Need help building a light

[MadLeaf]

So I've been lurking here for awhile now and I finally decided to replace my good ol' HPS with LEDs.
My tent is a 4x4x6.5 and I'm doing a 2 plant scrog set up (currently under a 600w SE HPS)
At first I thought I should go with 6 3500k and 4 3000k CXB3590s powered by 2 MW HLG-240H-1400B drivers but then I found this forum and got really confused seeing all these threads about QBs, Veros, Citizens etc. Are the Crees really outdated and not worth buying? Can someone please give me a quick explanation about the new chips?
My budget is between $600-$700, what build do you recommend me to go with to achieve overall better yields and even coverage across the canopy?
Also I heard that you can hit 1.5-2gpw pretty easily with the Cree chips, is that true?

Thanks in advance
madleaf

 

[Victor6634]

Go with the quantum boards

 

[MadLeaf]

Go with the quantum boards

Hey, thanks for your reply!
These QBs do look promising but they're really like impossible to get haha, is there another source I can order them from other than HLG?
And what kind of a QB setup would you go with for my space & grow method? (A part list would be lovely)
Thanks
madleaf

 

[blake9999]

Try this out. It's right within your budget.
http://timbergrowlights.com/400-watt-vero29-v7-square-framework/

 

[MadLeaf]

Try this out. It's right within your budget.

Uhmm, isnt it better to have more cobs run softer than fewer ones run harder? Because I can buy 10 cxb3590s and 2 hlg-240h drivers for like 750$ (including heatsinks, holders etc) so I dont see much logic in choosing that kit over the 480w Cree build
Did I get that right?

 

[ganjamystic]

you could start out with 2 of these (2 x $340) kits from hlg, then add a third (+ $340) when you can and run them dimmed down a little.. if you have time to wait on the next restock and if you manage to snag a couple of course..

or you could go with one of these ($610) kits from cutter...
you could space the 10 cobs like this in a 4x4 for even coverage:
O.......O......O
O................O
O................O
O.......O......O

or you could go with one of these ($749) kits from rapidled..
this one has 12 cobs.. you could space them like this:
O..O...O..O
O.............O
O.............O
O..O...O..O

 

[RandomHero8913]

Uhmm, isnt it better to have more cobs run softer than fewer ones run harder? Because I can buy 10 cxb3590s and 2 hlg-240h drivers for like 750$ (including heatsinks, holders etc) so I dont see much logic in choosing that kit over the 480w Cree build
Did I get that right?

Yeah it is, but there comes a point where the extra money spent on COBs, heatsinks, framing, holders, etc. isn't worth it to some. Running COBs soft there really isn't too much of a difference between chips for the most part. So unless you really have your heart set on getting come CXB3590's just grab some Citizen 1212's and save yourself a boatload of money.

 

[ganjamystic]

or you could get two of these (2 x $299) or two of these (2 x $389) kits from timber...

and space them like this for 8 cobs:
O...O...O
O.........O
O...O...O

or, again, like this for 10:
O.......O......O
O................O
O................O
O.......O......O

 

[InTheValley]

I hear cree cxb3070's are better for COBs, $35 a piece.

I personally dig the QBs, but cant get one. Now, Im hooked on the LED strips. Hard to find par readings on them at this time. If anyone has stats on PAR for the Rigid strips, please point me there, lol.

I know the CXB3070s are hitting 600 par at 24inches, i think it was. The Optic3 is using them, and seen a review, and they look like they would rock, at only 50w each. It uses 3 cxb3070s.

If i were to go COBs that would be my choice.

But these strips are interesting. Im doing 20 in a 2x2 tent this week. thats 70,000 lumens, 300 watts.

 

[ganjamystic]

cxb3070s definitely aren't the most efficient right now, nor are cxb3590s... I'm pretty sure vero29 gen7, clu048-1818, and luminus cxm22 are all more efficient and cheaper than crees at this point in time...

@CobKits (cobkits.com) is another source of cobs, drivers, etc. and info..

 

[VegasWinner]

I would DIY four 200w chilledgrowlights.com pcb's - 800w - ($800) on some 5.6"x12" heatsinks from heratsinks USA ($100) and get four HLG-185H-C1050B meanwell drivers ($240) for a total of $1140 or you can replace the chilledgrowlights with four 200w GrowGreen DIY boards for $240 for a total of $580 for 800w of power.

