K.I.S.S. Retailers hate me..

[Logan Burke]

I also use Silica, Jypsy, for that reason exactly. While I use it for more of a general stress and extra Potassium additive (Armor Si, 0-0-1 Silica additive), I'm sure it helps plants tolerate higher temps.

Where I grow room temps are > 80-90*+ 7 months of the year

My rezes are ~ 3 gallons, without help they are the same as room temps

For years I used air stones, then read about replacing them with lp pump. My smallest pump is 160 gph. I did not realize that running 24/7 would bring the water to > 95*s. 2 days of this definitely damaged my roots and consequently the primary leafs, which probably affected the final weight

I made a couple changes, replaced a kitty litter container with a Igloo cooler, put the pump on a deep cycle timer 5/15 off, employed a Hydro Halo drip ring for added agitation, + I replace blue ice blocks 2-3xs/day. Will be starting with this once the babies are ready to move to the main lights
View attachment 3930378

Are you substituting an airpump by using the water pump to reduce the temperature in your water, or is it simply a different method you wanted to try? I must say, while plenty of people use a water pump in hydro successfully, if you are doing it purely to reduce heat, I would really just bite the bullet and get a water chiller.....I've seen folks do just fine at upper 70, even low 80 degree water while running beneficials. But high 80s or 90s....I think with how much innovation you've already shown, you could probably create a similar system (running an exhuast tube from an air pump to an AC unit, etc) and achieve the same lowered temperatures.
Best of luck to you!!

For anyone else having heat problems from their airpump, I've found that a clip on desk fan blowing on the airpump at all times can make a large difference....for me, it easily keeps my water at least 2-5F degrees cooler. And I am running a 120lpm pump with at least 5 out of 12 of the valves shut off (10 of them are shut off right now) at all times, and even now with over 60lpm going to a single 5gal bucket, it creates very minimal heat. 75F degree weather in my tent creates 70F water...then again, I am on concrete floors in my basement. That, I am sure, makes a big difference.

Dgringo
Definitely following this thread. For my first grow i started DWC, to much heat. Pulled them all and planted in soil. They are doing great. But would like to go back to DWC. My whole concept of DWC was that I would NOT have to pump water.
Watching closely. And will probably try DWC again after this crop is harvested

Smokey

Hello Smokey; I switched from recirculating DWC to standalones for the same purpose you stated. Just to get an idea of your setup, how big was/is your air pump you plan on using on your second attempt?...Consider using a fan as I described above for some heat dissipation. Were you using any beneficial microbes your last DWC, such as Hydroguard, Orca, Great White, etc?....What kind of light were the plants under?...For HID lights, wrapping your buckets with mylar/reflective material can make a great difference...I think you will be able to do DWC by using some of these methods, combined altogether, they can help a lot with water temps.

 

[Smokey57]

I also use Silica, Jypsy, for that reason exactly. While I use it for more of a general stress and extra Potassium additive (Armor Si, 0-0-1 Silica additive), I'm sure it helps plants tolerate higher temps.

Are you substituting an airpump by using the water pump to reduce the temperature in your water, or is it simply a different method you wanted to try? I must say, while plenty of people use a water pump in hydro successfully, if you are doing it purely to reduce heat, I would really just bite the bullet and get a water chiller.....I've seen folks do just fine at upper 70, even low 80 degree water while running beneficials. But high 80s or 90s....I think with how much innovation you've already shown, you could probably create a similar system (running an exhuast tube from an air pump to an AC unit, etc) and achieve the same lowered temperatures.
Best of luck to you!!

For anyone else having heat problems from their airpump, I've found that a clip on desk fan blowing on the airpump at all times can make a large difference....for me, it easily keeps my water at least 2-5F degrees cooler. And I am running a 120lpm pump with at least 5 out of 12 of the valves shut off (10 of them are shut off right now) at all times, and even now with over 60lpm going to a single 5gal bucket, it creates very minimal heat. 75F degree weather in my tent creates 70F water...then again, I am on concrete floors in my basement. That, I am sure, makes a big difference.

Hello Smokey; I switched from recirculating DWC to standalones for the same purpose you stated. Just to get an idea of your setup, how big was/is your air pump you plan on using on your second attempt?...Consider using a fan as I described above for some heat dissipation. Were you using any beneficial microbes your last DWC, such as Hydroguard, Orca, Great White, etc?....What kind of light were the plants under?...For HID lights, wrapping your buckets with mylar/reflective material can make a great difference...I think you will be able to do DWC by using some of these methods, combined altogether, they can help a lot with water temps.

