Colo MMJ
Well-Known Member
Meanwell drivers supposedly has a lower end brand sort of like Toyota-Lexus, Nissan-Infiniti etc. I forget the name but they are about 35% cheaper.
DIY with Quantum Boards
- Thread starter robincnn
- Start date
Frank Nitty
Well-Known Member
Exactly!!! What we all care about is the end result, right? At least I do...
Colo MMJ
Well-Known Member
FYI - I am running a HLG-600-H V2 - side by side with a 1000 watt SE Hydrofarm reflector with a digital ballast.
HLG suggests that this fixture is between 1000 watt SE and DE. The light has only been running 5 nights but it is very impressive. It is using almost half the power and it runs cool as a cucumber.
The cola stacking over the past 5 nights is really impressive because I take new photo each night from the same exact spot. I may post some pics. The only negative is my boy running them did not defoliate before going into flower like he should have done.
I feel confident the HLG 600-H V2 can easily take on 1000 watt SE HPS. The lower energy use and cool running temps are awesome.
You may claim I am pushing bro science but I have worked with 1000 Watt HPS SE enough to know what I am looking at and what is going on.
CCCmints
Well-Known Member
It is bro science man, obviously. Are you saying you started using the HLG light in the middle of flower? And its been 5 days? You're going to learn what exactly with this 'experiment'?
It seems you really don't know what you're doing at all just based on this post alone...
pop22
Well-Known Member
Numbers taken in a controlled environment do not necessarily translate to results in a real world situation. Ignoring the IR produced by HPS doesn't make it go away. Try dropping that light down to 12" above a canopy. i can do it with my QB based light. . Next according to science, running much more than 1200 uMols is just overkill, its like trying to put 6 gallons of gas in a 5 gallon tank. also, if your not running CO2, a PPF over 800 is at the point of diminishing returns, at 1000ppf you may even see negative effects as the plant can't process that much light without more CO2 and begins using light avoidance/redirecting to reduce the detrimental affects.
Numbers are interesting. Real world results, also speak for themselves. even average growers are hitting 1.5 gpw, with many top growers hitting 2.0 and higher.
Ok, drum roll please............ waiting for the HPS guys to tell me how they regularly pull 2+ grams per watt. Yeah right. Funny, EVERY time I've heard that I say pics please, prove it. NOT ONE ever has. The best I've seen in a forum was 1.2 GPW which is very respectable certainly. But then you have people like Growmau5 who hit 1.86 on his first grow with a DIY LED based light. And proved it.
There is a lot more to an indoor garden than numbers spouted for light sources. A graph doesn't grow your buds. Its the entire garden design, medium, genetics, lighting, nutrients, air quality, RH, PH, reflectivity of the space, and the grower's ability to read his/her plants. You, can put 500 horsepower engine in a VW beetle and you still won't beat a BMW with 200 horsepower, its not designed for that.
Even Gavita has seen the writing on the wall, they are selling off or have already sold, their HPS division to concentrate on LED. LED hasn't taken over the commercial market quite yet, but it is finally making inroads. I don't blame those guys for being cautious, they got burned by the bullshit of the early LED garden lights. But there are large scale ops using LED and other converting in stages.
For me, I reduced my 1800 watts of HPS to 950 watts of LED and still have the same and often better results. And the buds are better too!
I'm not knocking HPS, its been a fine tool and ones that really sparked the indoor growing phenomenon. DE etc, are just the last gasps of a dying industrty. They'll never eliminate the IR and they'll never match the efficiency. Efficiency is really something everyone should be concerned with, when you have states like CA, which tells yoo you must grow your legal weed indoors, then bitches about how much power potheads are using to grow their weed. Mark my words, they are going to eventually meter your growroom and charge you extra for your "wasteful" practices.......
