Florida is set to arm teachers
- Thread starter Jimdamick
- Start date
907cannabis
Well-Known Member
While I don't agree with just the general arming of "teachers", what if they had access to a gun in a safe in case of emergency, one that only they knew the combination to.
If they are going to arm teachers I'd rather have it be that than just a gun in a fucking holster that is retarded as fuck.
907cannabis
Well-Known Member
Let's all remember the whitehouse is protected by fences and armed guards. The presidents motorcade has plenty of weapons to boot also.
If implemented correctly, security from the outside, not the inside, is the answer.
If implemented correctly, security from the outside, not the inside, is the answer.
Chip Green
Well-Known Member
In Florida, the further North you go, the further South you get......
Roger A. Shrubber
Well-Known Member
it's fun reading this without looking at ignored content first....you can tell who's trolling without looking after some practice
Amazon Blaze
Active Member
Sorry I lost you, I will try and explain it easier for you, people who play video games and watch violent films become desensitized to violence, they don't become homicidal maniacs just bye using these things for entertainment. What happens when you immerse yourself in a computer game, your unconscious mind accepts it for a reality the more you do it. It lowers your emotional and psychological reaction to it in real life, in general. Otherwise training people for the military services, police, fire brigade would not work, they would go into shock, some do even with the training. We desensitize our selves all the time its a natural adaption, a coping mechanism. I am surprised no one has commented on my avatar, you probably didn't even notice it.
"Studies show people who play video games are not influenced one bit bye video games"
Some studies might some studies might not. If you believe the studies on cannabis by the pharmaceutical industry and the FDA you would believe there was no medical value to Cannabis. Are these studies of average people who play video games or borderline psychotics, full blown psychotics, manic depressives, sociopaths, paranoid schizophrenics who play video games?
Being psychotic does not mean you may be violent, it means you have a different version of personal reality to the majority of people on this planet. My mother had dementia which is a form of Psychosis, she never wanted to kill anyone, she did how ever want to get a gun for protection, after watching an animal program on the TV about lions in Africa, and after watching another program about France thanked me profusely for taking her there, for a trip that day. One can easily be turned from a non violent psychotic to a violent one. You can even get rational people to commit murder voluntarily in a very short space of time, with the right direct and indirect suggestions. Its how hypnosis works, its just suggestion, either from and external or internal source.
If you have netflix see if you can find Derren Browns "The Push". He did a social experiment, where he gets 4 random people to commit murder within 12 hours.
You obviously missed my first post, on page one. which I think explains my point of view, but I will share it with you again.
People should have to attend safety courses and prove they are competent to have a gun, have back ground checks that allow medical records to be evaluated, and wait a month minimum to get a license, before they can even buy a gun. You need to have lessons and pass a test, to prove you can drive a car, why not a gun which is just as dangerous.
A person wishing to wreak havoc regardless of their psychological/emotional state, and plans his/her attack, rather than being spontaneous, will try and find the most destructive thing to hand to accomplish that task, which is why these types of weapons need removing, and stronger laws put in place.
Jimdamick
Well-Known Member
Well put argument.
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Fogdog
Well-Known Member
Its a well known theory. Sorry but the analogy for military isn't very good. People who sign up or were drafted knew they were going to face deadly fire and train for real. What you say is not known to be wrong, just not known to be true. Video game playing doesn't have a good correlation to gun violence or else you'd be seeing something like a zombie horde come out on the street with each release of Call of Duty.
The problem with commonly accepted theories like this and the gateway drug theory for cannabis is that the relationship between the purported causal factor and the purported result has very poor correlation and small sample size. Teeeeensy number of mass shootings to millions of video game players and you claim there is a relationship. Uhhhh yeah, video game playing is a terrible predictor yet people harp on that instead of better predictors. Do you know what is a much better predictor for gun homicides and mass shooting also with better sample size? The number of guns owned per person.
One might also look to increased stress in our daily lives in the form of economic insecurity before waving one's hand over something with as bad a predictive value as video games.
I'm not saying video game playing might desensitize people to fantasy violence they may also see in the cinema. I'm just saying practically all of people who play video games or the millions more exposed to violence on TV and in movies are able discriminate between what is fantasy and what is real real. We have 10's of mass shooters in the US every year and you point to millions of video players. I guess some psychiatrists are just bad at statistics.