LB love the initials. lol
the air pump is 951 GPH. it was out side the tent, even added extra air line thru a cooler full of ice, didn't help. I believe the hot water was due to heat in tent getting to 85+ water to 75+. never got any slime on roots but growth had all but stopped.
No beneficial Microbes, didn't know what they were. still looking into it, but it looks like the solution i was looking for and couldn't find it at the time.
lights are 2-600w with hoods. in a 5x5 tent
Now that the beauties are in soil. i have to add heat during the dark hours as it gets to cool overnight. 62F ain"t that a laugh. Still have 4-5 weeks of flowering before i start the next set.

 

[Jypsy Dog]

I don't usually grow in the warm times here, AZ. I just go "Old School " when I do.

 

[visajoe1]

DWC- no water pump
RDWC- water pump needed

 

[Logan Burke]

View attachment 3930759
LB love the initials. lol
the air pump is 951 GPH. it was out side the tent, even added extra air line thru a cooler full of ice, didn't help. I believe the hot water was due to heat in tent getting to 85+ water to 75+. never got any slime on roots but growth had all but stopped.
No beneficial Microbes, didn't know what they were. still looking into it, but it looks like the solution i was looking for and couldn't find it at the time.
lights are 2-600w with hoods. in a 5x5 tent
Now that the beauties are in soil. i have to add heat during the dark hours as it gets to cool overnight. 62F ain"t that a laugh. Still have 4-5 weeks of flowering before i start the next set.

Those really are quite some beauties you have grown! I'd be happy to see the finished plant(s)! Anyways, yes you def did everything right with your pump, outside the tent is a big help, sounds like cooling off the inside of your tent will be the key to your success (along with running beneficial microbes for the real hot days). Running Hydroguard I can have 75F water oftenly without problems, as long as it gets to cool back off at night time. And with this crazy weather I totally hear ya! One day you're about to buy another AC unit and the next you're looking at heaters! Lol. May I ask how many CFM you have circulating? I have two 192Cfm fans in a 6x6 with one closed hood 600w (one fan in, one out) blowing air through my cooltube and I know, specifically with cooltubes, if you do not have enough or barely enough airflow, heat can become a problem quite easily! I personally am having heat problems at my canopy (not water) with the 192cfm inline. And is that air pump to one plant? While I've seen amazing plants using 5lpm pumps per 5gal bucket, the more air you can get to your water the better...running an exhaust tube to an AC unit is an easy one if you have an AC unit, or keeping air blowing over the air pump, I believe this should be done either way for the air pump's sake running 24/7....I think you're gonna kill it (in a good way lmao) by tweaking just a thing or two and accessing any other factors, such as do you need higher CFM fans, do you need to try to run your hot air outside instead of the same room, etc etc...I think 80-85F air temps will be your max desired air temps running Hydroguard or Great White. Beneficials, for a long time, were looked down upon by many growers that had never used them and run sterile rez's. Hey, if you can run sterile w/o H202 all the time, awesome. But now more and more growers are beginning to use Hydroguard and other bennies to prevent root rot in the first place, so the information is much more 'at your fingertips'. Warm air temps can still cause low O2 levels, but 75F water my babies survive just fine. I can't wait to see your next DWC grow should you decide to! And thanks! Im the only guy dumb enough to post his real name on a public forum lmfao.

 

[Logan Burke]

I don't usually grow in the warm times here, AZ. I just go "Old School " when I do.View attachment 3930910 View attachment 3930911 View attachment 3930912

When you say "Old School", what do you mean? Looks like you have a nice DWC and scrog system there. Being in an ice chest, I wonder if one could put and continue to exchange cool water into the cooler, submerging the bottom half of the bucket, cooling off the water inside the bucket as long as cool water is replenished in the ice chest? Just an idea off the top of my stoned ass head....lol, sorry for the run-on.
EDIT: I now see that is exactly what you've done, my apologies! Lol, very good idea though, I think many people should consider this as an option if heat alone is a barrier from doing DWC!

 

[Jypsy Dog]

When you say "Old School", what do you mean? Looks like you have a nice DWC and scrog system there. Being in an ice chest, I wonder if one could put and continue to exchange cool water into the cooler, submerging the bottom half of the bucket, cooling off the water inside the bucket as long as cool water is replenished in the ice chest? Just an idea off the top of my stoned ass head....lol, sorry for the run-on.
EDIT: I now see that is exactly what you've done, my apologies! Lol, very good idea though, I think many people should consider this as an option if heat alone is a barrier from doing DWC!