And for those that think HLG lights are expensive, to get an equal or better light you'd need to buy Fluence or similar high end light if your comparing to and other commercial tech. DIY QB lights are a bargin IMO. A COB light in the end will cost as much or more, unless you use low end cobs like the Citi 1212 etc, and even then, your only saving money on the cobs. My 4 board QB light weighs only a few pounds, probably less than 5! How much does a 16 COB light weigh? How much to build? How much work to assemble? To wire? If you can't figure out how to wire 2-4 QB boards, how are you going to manage 16 cobs?
And so now, you can buy and number of copycat boards. Have at it!
Lastly, you are all forgetting how these guys started. They didn't borrow 10 million dollars and build a factory. They started like us in their homes and basements, pouring their limited funds into R&D, spent months designing the best chip layout, choosing a board that met their needs and quality requirements, figuring out what chips to use. I believe, though on this I could be wrong, they built the first board to use these mid power chips.
Patents. Did they? Probably not, you have NO idea how expensive and complicated that process is. Its a shame really because any lowlife theif and make an exact copy, or more likely, use lower quality parts and call it a QB.
I for one know fairly well what these guys put into designing and building these boards. I'm even willing to bet they are only now making a profit. How fast have the borads sold out? Why was stock so limited? THEY DID THIS ON A BUDGET. Poured probably all their income into more product. You know I'm right, you can tell by their posting about how many boards were ordered in the early days. These guys deserve respect. They gave US first crack at their product and gave us good proices too. Yes prices went up, but they said it would have to. Don't they deserve after all this time to make some money on their product?
As I've said, i KNOW what I'm buying when I order from these guys. I've no idea what I'm getting when I buy from Alibaba sources. I use to run a computer business. I remember clearly the response I got when I called a Chinese supplier about a product: "Sure Sure, you get best price" then he hung up....Needless to say, that ended our business with them!
Numbers are interesting. Real world results, also speak for themselves. even average growers are hitting 1.5 gpw, with many top growers hitting 2.0 and higher.
Ok, drum roll please............ waiting for the HPS guys to tell me how they regularly pull 2+ grams per watt. Yeah right. Funny, EVERY time I've heard that I say pics please, prove it. NOT ONE ever has. The best I've seen in a forum was 1.2 GPW which is very respectable certainly. But then you have people like Growmau5 who hit 1.86 on his first grow with a DIY LED based light. And proved it.
There is a lot more to an indoor garden than numbers spouted for light sources. A graph doesn't grow your buds. Its the entire garden design, medium, genetics, lighting, nutrients, air quality, RH, PH, reflectivity of the space, and the grower's ability to read his/her plants. You, can put 500 horsepower engine in a VW beetle and you still won't beat a BMW with 200 horsepower, its not designed for that.
Even Gavita has seen the writing on the wall, they are selling off or have already sold, their HPS division to concentrate on LED. LED hasn't taken over the commercial market quite yet, but it is finally making inroads. I don't blame those guys for being cautious, they got burned by the bullshit of the early LED garden lights. But there are large scale ops using LED and other converting in stages.
For me, I reduced my 1800 watts of HPS to 950 watts of LED and still have the same and often better results. And the buds are better too!
I'm not knocking HPS, its been a fine tool and ones that really sparked the indoor growing phenomenon. DE etc, are just the last gasps of a dying industrty. They'll never eliminate the IR and they'll never match the efficiency. Efficiency is really something everyone should be concerned with, when you have states like CA, which tells yoo you must grow your legal weed indoors, then bitches about how much power potheads are using to grow their weed. Mark my words, they are going to eventually meter your growroom and charge you extra for your "wasteful" practices.......
And for those that think HLG lights are expensive, to get an equal or better light you'd need to buy Fluence or similar high end light if your comparing to and other commercial tech. DIY QB lights are a bargin IMO. A COB light in the end will cost as much or more, unless you use low end cobs like the Citi 1212 etc, and even then, your only saving money on the cobs. My 4 board QB light weighs only a few pounds, probably less than 5! How much does a 16 COB light weigh? How much to build? How much work to assemble? To wire? If you can't figure out how to wire 2-4 QB boards, how are you going to manage 16 cobs?