Myself, I'm not a video game player nor am I a fan of shoot'em ups, slasher movies or other blood and guts movies. For example, I actively avoided seeing even the trailer of Silence of the Lambs, not because I think it's a bad movie but I'm unwilling to allow those images in my head. You completely miss my reasoning and assumed bias. No more true was your belief that there is a reasonably good relationship between video games and mass shootings.
You didn't lose me because I didn't understand. What you just wrote was just plain bad science.
Guns are the problem, not video games.
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Roger A. Shrubber
Well-Known Member
i haven't done a study, but it sure seems like movies and games are causal, and not symptomatic.
when i was a kid, the good guys won. and it was easy to tell who they were. they were the guys NOT killing people, NOT stealing things, NOT ignoring the law.
we didn't have games at all till i was 12 or 13, then the level of violence was shooting a poorly rendered tank from another tank, not watching brains explode out of the back of a head when i got a headshot in.
i'm not going to lay all fault at the feet of video games and movies, but i'm sure as fuck not saying they are blameless, either
when i was a kid, the good guys won. and it was easy to tell who they were. they were the guys NOT killing people, NOT stealing things, NOT ignoring the law.
we didn't have games at all till i was 12 or 13, then the level of violence was shooting a poorly rendered tank from another tank, not watching brains explode out of the back of a head when i got a headshot in.
i'm not going to lay all fault at the feet of video games and movies, but i'm sure as fuck not saying they are blameless, either
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
Well then, here are some studies. Video games are blameless.
Top chart, gun murder vs money spent on video games in ten top video markets
- No relationship between gun murder and video game playing.
- US is strongly different in homicide rate compared other countries with similar video game playing habits.
Bottom chart, Gun murder vs guns per 100k people in top ten national economies
- murder by gun strongly related to (50% explained by) the number of guns per person in a country.
Key points
- having many guns available is a large factor in gun murder.
- People claiming video games is even part of the problem should fish elsewhere.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2012/12/17/ten-country-comparison-suggests-theres-little-or-no-link-between-video-games-and-gun-murders/
https://psmag.com/social-justice/the-correlation-between-gun-ownership-and-homicide-rate-55467
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Roger A. Shrubber
Well-Known Member
i'm not saying there's a direct correlation, but that doesn't convince me in any way that letting children play ultra violent games is a good idea...
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
There is no correlation between gun homicides and video habits of the general population.
There are plenty of good reasons for parents making decisions for the kid about what they do with screen time including video games.
Amazon Blaze
Active Member
"I didn't lose you because you didn't understand." Are you sure that wasn't a Freudian slip? Because I don't think you do understand what I am saying, because you keep changing it about in your mind, to make an argument that is not there.
So I will say it again and emphasize the points you need to understand. People who play video games and watch violent films become DESENSITIZED to violence and guns. (to make indifferent, unaware, or the like, in feeling)
They DO NOT BECOME PSYCOPATHS.
"Sorry but the analogy for military isn't very good"
Its not an analogy, its fact.
http://www.defenseone.com/technology/2015/01/better-simulation-could-save-military-millions/104172/
"Video game playing doesn't have a good correlation to gun violence or else you'd be seeing something like a zombie horde come out on the street with each release of Call of Duty."
I did not say this, I said , IT DESENSITIZES PEOPLE, it makes it more acceptable to people.
"The problem with commonly accepted theories like this and the gateway drug theory for cannabis is that the relationship between the purported causal factor and the purported result has very poor correlation and small sample size. Teeeeensy number of mass shootings to millions of video game players and you claim there is a relationship."
No I said, IT DESENSITIZES PEOPLE, its another straw on the camels back, that makes it generally more acceptable/normal for people to see.
"I'm not saying video game playing might desensitize people to fantasy violence they may also see in the cinema. I'm just saying practically all of people who play video games or the millions more exposed to violence on TV and in movies are able discriminate between what is fantasy and what is real real. We have 10's of mass shooters in the US every year and you point to millions of video players. I guess some psychiatrists are just bad at statistics."