So far, so good. Nutes stay @ 66/68 for a 10 hr period.

 

[Smokey57]

Those really are quite some beauties you have grown! I'd be happy to see the finished plant(s)! Anyways, yes you def did everything right with your pump, outside the tent is a big help, sounds like cooling off the inside of your tent will be the key to your success (along with running beneficial microbes for the real hot days). Running Hydroguard I can have 75F water oftenly without problems, as long as it gets to cool back off at night time. And with this crazy weather I totally hear ya! One day you're about to buy another AC unit and the next you're looking at heaters! Lol. May I ask how many CFM you have circulating? I have two 192Cfm fans in a 6x6 with one closed hood 600w (one fan in, one out) blowing air through my cooltube and I know, specifically with cooltubes, if you do not have enough or barely enough airflow, heat can become a problem quite easily! I personally am having heat problems at my canopy (not water) with the 192cfm inline. And is that air pump to one plant? While I've seen amazing plants using 5lpm pumps per 5gal bucket, the more air you can get to your water the better...running an exhaust tube to an AC unit is an easy one if you have an AC unit, or keeping air blowing over the air pump, I believe this should be done either way for the air pump's sake running 24/7....I think you're gonna kill it (in a good way lmao) by tweaking just a thing or two and accessing any other factors, such as do you need higher CFM fans, do you need to try to run your hot air outside instead of the same room, etc etc...I think 80-85F air temps will be your max desired air temps running Hydroguard or Great White. Beneficials, for a long time, were looked down upon by many growers that had never used them and run sterile rez's. Hey, if you can run sterile w/o H202 all the time, awesome. But now more and more growers are beginning to use Hydroguard and other bennies to prevent root rot in the first place, so the information is much more 'at your fingertips'. Warm air temps can still cause low O2 levels, but 75F water my babies survive just fine. I can't wait to see your next DWC grow should you decide to! And thanks! Im the only guy dumb enough to post his real name on a public forum lmfao.

LB
You sure do like to type, one of the longer post. I really appreciate the effort.
I am running an inline 460 CFM fan drawing thru a 6x14 carbon filter, and both my 600w hood d lights in a 5x5 gorilla tent, vented directly outside. The air pump is supposed to feed 8 5 gallon buckets, I had 6 hooked up. I like the a/c exhaust idea but really have no need for it me here (north of 60 parallel) just pump more air in from outside. Lol.
I just have to see if I can find the products you mentioned in Canada. Can be a problem sometimes.

Smokey

 

[Logan Burke]

Lmao I can't help it, I get into it and just keep going and going....apologies! And I like your setup, your fan certainly packs plenty of a punch, so I don't think that's gonna be an issue (correct me if I'm wrong veteran growers). All of the products I've mentioned I order off of Amazon, every one of my nutrients actually. I'm on the east coast in the bible belt, we don't have any hydro stores lol. And if you can solve your heat problems, you should look into a stronger air pump...I got my hydrofarm pump off of Amazon and they come in many different sizes...might be worth checking out, and its easy to make bigger pumps quiet as a whisper, just screw them down to a cheap wooden stool/table with carboard underneath. By the way, that would be a perfect way to keep your water cool!! Assuming it doesn't get it too cold. If so, just get a bigger air pump, the 120lpm on Amazon that I bought gets HOT without a fan on it.
P.S. No problem at all, I tend to talk too much, but if you can tolerate it, I always like helping people solve their problems. RIU has helped me, so I try to give back my experiences. Ugh, another long one....lmao..
L.B.

 

[Dgringo69]

Have you ever used or experimented with SOS (Super Organic Stimulator) as well? It's a concoction of bennies that were specifically chosen for their hardiness in a variety of conditions. Did some research and its got some pretty glowing reviews. Would love to put away my chiller as well and am interested to know how these bacteria and fungi interact. I read recently that Trichoderma may eat other bacteria and can prevent mycorrhizal inoculation so too much overlap may be a waste. Really interested in this topic.

Yes I have began to understand that too much, or any of the hydroguard may simple overtake any of the other bennies that are added. So either run hydroguard only or leave it out. I will be experimenting with this on my next run. The girls are getting close to harvest now and look beautiful. I have a Tangie (reg from Crockett Family Farms) that was selected from 12 phenos that is the best strain I've ever ran..prolific, easy, high yield, resinous, potent sweet orange taste that stays through cure and transfers to concentrate. The shatter tastes like orange/peach candy. Not extremely impressed with a Dark Heart Nursery GDP that I'm running.