 

[Victor6634]

Hey, thanks for your reply!
These QBs do look promising but they're really like impossible to get haha, is there another source I can order them from other than HLG?
And what kind of a QB setup would you go with for my space & grow method? (A part list would be lovely)
Thanks
madleaf

If you go to their webpage they have a list of vendors that carry their lights

 

[SoOLED]

in a 4x4 a proper amount of any of those choices will work. in that space eviro & feed system are gonna be where your gains are.

2 in buckets, 4 on an ebb-n-flow or six on a flood table.

 

[MadLeaf]

Thanks for the replies!

you could start out with 2 of these (2 x $340) kits from hlg, then add a third (+ $340) when you can and run them dimmed down a little.. if you have time to wait on the next restock and if you manage to snag a couple of course..

or you could go with one of these ($610) kits from cutter...
you could space the 10 cobs like this in a 4x4 for even coverage:
O.......O......O
O................O
O................O
O.......O......O

or you could go with one of these ($749) kits from rapidled..
this one has 12 cobs.. you could space them like this:
O..O...O..O
O.............O
O.............O
O..O...O..O

What about the center? If I go with 12 COBs, wouldn't it be better to go with something like this for example?
O.......O......O
O.......O......O
O.......O......O
O.......O......O
Or this?
O....O....O....O
O....O....O....O
O....O....O....O
And what distance should the lights be kept from the canopy if I go with a setup like that?
I'm aiming for a 500w-600w light if possible btw. I dont think a 250w would be enough for such a big space

 

[Photon Flinger]

Vero 29 fan here. SE with the connector built in is a life saver.

 

[MadLeaf]

in a 4x4 a proper amount of any of those choices will work. in that space eviro & feed system are gonna be where your gains are.

2 in buckets, 4 on an ebb-n-flow or six on a flood table.

What do you think about a 12 cxb3590 setup powered by 2 HLG-240H-C1050Bs?
And what are the differences in terms of ppfd, efficiency, coverage/penetration and overall yields between the setup above and the same setup just with 1212s? Or cxm22s?

 

[MadLeaf]

Vero 29 fan here. SE with the connector built in is a life saver.

But the veros are more efficient when run above 70-100w arent them? Im a little height restricted and I thought running in higher wattage per chip would require me to keep my lights higher above the canopy compared to more chips at less wattage, wouldn't it?

Im really confused.
@Growmau5 @Greengenes707 @REALSTYLES
Mind helping me out, based LED gods?

 

[GBAUTO]

But the veros are more efficient when run above 70-100w arent them? Im a little height restricted and I thought running in higher wattage per chip would require me to keep my lights higher above the canopy compared to more chips at less wattage, wouldn't it?

Im really confused.
@Growmau5 @Greengenes707 @REALSTYLES
Mind helping me out, based LED gods?

I'm not an expert but I did stay at a Holiday Inn, once....

I use the Vero SE's and while they maintain good efficacy at higher power levels compared to say the CXB's, I think that getting an even PPFD spread across your grow area is easier if you have more luminous sources. The issue with height can be a challenge that is mitigated by running more lights at lower intensity.

 

[SoOLED]

What do you think about a 12 cxb3590 setup powered by 2 HLG-240H-C1050Bs?
And what are the differences in terms of ppfd, efficiency, coverage/penetration and overall yields between the setup above and the same setup just with 1212s? Or cxm22s?

I think you're making the same mistake ive seen alot, your are too focused about the light. everything everyone has posted is a good option. there is no best. get whats in your budget and get to work.

 

[ganjamystic]

Thanks for the replies!

What about the center? If I go with 12 COBs, wouldn't it be better to go with something like this for example?
O.......O......O
O.......O......O
O.......O......O
O.......O......O
Or this?
O....O....O....O
O....O....O....O
O....O....O....O
And what distance should the lights be kept from the canopy if I go with a setup like that?
I'm aiming for a 500w-600w light if possible btw. I dont think a 250w would be enough for such a big space

All of the layouts I showed you purposefully have no cobs in the center. This will give you a more even spread with similar PAR readings at all points instead of a super bright hotspot in the center with dimmer edges and corners.