10,000 Watt 10 Plant 13 Gallon Rdwc [3d Model Incl. Inside Thread]

CCCmints

Well-Known Member
I think you got some killer ideas I just don't wanna see you spend more than you have to. I am of opinion that you should do 9 cobs running at 75ish watts each. Put the outside cobs 8" from the 4x4 edge and space the rest 16" on center. That would have each cob covering 8" in every direction. Saves a lot of money and I believe accomplishes what you want done. If you want you can drive them harder but I think that's in the ballpark.
Thanks, I appreciate all the input you've given. It looks like I'm going with almost exactly what you're suggesting.

Vero 29 SE Gen 7 3000k running @ 38.7v x 2.1a (81.27w).


So 1647.018PPF vs >2,000PPF (Solis Tek 1000w DE HPS) initial output...With 28% degradation after 3 months as a member on another forum tested that puts the HPS at 1440PPF in 3 months. I'd be surprised if the HPS bulb really reaches those numbers in initial out put anyways to be honest. But I think I've finally got a cost-effective match or maybe even superior fixture to HPS with the Vero 29 SE Gen 7 3000k running @ 38.7v x 2.1a (81.27w).

Total cost of the fixture would be around $776.60.
You need about 60 gal of substrate to hit high g/W numbers, even so, you can fit 4 plants to a 1000W.

Personally, I am running 80W COBs in groups of 3 to fit on a 240W driver.
Are you saying 60 gal of substrate per 1000w light? And don't you need to have 20% less load than your driver's max? Ho do you run 240w on a 240w driver?
 
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OrganicGorilla

Well-Known Member
Making the jump from burning 10,000 watts HPS to 6000 watts COBs is going to save you over $1000 per grow at .12/kWh. So saving you over $3000 per year is substantial. You will make your investment back from upgrading to COB in only a few years!
 

CCCmints

Well-Known Member
Wow. I guess im gonna be the ass. Why would you spend so much money on this many lights for such a small amount of plants? Unless your ceilings are 15 feet high its wayyyy over kill. Plus the amount of training just to achieve yeild would be a full time job.
You're not being an ass, you just aren't correct, at all. Why would you think the ceilings need to be 15'? In the first line of this thread I linked to a guy killing it with 12,000 watts over 10 plants.
What I did do which I am almost positive is right around 5 lbs a plant with 3000 watts or 5 600 watt lights per plant. I did this with no clone, but with Pisces hollywood haze right here at the farm. What's mind boggling is I did this with 7 foot ceilings. I am absolutely positive that it is possible to pull 8 to 10 lbs indoors per plant.
You don't need an absurd amount of plants to produce big numbers. There's actually a thread on other forums where a guy averages 8lb 3oz lbs per plant (4 plants) with a 3 week veg and 9 week flower period. The secret? A lot of fucking light per plant, way more than people think is necessary. That guy runs 2,000w per plant. My revised and current plan is to do 6,582.87w over 16 plants so around 411w per plant and I'm going to do a 4 week veg. Even with 10k over 10 plants that's half of what the 8lb guy ran in his grow.
Thats it? So 20 plus pounds on the 10k hps watts and he's going to save a grand?
What do you mean 20 plus pounds on HPS? I'm nearly matching a 1000w HPS in initial usable light output with 268.57w less power and sustaining that output while HPS drops by nearly 30% over a 3 month period and requires me to change the bulbs after each cycle. The only difference in favor of HPS nowadays is initial cost of buying the fixtures. If you matched the power draw, LED would absolutely crush HPS. After talking with all of these people who switched from HPS to LED, researching the subject myself, and observing the numerous grows posted using LED; its a no brainer now...I can't imagine a scenario where I'd choose HPS over LED now that LED is so affordable.

4 Week Veg, 10 Week Flower, 9 Lights
If I went with HPS, I'd likely still build LED fixtures for veg. So we'll just assume the same power draw for veg with HPS and LED.

HPS: Flower watts used = 9,000
LED: Flower watts used = 6,582.87

HPS electricity costs = $907.20/cycle || $277.68/month || $3,332.16/year
LED electricity costs = $663.55/cycle || $203.10/month || $2,437.20/year

Electricity savings = $243.65/cycle || $74.58/month || $894.96/year
Bulb replacement costs = $944.91/cycle

Total savings = $1188.56/cycle || $363.80/month || $4,365.69/year

Replacing the bulbs is more expensive than running the lights. At this point, I'd like to hear a solid argument in favor of HPS over LED.
 