 

[Dgringo69]

Great info on this thread. The one thing I don't see in the mix is SILICA. Why is that? I grow in a warm area, and add it for the "Stress" factor. Among other reasons.

I actually cut out silica just to simplify my recipe (add to the KISS factor) Silica has such an impact on ph that I think it is responsible for unnecessary ph swing as the plant consumes it. I used to use it as a ph up but find that good ole GH PH UP works better for me.

 

[Dgringo69]

Dgringo
Definitely following this thread. For my first grow i started DWC, to much heat. Pulled them all and planted in soil. They are doing great. But would like to go back to DWC. My whole concept of DWC was that I would NOT have to pump water.
Watching closely. And will probably try DWC again after this crop is harvested

Smokey

I can say confidently that if you trust in your bennies then you don't have to worry about your temps. Liberating huh? Let me get some bud shots posted in a while

 

[Dgringo69]

Here are a couple of pics. Sorry I didn't have a bright blue light for close ups so I had to use my hps but you should get the point. The larger plant is the Tangie and the smaller Kens GDP, the plants are the same age and have had the same conditions throughout..you can see my dismay with the GDP! Also the GDP doesn't really have the GDP smell I was hoping for, I cross my fingers that it develops later..but my hopes aren't high. Probably not running this one again. The Tangie however is a winner. As far as the close ups go the Tangie is the more resinous and the other is GDP.

 

[Dgringo69]

A little closer on the Tangie

 

[dbkick]

Cool waters, no light.

 

[Smokey57]

Lmao I can't help it, I get into it and just keep going and going....apologies! And I like your setup, your fan certainly packs plenty of a punch, so I don't think that's gonna be an issue (correct me if I'm wrong veteran growers). All of the products I've mentioned I order off of Amazon, every one of my nutrients actually. I'm on the east coast in the bible belt, we don't have any hydro stores lol. And if you can solve your heat problems, you should look into a stronger air pump...I got my hydrofarm pump off of Amazon and they come in many different sizes...might be worth checking out, and its easy to make bigger pumps quiet as a whisper, just screw them down to a cheap wooden stool/table with carboard underneath. By the way, that would be a perfect way to keep your water cool!! Assuming it doesn't get it too cold. If so, just get a bigger air pump, the 120lpm on Amazon that I bought gets HOT without a fan on it.
P.S. No problem at all, I tend to talk too much, but if you can tolerate it, I always like helping people solve their problems. RIU has helped me, so I try to give back my experiences. Ugh, another long one....lmao..
L.B.

i still have another month before harvest, so it will be a little while before i start the DWC. Will be ordering the bennies this week. I only need the 3 products correct? Hydroguard (32oz), Orca (16oz), and Great White (8oz powder). is that enuf for a 8 - 4 gallon bucket DWC? thought i would wrap the buckets with reflective mylar and add a small fan blowing over the air pump.

I usually post my pictures on the CLUB 600 forum (https://www.rollitup.org/t/club-600.285620/page-5450) You should be able to follow the updates there.

here is todays pictures

 

[Smokey57]

i still have another month before harvest, so it will be a little while before i start the DWC. Will be ordering the bennies this week. I only need the 3 products correct? Hydroguard (32oz), Orca (16oz), and Great White (8oz powder). is that enuf for a 8 - 4 gallon bucket DWC? thought i would wrap the buckets with reflective mylar and add a small fan blowing over the air pump.

I usually post my pictures on the CLUB 600 forum (https://www.rollitup.org/t/club-600.285620/page-5450) You should be able to follow the updates there.

here is todays pictures

wrong picture try this one

 

[Dgringo69]

i still have another month before harvest, so it will be a little while before i start the DWC. Will be ordering the bennies this week. I only need the 3 products correct? Hydroguard (32oz), Orca (16oz), and Great White (8oz powder). is that enuf for a 8 - 4 gallon bucket DWC? thought i would wrap the buckets with reflective mylar and add a small fan blowing over the air pump.

