppm of nutes and I'm only feeding them 200ppm yet they still show signs of burn and deforming. Hell, I've even heard of people successfully feeding their seedlings 400ppm of nutes without any hassles. If it IS the rockwool cubes then I'm stumped. I'm aware that they're iffy when it comes to pH but why would that cause nute burn?
 

TacoMac

Well-Known Member
I'm honestly still confused. I've gotten recommendations everywhere that seedlings of 8-10 days old can get at LEAST 250ppm of nutes and I'm only feeding them 200ppm yet they still show signs of burn and deforming. Hell, I've even heard of people successfully feeding their seedlings 400ppm of nutes without any hassles. If it IS the rockwool cubes then I'm stumped. I'm aware that they're iffy when it comes to pH but why would that cause nute burn?
You have to realize the amount of pure bullshit people post and take it with a grain of salt.

Somebody having a good grow using 180 ppm will get insulted by some asshat claiming to do much better because he uses 400 ppm.

Your plants dictate what they need, not an internet forum. Always err on the side of caution. Start at the lowest recommended dosage for whatever brand nutrient you're using first and keep it steady for a while.

The first grows are always a learning experience, especially in hydroponics because the least little thing can really have an immediate effect on your plants, unlike soil grows where the soil can help mitigate a lot of screw ups.

Do what YOUR grow needs, not what somebody else is doing.
 
You have to realize the amount of pure bullshit people post and take it with a grain of salt.

Somebody having a good grow using 180 ppm will get insulted by some asshat claiming to do much better because he uses 400 ppm.

Your plants dictate what they need, not an internet forum. Always err on the side of caution. Start at the lowest recommended dosage for whatever brand nutrient you're using first and keep it steady for a while.

The first grows are always a learning experience, especially in hydroponics because the least little thing can really have an immediate effect on your plants, unlike soil grows where the soil can help mitigate a lot of screw ups.

Do what YOUR grow needs, not what somebody else is doing.
Thanks for your input man. I will utilize the advice you've given me. Do you recommend I flush the res and set it at a lower ppm now or should I just leave it and let them acclimate?
 

TacoMac

Well-Known Member
Thanks for your input man. I will utilize the advice you've given me. Do you recommend I flush the res and set it at a lower ppm now or should I just leave it and let them acclimate?
I'd leave it for now and see what happens. You should be writing all this stuff down in a journal (or typing it in one, whatever). You don't want to guess at cause and effect, you want to know. Every single time you make any change, record it, and post results each day over a week and see the results. Examples:

October 7 - signs of what appears to be nutrient burn. Raised lighting 5 inches, placed white craft paper on top of reservoirs to cut down on heat.
October 8 - no visible change
October 9 - plants 2 and 5 looking better. No visible change in other plants.
October 10 - all plants looking better, greener and more perky.

Like that.

After about 4 or 5 grows doing this, you'll train yourself on cause and effect, what works best for you, the systems you're using and the plants you're growing. By the 5th into the 6th grows and beyond, you'll pretty much know everything by simply looking and how to react. It'll become 2nd nature to you.

What's more, after that, you can run multiple grows and try new things; you keep one grow on the tried and true path and maybe experiment with another small grow off to the side with more extreme tactics to increase yields, flavor, and more. Those you'll keep a running journal on as well to see your success and failures.

It's a science, man. Treat it like one.
 

70's natureboy

Well-Known Member
It's not the rockwool because they already survived that. I used to have a little trouble rooting clones in rockwool and went away from it a long time ago. I'm not familiar with your nutes but it is higher in N than anything I have ever tried. I would suspect that would cause nute burn at a low EC..
 

shawnery

Well-Known Member
I don't know about it not being the rockwool. Do you check the water level in your rockwool at all? It's very easy with rockwool in these situations to overwater a plant. If it is staying overwatered then you could be drowning them and even causing an environment in which root or crown issues could happen.

I just removed my root rotted girls from my system and the rockwool was soaked and still were soaked 3 days later sitting out in the open.
 

grilledcheese101

Well-Known Member
This is why i start in trays with domes and a seedling mat, pro mix and some myco, 48 hrs they pop. Then they stay for 5 days and go into .5 gal pots 2/3 promix organik 1/3 coco, myco, bokashi, worm castings. Done. Water with tap water for 2-3 weeks no nutes, tds, ec, ph. Fuck it all just confuses newer growers when you dont need any of it lol.
 

grilledcheese101

Well-Known Member
Your npk values throw off your ph. Then u adjust your ph, in turn throwing off whatever npk u thought you had. That ph up and down is a viscious circle lol. Imo those plants are too small tp be micro managing like that. Looks really stessfull.
 
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