4x4 Strong Budget LED Grow Setup, Fired up OP!

[Seamuis]

New member and self subscribed medical patient here, state not legal yet. I've been an active vape enthusiast since 2010 (Current favorite is NewVape FlowerPot Showerhead) and would like to start growing my own medicine. Interested in potted grow, but could be convinced to look at hydroponics.

I have a strong budget for a 4x4 setup to place in my basement here in the Northeast, also planning on a mothering tent. Planning on purchasing a Gorilla tent and a manufactured LED. Spending a lot of time researching as I have a ton to learn, still need to prep an area including adding some dedicated outlets and clearing out basement garbage, it will be late Spring before I can begin. It's taking a lot of restraint to not pull the trigger on a LED/tent package.

Thinking 4x4 main veg/flower tent with 600w+ LED (Majority of budget will go to the light!). Given the state I'm in, I want a mothering tent as I'll be starting from seed. This will also help me when I fuck up as I will not need to wait for seeds to germinate. So 4x4, thinking smaller mothering tent perhaps using CFLs? Intake filter and fan supplying mothering tent, mothering tent ducted to veg/flower tent then in line fan and filter exhaust. Just worried about too many air changes for mothering tent. Have a really good friend who is a patient too and also has 30+ years HVAC and knows DDC. As this is a basement grow in a cold part of the country planning on a heat mat for the starter trays and probably a space heater, otherwise it will be just too cold down there. Really would like a controller for lights in both, ventilation and to track humidity. Have a commercial dehumidifier down there and have a smaller unit if I need it, also have a ceramic heater.

Using the attached Green Flower media shopping list for starters, any input would be welcome!

This is an awesome site I only discovered recently through following @Greengenes707 and @Growmau5 on Youtube, thanks guys, you rock! Sorry, while I am very technical, not keen on putting my own lights together, much props to you. Using the attached lists and a lot of notes from many hours watching videos to plan and help decide what I need. Acquisitions will start being made and Pacific Light Concepts is definitely on my list as a possible provider.

 

[kratos015]

Hey man, glad to see you made your own thread!

I would not go for a manufactured LED/tent package for a full cycle by any means. Good LED lights are DIY and a 4x4 space would require a minimum of 9 Cree lights, with 16 being the most ideal. LEDs shine directly down in almost a cone like fashion, rule of thumb is 1 Cree per sq ft for the best growth as this provided the absolute most even coverage horizontally and there isn't a single light on the market capable of outperforming it (although a 1000w DE comes close). However, a 16 Cree LED setup will run you $1500-2000, $2500+ if you want it built for you. Any other LED is going to be a waste of money and all of the people that I see pulling good yields are all using COBs/Quantums/Cree that they built themselves. Don't be one of the many people that bought a crappy LED for $500+ only to end up with an HID. For someone that is only growing their own medicine, it just doesn't seem very practical to spend that much on one single light. Especially when you mentioned you may have a need for a heater, which I can guarantee takes more power per hour than any 1000w HID. Get yourself a plain light with a good reflector/hood and save the money. When learning something new, try to do so for as cheap as possible. That way there is no pressure to perform and you can focus more on learning. Once you've learned more you can take that applied knowledge and begin making the necessary upgrades you find.

Another thing is the tent, which they've set a $400 budget for a 4x4 tent. Have you considered building your own room? I had a spare room and built into two of the walls, so I only needed two frames as I had the other two to build on already. I was able to make an 8x10x8 room for $200. Wood, drywall, caulk, insulation, etc. Consider looking into that. Not only would you be saving money, but you have more room and you can design it to your specifications and even insulate it. Being in a cold part of the country is a good advantage, especially in a basement. You'll be able to get away with connecting some inline fans to some Temperature controllers that CAP makes. The fan connected to your lights ducting could be set to turn on when your grow room's temps go over 75. If it's cold enough you could even get away with exhausting the lights outside of the grow room and into the basement to maintain good enough temps for a mother/clone set up.

The room's ventilation itself is going to be a concern though. How are you going to get fresh air inside of the grow? Even if there is a source of fresh air to bring into your room, what happens when it's 40 or lower? Not only that, but exhausting the air will also pose potential security issues. Sure carbon scrubbers work, but it can suck to be at the mercy of it going down at the wrong time. If you build your own room and make it 100% sealed, you could look into adding CO2. Most people don't recommend CO2 to people for a first time grow and I completely agree, however we're only using the CO2 generator to provide the CO2 the plants aren't getting because there is no fresh air exchange. So either fresh air exchange needs to be legit, or you need to pump CO2.