I usually post my pictures on the CLUB 600 forum (https://www.rollitup.org/t/club-600.285620/page-5450) You should be able to follow the updates there.

here is todays pictures

Great white has everything that hydroguard and orca has. You would really be doubling up. I would either go with great white or hydroguard and orca. With my next run I will run one with hydroguard only, one with orca only and one with great white only under the high temps and see how they hold up individually. Currently I use orca, HG, and subculture b..this combo has allowed me to beat root rot and stay root rot free at 82-85 water temps. This conbination came about for no other reason than I was throwing everying but the kitchen sink at the root rot..mind you the root rot was plaguing me while water temps were around 70. After I beat the rot I decided to see how well my roots were truly protected so then I pulled the chiller and let the temps climb as high as they would go. Been maintains health roots at high temps for months now.
So, I feel like the entire combo isn't fully needed and can be further simplified but I just haven't gotten to that point yet.

 

[Logan Burke]

Very nice setup! Using those containers; do you feel they help insulate the water from heat better? And is that a water chiller or a portable AC unit?...Im sure a chiller takes a lot of worrying out of the equation, or constantly temp checking anyhow....but if root rot still occurs, benefical microbes are in my opinion the go-to solution. If for no other reason, bennies make root growth EXPLODE ha.Very nice setup DB; it looks like you've a very nice grow in the making.
And I use Silica in 5 gal buckets, while it does raise my PH initially, I've not had any PH swings *crosses fingers* hahaha. I'm sure it helps roots tolerate some additional amount of stress, but idk if I'd add it to Dgring's concoction as it's more of a benny/root rot preventative formula.

Yes I have began to understand that too much, or any of the hydroguard may simple overtake any of the other bennies that are added. So either run hydroguard only or leave it out. I will be experimenting with this on my next run. The girls are getting close to harvest now and look beautiful. I have a Tangie (reg from Crockett Family Farms) that was selected from 12 phenos that is the best strain I've ever ran..prolific, easy, high yield, resinous, potent sweet orange taste that stays through cure and transfers to concentrate. The shatter tastes like orange/peach candy. Not extremely impressed with a Dark Heart Nursery GDP that I'm running.

I am glad to know hydroguard may wipe one bacteria strand or another out, guessing that Hydroguard would be all you'd have left in your rez IF that did happen, idk, you know bennies much better than I Dgring!
If only I had a camera that would take half decent pics under an HPS.... *sigh* lol my last plant left to harvest is Tran-Siberian Automatic and it is literally my first picture perfect-bud producing plant...10-12 5-15gram heads, like it naturally lollipopped itself, haha...water has been staying at 75 degrees the past week as well, still no probs. Just the plants drinking more water than when it is cooler...
P.S. Very beautiful ladies you have Dgring! O.O

 

[Dgringo69]

Very nice setup! Using those containers; do you feel they help insulate the water from heat better? And is that a water chiller or a portable AC unit?...Im sure a chiller takes a lot of worrying out of the equation, or constantly temp checking anyhow....but if root rot still occurs, benefical microbes are in my opinion the go-to solution. If for no other reason, bennies make root growth EXPLODE ha.Very nice setup DB; it looks like you've a very nice grow in the making.
And I use Silica in 5 gal buckets, while it does raise my PH initially, I've not had any PH swings *crosses fingers* hahaha. I'm sure it helps roots tolerate some additional amount of stress, but idk if I'd add it to Dgring's concoction as it's more of a benny/root rot preventative formula.

I am glad to know hydroguard may wipe one bacteria strand or another out, guessing that Hydroguard would be all you'd have left in your rez IF that did happen, idk, you know bennies much better than I Dgring!
If only I had a camera that would take half decent pics under an HPS.... *sigh* lol my last plant left to harvest is Tran-Siberian Automatic and it is literally my first picture perfect-bud producing plant...10-12 5-15gram heads, like it naturally lollipopped itself, haha...water has been staying at 75 degrees the past week as well, still no probs. Just the plants drinking more water than when it is cooler...
P.S. Very beautiful ladies you have Dgring! O.O

Thanks brother! Hands down, Great White sports the longest list of ingredients on its label. I have a feeling that if used alone, it would out perform any other stand alones or concoctions. I will do a side by side of 3 or 4 different brands next run.
Have you heard of Mammoth P? It's a microbial additive that is supposed to break down phosphorus in order to make it more available to your plants..they claim a 30% yield increase..you know how that goes! It is too pricey for my blood, also I don't think it offers any root zone protection. I would be interested in doing a side by side with that stuff for sure. With bennies, unless you have a good microscope and know what the heck you are looking for, you really just have to trust they are doing their job or not fighting over the same space. As long as I have healthy roots I don't really care