New style Samsung LM561C Board

[see4]

Do you grasp the fact that monochrome light does not have a "CCT"? Your argument above makes no sense and does not apply in any way to combining WHITE LIGHT spectrums.

White light spectrums, 3000k, 4000k, 3500k, 6500k, etc produce wavelengths measured in nanometers that are useful for the plant. Adding more of one wavelength will not negate the other wavelengths being produced. That's not how light works.

Looking at curves is misleading. Sure it looks like you are just adding a chunk of red light from 640 - 700nm - but you are also adding everything on the curve that's below 640. Once the combined curve is re-normalized all you really have is a red peak shifted some. Again, at the risk of repeating myself, this is something that Stephen has actually measured with his spectrometer and posted. You don't really get anything that "wasn't" there, you just get more of EVERYTHING with the ratio shifted some. All of those red wavelengths from 640-700 ARE present (in the 400K), just not as much of them. if you want more far red, then just add far red, without all the rest of the spectrum that comes with a white diode.

I'm not sure I'm following you on this one... the premise of me building a board with 3000k and 4000k diodes is to use them from start to finish. If I wanted more far red, I would have asked for it. I asked for what I wanted, which is a good mix of 3000k spectrum (more far reds) and 4000k spectrum (more far blues) to give a "good" balance for both veg and flower.

It's nonsense to stipulate that combining such diodes will produce a 3500k spectrum. 3000k spectrum has wavelengths that are not "seen" in 3500k spectrum. And 4000k has wavelengths that are not "seen" in 3500k and 3000k.

 

[see4]

No they dont... high cri was only relevant because it coincided with deeper reds but still a photon filter otherwise cri tends to be worthless for measuring radiometric output [read:non_quantifiable]. Newer gens like vero have gotten better but they still bottleneck photon delivery at the expense of red delivery....besides far red and far blue are still in much debate about in vitro physiology occuring....

Stardustsailor was right about then about low cri diodes and still now.....

Oh, I did not know that. In an attempt of not sounding lazy, you wouldn't happen to have a link would you?

 

[nfhiggs]

CCT does not equal wavelength (nm).
CCT is not "determined" by spectrum, it is merely a description/label of a spectrum.
A spectrum consists of many wavelengths (nm).
Mixing diodes of various spectrums, thusly various wavelengths, does not produce averaged wavelengths.
A 620nm wavelength and a 480nm wavelength do not make up a 550nm wavelength, they make up a 620nm wavelength and 480nm wavelength.

You ever have a black light on in a room with the light on? You don't really see much. Then when you turn the light off in the room, an entire world of magic opens up before your eyes.
Guess what? When the lights were on, the black light was still producing light! Imagine that! And at the very same wavelength!! Gasp! Shocker!

God, are you really this dense? Do you not grasp the fact that white light diodes produce ALL of the wavelengths along the visible spectrum? Not just some, but ALL, in varying quantities, from about 420 nm to over 700 nm. Stop trying to drag individual wavelengths into the picture. The "wavelengths" themselves do not average, but their individual amounts add up (that is, x uMoles of 420 nm from one diode adds to x uMoles of 420 nm from the other diode to total y uMoles of 420 in the combined spectrum), and that changes the ratios that determine the CCT. A CCT is defined by the ratios of ALL the various wavelengths emitted from 420 to 700, not just 480 and 620. Change the ratios and you change the CCT. By adding more at the 420 end and less at the 700 end, you shift the ratio towards the blue, and RAISE the CCT. By adding more at 700 and less at 420 you shift the ratio towards the red and the CCT is LOWERED. If you take two WHITE spectrums and combine them you will have a spectrum whose CCT is approximately in the MIDDLE of the two CCT's of the individual spectrums.

 

[ANC]

If you take two WHITE spectrums and combine them you will have a spectrum whose CCT is approximately in the MIDDLE of the two CCT's of the individual spectrums.

I do this with my kitchen lights, cool white is too cold, warm white too warm, but using one of each bulb in the same luminaire works great.

 

[nfhiggs]

3000k spectrum has wavelengths that are not "seen" in 3500k spectrum. And 4000k has wavelengths that are not "seen" in 3500k and 3000k.

No, it really doesn't. There is just LESS of some of it. 700nm, for instance is at a bit under 0.20 in the 4000K, and around 0.45 in the 3000K. Its ALL there, just in different ratios. Same goes for the blue end. 3000K has all the blue, just much less of it. Blue is what breaks down Auxin, which is important for cell elongation, which is why 3000K stretches more than 4000K. Both 3500K and 4000K have a decent amount of blue and work quite well for both flower and veg.

 

[see4]

God, are you really this dense? Do you not grasp the fact that white light diodes produce ALL of the wavelengths along the visible spectrum? Not just some, but ALL, in varying quantities, from about 420 nm to over 700 nm. Stop trying to drag individual wavelengths into the picture. The "wavelengths" themselves do not average, but their individual amounts add up (that is, x uMoles of 420 nm from one diode adds to x uMoles of 420 nm from the other diode to total y uMoles of 420 in the combined spectrum), and that changes the ratios that determine the CCT. A CCT is defined by the ratios of ALL the various wavelengths emitted from 420 to 700, not just 480 and 620. Change the ratios and you change the CCT. By adding more at the 420 end and less at the 700 end, you shift the ratio towards the blue, and RAISE the CCT. By adding more at 700 and less at 420 you shift the ratio towards the red and the CCT is LOWERED. If you take two WHITE spectrums and combine them you will have a spectrum whose CCT is approximately in the MIDDLE of the two CCT's of the individual spectrums.