And I don't know if you're told your friend about your plans, but seeing as you're in a non-legal state I certainly wouldn't. Don't tell a soul. When someone is in deep enough trouble, they have no friends.

The only kind of controller I can see you needing is a temp controller for the light's exhaust fan, can be had for around $80. Mine is a CAP brand, works well for me.

Figure out what you need, price it, then figure out how to make it cheaper without sacrificing anything. Like considering the HID over LED and building your own room for example. You aren't sacrificing anything, but you're saving money. It doesn't take much for someone to get 4-8oz per 5g plant if done right. I'm not sure how much experience you have with growing, but if you have none then I recommend starting as small and cheap as possible and learning how the plant works/grows and what it needs, and when. Once you've got a grasp on that then you can start expanding more.

Hope this was helpful, not always on but I'll help when I can.

 

[Joint Monster]

As you will be adding new outlets, will you also be putting in a new breaker?

If It was up to me, I would choose a dimmable 600 or 1000 HPS/MH. That way if heat becomes an issue you can always run it lower. Then when you have more money you can do a DIY LED setup and sell the HPS/MH or run it in another room.

In a 4x4 tent, have you considered fan and filter size? And more importantly Fan and Filter Brands? Since you are in a non-legal state, odour control should be on the top of your list imo. ... ABOVE your light-budget....ABOVE your tent-budget.

Veg does not really smell, and depending on the size you can always run a passive intake, and computer fan exhaust, if you have a smaller sized veg room.

A good Environment-Controller will probably cost more than a 4x4 Gorilla Tent and Any LED light you listed above. For now just get light timers, a variable fan-speed controller for your exhaust fan, and a hygrometer/thermometer to measure your environmental parameters.

 

[Cold$moke]

If you can wire a car stereo you can build a badass light.

Agree money can be better spent making your own tent or just a hard wall room

Just one guys oppinon

 

[Ryante55]

Get the hlg 600 kit from growershouse have them build it for an extra $50 if you don't want to. unless the 550 is on sale. Don't get the nextlight mega it uses the same diodes as the cheaper boards on Alibaba

 

[Seamuis]

With a HID what’s the likelyhood of fire as the garden may be unattended during the day? Perhaps less likely than a ceramic heater?

 

[Ryante55]

Imo that budget looks really low that would cover lights and the tent

 

[Seamuis]

Imo that budget looks really low that would cover lights and the tent

What figure did you see, I have not given a figure for my budget. I would say I am not prepared to nor would it make sense to spend $2500 on a light alone.

 

[Ryante55]

What figure did you see, I have not given a figure for my budget. I would say I am not prepared to nor would it make sense to spend $2500 on a light alone.

Your attachement says 1500-1700

 

[Seamuis]

Apologies, I am using that for reference, the costs and list will not be strictly adehered to. I attached it as I felt not only would others benefit, but it also gives a rough idea of what I am considering for equipment.

Thanks for the feedback! Nothing is written in stone. I’m definitely considering all options including a room. I don’t need a noisy meter reader poking around. Hopefully Schedule 1 will drop in a few years! -Seamus

 

[Ryante55]

Apologies, I am using that for reference, the costs and list will not be strictly adehered to. I attached it as I felt not only would others benefit, but it also gives a rough idea of what I am considering for equipment.

Thanks for the feedback! Nothing is written in stone. I’m definitely considering all options including a room. I don’t need a noisy meter reader poking around. Hopefully Schedule 1 will drop in a few years! -Seamus

Oh ok if you want a gorilla tent and top of the line setup I would say 2500-3000

 

[regoob eht]

Sonoff is great cheap option for wireless control. Seriously worth checking out imo. Good luck and best wishes.

https://www.rollitup.org/t/sonoff-wifi-wireless-smart-switch.948196/

 

[growpotma]

Here is my setup that I use:
https://growpotma.wordpress.com/2018/03/30/the-perfect-grow-room-setup-how-to-harvest-a-pound-every-month/

Total cost is $1000 and I harvest once every month (up to almost a pound). People are going to disagree with this but you don't need a gorilla tent. I get the cheapest Chinese tents possible and have never had an issue. You're better off spending more on the lights and soil since that will actually make a difference in yield.... In my humble opinion at least!

 

[growpotma]

Also, I live in the Northeast too and you can definitely wait on getting a dehumidifier, humidifier, heater or AC unit. I got a heater and a humidifier when I bought my first setup and my tent ended up having a perfect grow environment without any devices help. I also wouldn't bother getting a pH meter or anything like that in the beginning. I just leave tap water sitting out for 24 hours use that. If you use fox farms ocean forest the soil should be be able to buffer your water to the correct pH. I also respectfully disagree with the people who tell you you need a top of the line LED to grow decent buds. I use MarsHydro now but my first light was some no name Chinese LED that most people on here would call a "blurple" light. My friend who uses really expensive KIND LED lights came over and was amazed - the blurple light actually grew some pretty dank buds. Keep it simple and cheap in the beginning is my best advice!