OrganicGorilla

Well-Known Member
You're not being an ass, you just aren't correct, at all. Why would you think the ceilings need to be 15'? In the first line of this thread I linked to a guy killing it with 12,000 watts over 10 plants.
You don't need an absurd amount of plants to produce big numbers. There's actually a thread on other forums where a guy averages 8lb 3oz lbs per plant (4 plants) with a 3 week veg and 9 week flower period. The secret? A lot of fucking light per plant, way more than people think is necessary. That guy runs 2,000w per plant. My revised and current plan is to do 6,582.87w over 16 plants so around 411w per plant and I'm going to do a 4 week veg. Even with 10k over 10 plants that's half of what the 8lb guy ran in his grow.
What do you mean 20 plus pounds on HPS? I'm nearly matching a 1000w HPS in initial usable light output with 268.57w less power and sustaining that output while HPS drops by nearly 30% over a 3 month period and requires me to change the bulbs after each cycle. The only difference in favor of HPS nowadays is initial cost of buying the fixtures. If you matched the power draw, LED would absolutely crush HPS. After talking with all of these people who switched from HPS to LED, researching the subject myself, and observing the numerous grows posted using LED; its a no brainer now...I can't imagine a scenario where I'd choose HPS over LED now that LED is so affordable.

4 Week Veg, 10 Week Flower, 9 Lights
If I went with HPS, I'd likely still build LED fixtures for veg. So we'll just assume the same power draw for veg with HPS and LED.

HPS: Flower watts used = 9,000
LED: Flower watts used = 6,582.87

HPS electricity costs = $907.20/cycle || $277.68/month || $3,332.16/year
LED electricity costs = $663.55/cycle || $203.10/month || $2,437.20/year

Electricity savings = $243.65/cycle || $74.58/month || $894.96/year
Bulb replacement costs = $944.91/cycle

Total savings = $1188.56/cycle || $363.80/month || $4,365.69/year

Replacing the bulbs is more expensive than running the lights. At this point, I'd like to hear a solid argument in favor of HPS over LED.
An HPS guy that actually gets it! Well worth the investment in COBs
 

CCCmints

Well-Known Member
HPS is the #1 horticulture lighting sold world wide. Yea everyone doing 10k or more HPS rooms is just stupid, your the only one who will not be.
LED is only now becoming viable. It wasn't always like this. Of-course more people use HPS. To be honest, it took a lot more research for me to even figure out what parts to buy than the average person is willing to do. That makes LED a turn off to a lot of people. I'm not saying they're stupid. I'm saying I don't think someone could come up with an argument in favor of HPS over LED aside from initial cost. Do you have one?
 

OrganicGorilla

Well-Known Member
LED is only now becoming viable. It wasn't always like this. Of-course more people use HPS. To be honest, it took a lot more research for me to even figure out what parts to buy than the average person is willing to do. That makes LED a turn off to a lot of people. I'm not saying they're stupid. I'm saying I don't think someone could come up with an argument in favor of HPS over LED aside from initial cost. Do you have one?
Lower heat and lower electricity bill = win win for COBs
 

CCCmints

Well-Known Member
Does this help? i mean i got more if you need them.
LED grows fire that's been established. I'd like to hear a more technical argument in favor of HPS. Both systems have been proven to grow high quality weed. Which one does it better is the question...
 

OrganicGorilla

Well-Known Member
LED grows fire that's been established. I'd like to hear a more technical argument in favor of HPS. Both systems have been proven to grow high quality weed. Which one does it better is the question...
COBs grow just as dank fat buds as HPS with 30-40% less heat and 30-40% less hydro.
 

GreenLogician

Well-Known Member
I prefer hps for winter because I found with cobs I was heating my whole bedroom to keep the tent warm. Very inefficient
 

CCCmints

Well-Known Member
I prefer hps for winter because I found with cobs I was heating my whole bedroom to keep the tent warm. Very inefficient
You were probably still drawing less power with your LED setup. Not to mention its rather inefficient to heat an entire room just to raise temps in your tent.
 

Lucky Luke

Well-Known Member
LED is only now becoming viable. It wasn't always like this. Of-course more people use HPS. To be honest, it took a lot more research for me to even figure out what parts to buy than the average person is willing to do. That makes LED a turn off to a lot of people. I'm not saying they're stupid. I'm saying I don't think someone could come up with an argument in favor of HPS over LED aside from initial cost. Do you have one?
Thats the crux right there.
LED is confusing for people like me. I just want to buy a light at a reasonable cost. I dont want to build it and i dont want to spend a grand on it. Lots of growers like me want to switch to LED but also know that spending $300 bucks on a panel LED is just a waste of money. We are waiting for it to become available. And by god we will switch!
 

Enigma

Well-Known Member
I don't think I read this right, 10x 1kW HIDs with 10x plants @ 1.5 lb. each?

You could do that with 600W HIDs, and you'd save cooling costs with COBs.

IDK, technology is getting crazy. Even I didn't believe LEDs got to where they are now until I ran the numbers.

Lots of people say the 315W CMH is supposed to outperform the 600W HPS.

I think this setup is more for bragging rights than it is growing.

:leaf:
 
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