And so now, you can buy and number of copycat boards. Have at it!
Lastly, you are all forgetting how these guys started. They didn't borrow 10 million dollars and build a factory. They started like us in their homes and basements, pouring their limited funds into R&D, spent months designing the best chip layout, choosing a board that met their needs and quality requirements, figuring out what chips to use. I believe, though on this I could be wrong, they built the first board to use these mid power chips.
Patents. Did they? Probably not, you have NO idea how expensive and complicated that process is. Its a shame really because any lowlife theif and make an exact copy, or more likely, use lower quality parts and call it a QB.
I for one know fairly well what these guys put into designing and building these boards. I'm even willing to bet they are only now making a profit. How fast have the borads sold out? Why was stock so limited? THEY DID THIS ON A BUDGET. Poured probably all their income into more product. You know I'm right, you can tell by their posting about how many boards were ordered in the early days. These guys deserve respect. They gave US first crack at their product and gave us good proices too. Yes prices went up, but they said it would have to. Don't they deserve after all this time to make some money on their product?
As I've said, i KNOW what I'm buying when I order from these guys. I've no idea what I'm getting when I buy from Alibaba sources. I use to run a computer business. I remember clearly the response I got when I called a Chinese supplier about a product: "Sure Sure, you get best price" then he hung up....Needless to say, that ended our business with them!
Colo MMJ
Well-Known Member
What have you pulled off 1000 watt SE HPS? And not using Big Mike's overpriced snake oil nutes either.
CCCmints
Well-Known Member
I don't grow currently, I design lighting systems and collaborate directly with my growers. I have a thread on here with a grow of mine if you'd like to go find that (not the one in my sig). I have people who do the growing for me because I'm in an illegal state. I have my card and am ready when the laws hit.
But what does that have to do with your ludicrous idea for a scientific experiment? And why is there a handicap on the nutrients you're allowed to use? It is truly shocking how far people can drift from what science actually is after being away from school for some years.
Frank Nitty
Well-Known Member
Talk about it pop22
Aolelon
Well-Known Member
My point is going off the numbers alone don't prove shit, when the grow is the result you're looking for. Numbers can say one thing. But a grow can show it.
Show me where a HLG 550 cant replace a 1000w HID with results, then I would believe you.
CCCmints
Well-Known Member
You're not really qualified to be in this discussion.
Frank Nitty
Well-Known Member
Whaaaaaat??? He don't know you very well ,do he?
619kt619
Well-Known Member
This guy
Frank Nitty
Well-Known Member
This dude is crazy!!! Gonna pray for him... Forgive him Lord, for he knows not what he does... Amen...
Frank Nitty
Well-Known Member
I know, he must have fallen and bumped his head...
Frank Nitty
Well-Known Member
Now me, I'm not qualified for this conversation, all I care about is the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow,but you cats that he's talking to and about are more than qualified... He seems to be getting a little worked up about this...
Frank Nitty
Well-Known Member
Why can't we like what we like and enjoy growing some killer diller and call it a day? Nobody gives a rats ass about numbers unless they're designing this stuff... Is he doing that? Maybe he has money invested in the company??? Hes just a weed grower like the rest of us, except for a few REAL people in here that are actually involved with the business...
THT
Well-Known Member
Update on my 600W HPS swap out with QB's. The boards are doing nicely, I've added another 200 watts of cheap Chinese made COB fixture, and an old 90W ufo for something extra. Loving the extra headroom the boards gave me, plants seem to be enjoying it.
Mostly what you see here is Super Silver Sage from Cult Classic seeds
GHS Kalashnikova
Mostly what you see here is Super Silver Sage from Cult Classic seeds
GHS Kalashnikova
CCCmints
Well-Known Member
Those numbers can help you decide how close the light can be to your canopy, if you didn’t know. “According to science 1200 uMols is just overkill” – You post yours, I’ll post mine: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23572895#
Where are you getting all these random figures from? And why do you keep saying PPF? Do you even know what that acronym means?