The people who posted above gave you really great advice but think about it - if you spend three times as much on your setup, you will need to have three times the yield to recover your cost. I can assure you that you will not be able to triple your yield by getting equipment that costs three times as much.... Just my opinion and I hope the posters above don't hate me too much for disagreeing with them!

 

[Ryante55]

Also, I live in the Northeast too and you can definitely wait on getting a dehumidifier, humidifier, heater or AC unit. I got a heater and a humidifier when I bought my first setup and my tent ended up having a perfect grow environment without any devices help. I also wouldn't bother getting a pH meter or anything like that in the beginning. I just leave tap water sitting out for 24 hours use that. If you use fox farms ocean forest the soil should be be able to buffer your water to the correct pH. I also respectfully disagree with the people who tell you you need a top of the line LED to grow decent buds. I use MarsHydro now but my first light was some no name Chinese LED that most people on here would call a "blurple" light. My friend who uses really expensive KIND LED lights came over and was amazed - the blurple light actually grew some pretty dank buds. Keep it simple and cheap in the beginning is my best advice!


The people who posted above gave you really great advice but think about it - if you spend three times as much on your setup, you will need to have three times the yield to recover your cost. I can assure you that you will not be able to triple your yield by getting equipment that costs three times as much.... Just my opinion and I hope the posters above don't hate me too much for disagreeing with them!

I would never consider a kind light to be good when people say to stay away from those lights they are just trying to save someone money. A kind led won't beat an hps. A Mars hydro 600w(265 actual watts) is $140 you need 135w of good cobs or mid power led diodes to match a Mars hydro output. 135w quantum board kit is $184 so for an extra $40 you use half the watts and have a much higher quality light. If you did a diy build with cobs or strips you could match a Mars hydro for around $100-$120.

 

[Seamuis]

Hoping this will not become another this light versus that light thread, plenty of those here. Hypothetically, lets just say I’ve got a light.

 

[Ryante55]

Hoping this will not become another this light versus that light thread, plenty of those here. Hypothetically, lets just say I’ve got a light.

Haha sorry wasn't trying to do that everyone just thinks it's crazy expensive to get a good light it can be affordable to get a nice light that you can upgrade in the future instead of having to replace it.

 

[growpotma]

I would never consider a kind light to be good when people say to stay away from those lights they are just trying to save someone money. A kind led won't beat an hps. A Mars hydro 600w(265 actual watts) is $140 you need 135w of good cobs or mid power led diodes to match a Mars hydro output. 135w quantum board kit is $184 so for an extra $40 you use half the watts and have a much higher quality light. If you did a diy build with cobs or strips you could match a Mars hydro for around $100-$120.

That's actually a good point and I didn't think you were being a dick haha. I just think my setup is super easy and cheap for beginners and I think the yield is comparable to the alternatives you and others presented. I didn't mean to ramble on in my post but my point is basically that people on this site make everything way too complicated. I have friends with really expensive setups and friends with blurple Chinese LED's and there really isn't that much of a difference. I feel like people on this website make it WAY too complicated and expensive for beginners who are probably better off with something cheap and simple.

 

[Ryante55]

That's actually a good point and I didn't think you were being a dick haha. I just think my setup is super easy and cheap for beginners and I think the yield is comparable to the alternatives you and others presented. I didn't mean to ramble on in my post but my point is basically that people on this site make everything way too complicated. I have friends with really expensive setups and friends with blurple Chinese LED's and there really isn't that much of a difference. I feel like people on this website make it WAY too complicated and expensive for beginners who are probably better off with something cheap and simple.

Ya I feel you a lb a month is pretty damn good have you seen any of the newer white lights in person? Pics online don't really do them justice I was completely shocked the first time I turned one on I immediately sold my platinum led that I only used for a month and 3 g8led I only used for 1 grow

 

[coreywebster]

With a HID what’s the likelyhood of fire as the garden may be unattended during the day? Perhaps less likely than a ceramic heater?

Its unlikely. Most fires are a result of arcing from not plugging the male into the female properly. If you put the bulb on a flammable surface the change of fire increases by 1000 fold.

Not that I'm trying to sway you in that direction..

Go with a cheaper tent and get a HLG600.
I don't see the attraction to spending lots on a tent.