1 diode that produces 420nm and 1 diode that produces 620nm, next to each other will not produce a 520nm wavelength.

Color temperature defines the color appearance of white light. CCT is defined in degrees Kelvin. -- What your eyes can see.

Note, the wavelengths in the varying CCT spectrums are still being emitted regardless of what our eyes can see.

I do this with my kitchen lights, cool white is too cold, warm white too warm, but using one of each bulb in the same luminaire works great.

And guess what... each bulb is emitting different wavelengths. One is producing more red, the other more blue.

Your eyes see it as an average of the two lights. But the wavelengths of each are still being produced nonetheless.

 

[see4]

No, it really doesn't. There is just LESS of some of it. 700nm, for instance is at a bit under 0.20 in the 4000K, and around 0.45 in the 3000K. Its ALL there, just in different ratios. Same goes for the blue end. 3000K has all the blue, just much less of it. Blue is what breaks down Auxin, which is important for cell elongation, which is why 3000K stretches more than 4000K. Both 3500K and 4000K have a decent amount of blue and work quite well for both flower and veg.

Ok, perfect! Then I made the right decision.

 

[nfhiggs]

1 diode that produces 420nm and 1 diode that produces 620nm, next to each other will not produce a 520nm wavelength.

.

You're the only moron that seems to think that's what I said. CCT is a RATIO. ONE wavelength does not have a ratio. So a 420 nm does not have a CCT and a 620 nm does not have a CCT. There is nothing to "average" between the two. Again stop bringing single wavelengths into this.

But the wavelengths of each are still being produced nonetheless

Yes, and in DIFFERENT RATIOS.

 

[see4]

You're the only moron that seems to think that's what I said. CCT is a RATIO. ONE wavelength does not have a ratio. So a 420 nm does not have a CCT and a 620 nm does not have a CCT. There is nothing to "average" between the two. Again stop bringing single wavelengths into this.

Yes, and in DIFFERENT RATIOS.

A spectrum consists of varying wavelengths. A 3000k spectrum has more reds than 4000k spectrum. Mixing diodes of 3000k and 4000k will not make the 3000k diode produce less far reds.

You're getting upset. You should go smoke some pot and forget our conversation. I really don't give a shit.

 

[see4]

Do you see how the snazzy green line is further to the right than the fancy purple line? Do you know why? Because that snazzy green line is emitting wavelengths that the fancy purple line is not. Mixing in the nifty blue line won't make the snazzy green line stop emitting the far right wavelengths.

 

[nfhiggs]

Ok, perfect! Then I made the right decision.

Whatever helps you sleep.

Its late and I'm going to sleep.

 

[nfhiggs]

Do you see how the snazzy green line is further to the right than the fancy purple line? Do you know why? Because that snazzy green line is emitting wavelengths that the fancy purple line is not. Mixing in the nifty blue line won't make the snazzy green line stop emitting the far right wavelengths.

I see you don't get the concept of normalizing the curve.

Good night.

 

[see4]

I see you don't get the concept of normalizing the curve.

Good night.

You have a good night sir. And I'm sorry I made you very upset, that was not my intention. I hope you took my advice and smoked some pot, you sure seem like you need it.

 

[Serva]

View attachment 4067202
Do you see how the snazzy green line is further to the right than the fancy purple line? Do you know why? Because that snazzy green line is emitting wavelengths that the fancy purple line is not. Mixing in the nifty blue line won't make the snazzy green line stop emitting the far right wavelengths.

What he fuck? Especially if you are talking about far red, this graph doesn‘t show anything. If I look at the right side I can clearlly see, that EVERY specteum is producing red light, 3000K more than 5000, but BOTH DO!

I also take a mix of spectrum, because I think it is more efficient. But your arguments are pretty strange...

It‘s absolutel NOT about the y-axis, shich shows you how nuch light of he wavelenght is produced. It‘s only about the x-axis, and I can see EVERY LINE end and starts at the same point!

Add some uva / uvb tube to ADD some specs, that LEDs are not producing, or some really far red / infrared on the other side...

 

[see4]

What he fuck? Especially if you are talking about far red, this graph doesn‘t show anything. If I look at the right side I can clearlly see, that EVERY specteum is producing red light, 3000K more than 5000, but BOTH DO!

I also take a mix of spectrum, because I think it is more efficient. But your arguments are pretty strange...

My premise is that combining 3000k and 4000k diodes on a single board, I will get the benefit of both spectrums, 3000k emits wavelengths not emitted from 4000k and 3500k diodes. The argument is that mixing 3000k and 4000k diodes will produce 3500k spectrum. Which is true in that your eye and my eye see a blended spectrum, but the 3000k diodes still emit the wavelengths not seen in 3500k and 4000k diodes... wavelengths that are beneficial to the plant. The plant doesn't care about spectrum as described in Kelvin, it cares about the wavelengths/photons that it gets bombarded with, "visual" or not.

 

[see4]

It‘s absolutel NOT about the y-axis, shich shows you how nuch light of he wavelenght is produced. It‘s only about the x-axis, and I can see EVERY LINE end and starts at the same point!

If that were true, everyone would simply grow with 3500k lights and be done with it, from start to finish.

 

[Serva]

No, because plants need different light at different stages... like you can see in nature!

 

[see4]

No, because plants need different light at different stages...

Exactly my point.

 

[Serva]

Huhh?! You never pointed out this fact! You want MIX it, not adapting like nfhiggs pointed out

 

[ANC]

No, because plants need different light at different stages... like you can see in nature!

True, but plants will adjust to what you give them by changing their colour a bit.