Numbers are important, much morose than you guys seem capable of understanding. Even when you grow, you need to collect the ‘numbers’ – but you guys don’t, lol. You just grow plants, take pictures of them, weigh the bud at the end, and then boom you think you’ve conducted a scientific experiment. Lol.
Do you know what the graph shows? How about you do your best to tell me what you think it shows. We aren’t talking about any of those factors (medium, genetics, nutrients, etc.), we are talking about the lighting system. Your analogies are cute.
You don’t even know what your results are. How would you?
Why do you think efficiency is only related to PPF? You don’t think a fixture’s PPFD score is relevant to the overall ‘efficiency’ of its efficacy? You can put these fixtures in a sphere and note the total photon output relative to its power draw all you want, that metric isn’t the most important by a long shot. I will say it again, designing lighting systems is about distributing photon output. Hence the ‘D’ in PPFD. The efficiency of the available diodes on the market has no where near the variance that the efficiency of distributing photon output has in the market today.
I’d consider switching to a fixture with a 37% lower PPFD score to be a “wasteful practice” – but that’s just me.
They are expensive, for what they are. That’s why their price got beat.
You do realize some of the major reasons they’re so easily copied is outlined in your own post, right?
Did they? No. I would have seen it in the reference material I received from my own patent search. I know damn well how much it all costs, because I was smart enough to pay for it. Your mistaken in thinking it’s the cost that is why HLG has no patents. They have no patents because they have nothing patentable. What do you think they could even patent? And why do you instantly assume lower quality components are used for the new boards released by KingBrite? I bet they’re the damn same lol.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they haven’t turned a profit, and never will. Its not about what they deserve, its about how they failed to protect the little they had.
You quite literally have no idea what you purchased. I am not surprised you used to run a business.
Where are you getting all these random figures from? And why do you keep saying PPF? Do you even know what that acronym means?
Numbers are important, much morose than you guys seem capable of understanding. Even when you grow, you need to collect the ‘numbers’ – but you guys don’t, lol. You just grow plants, take pictures of them, weigh the bud at the end, and then boom you think you’ve conducted a scientific experiment. Lol.
Do you know what the graph shows? How about you do your best to tell me what you think it shows. We aren’t talking about any of those factors (medium, genetics, nutrients, etc.), we are talking about the lighting system. Your analogies are cute.
You don’t even know what your results are. How would you?
Why do you think efficiency is only related to PPF? You don’t think a fixture’s PPFD score is relevant to the overall ‘efficiency’ of its efficacy? You can put these fixtures in a sphere and note the total photon output relative to its power draw all you want, that metric isn’t the most important by a long shot. I will say it again, designing lighting systems is about distributing photon output. Hence the ‘D’ in PPFD. The efficiency of the available diodes on the market has no where near the variance that the efficiency of distributing photon output has in the market today.
I’d consider switching to a fixture with a 37% lower PPFD score to be a “wasteful practice” – but that’s just me.
They are expensive, for what they are. That’s why their price got beat.
You do realize some of the major reasons they’re so easily copied is outlined in your own post, right?
Did they? No. I would have seen it in the reference material I received from my own patent search. I know damn well how much it all costs, because I was smart enough to pay for it. Your mistaken in thinking it’s the cost that is why HLG has no patents. They have no patents because they have nothing patentable. What do you think they could even patent? And why do you instantly assume lower quality components are used for the new boards released by KingBrite? I bet they’re the damn same lol.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they haven’t turned a profit, and never will. Its not about what they deserve, its about how they failed to protect the little they had.
You quite literally have no idea what you purchased. I am not surprised you used to run a business.
WeedSexWeightsShakes
Well-Known Member
lol and you are?