You are making assumptions here, that everyone thinks like you and has the same personal reality as you. They don't, so you cant say what, they do or do not experience when watching films and playing video games.Practically all is not everyone, the ones who are not included in practically all, could POSSIBLY experience it as something more real than most and become more DESENSITIZED than most other people playing them.
"I guess some psychiatrists are just bad at statistics."
I take that you are referring to me, not accepting your "study" argument. I would agree, psychiatrists are bad a lot of things, not just statistics.
I was a psychoanalyst, not a psychiatrist, they are different.
"Myself, I'm not a video game player nor am I a fan of shoot'em ups, slasher movies or other blood and guts movies. For example, I actively avoided seeing even the trailer of Silence of the Lambs, not because I think it's a bad movie but I'm unwilling to allow those images in my head. You completely miss my reasoning and assumed bias. No more true was your belief that there is a reasonably good relationship between video games and mass shootings."
Good for you, you are actively trying to stay sensitive to violence, one less DESENSITIZED person to worry about.
You should try playing computer games, especially first person shooters, you might get a different perspective on my argument.
I used to play Battlefield 3, sometimes competitively for clans, before my injury stopped play. I think I have about 3,000 hours logged just on BF3. I was really good, usually placed in the top 5 players on any server I played on. I enjoyed the psychological aspects to it as well as looking into an opponents eyes before sticking a knife in his chest lol. The first time I played it, I lasted 20 minutes before I had to stop, because I was shaking so much from the adrenaline and anger at dying very quickly. Sitting in front of a 42 inch high def tv, 3 ft in front of me, with a high performance gaming rig and surround sound headphones on. It took me about 3 hours to calm down. I tried playing it again 2 weeks later, after the ptsd subsided, still got the same adrenaline rush and frustration with the weapons, I wasn't used to using. Every time I played I DESENSITIZED myself further to the sounds and emotions I was experiencing, so I could focus on my targets more easily. Yes I understand the difference between virtual and real reality, no it would not consciously make me a killer. At an unconscious level it was part of my personal reality and did DESENSITIZE me to violence at a conscious everyday level. My buddy who had never had a driving accident, hit 2 parked cars and put his car in a ditch 40 yds down the rd after leaving my house after playing Driver for 3 hours. He said he just got in the car and started to drive like he had just been doing on the computer game.
"Guns are the problem, not video games."
No, video games, like a lot of other things, are a part of the problem, why people in the USA, accept and make it easy to access guns. Guns are the biggest part of the problem.
whitebb2727
Well-Known Member
First. You say that you were or a psychotherapist and that requires, what, like 8 years of school. 8 years of higher education and you can't make paragraphs instead of a block of text.
Being in that field you should also understand that people have the attention span of a gnat. More reason to use paragraphs.
Then to the video games. Quite a few studies say the opposite.
As far as guns. I hope gun owners lock them up and use something like a rapid safe for home protection guns.
If a person feels the need to carry then they need to take various training above just shooting. Weapon retention and things of the sort.
Close gun show loops. Stop mentally ill from being able to buy guns. Ban bump stocks.
Enforce the laws on the books. Put penalties in place for things like not reporting a dishonorable discharge or other offenses that keep someone from owning a gun.
I'm for being able to own something like an ar15. Maybe restrict them to a class 3. If not maybe make the background check for them more thorough.
I get that these type guns are being used in mass shootings. The bulk of killings are from short guns.
Im not sure what to do but I'm flexible.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
I didn't read your wall of text. I skimmed it. Everything about your hypothesis that video games have something to do with gun violence is refuted in the two charts I posted a few posts above yours. There is no correlation between video game playing and gun homicides. None, nada, not a shred, not even close.
I point out that there is an alternate hypothesis that fits the data better than yours. The more guns available, the better chance of gun getting into the hands of a homicidal person. Your theory on the other hand doesn't fit the empirical data at all.
The video game violence theory is a red herring type of argument used by those who are protecting the gun industry from stricter gun control laws. I'm not saying you are doing that. I think you believe what you are saying. I am responding because this kind of propaganda is effective and want to put a small voice out there to counter it.
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Fogdog
Well-Known Member
He certainly triggered easily, didn't he? Must be from playing those video games. I hear those violent games make people more aggressive.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
yes but only here in the united states
the same video games exist everywhere else but no such gun massacres
so odd, that