You really need to re read what I wrote. Clearly it says using water that has no nutrients which mean nutrient free water. And you don't actually flush the media you first your plants to absorb the nutrients in the media. Pay attention please if your going to argue. Yes some nutrients will wash out of the media but mainly it's yours place to absorbing those nutrients. And what flawless finish doesn't on a microscopic level is blow up your ions in the water to a big size which prevents your plant from using the nutrients in the water. So it uses nutrients in the media. The you stoplease the flawless finish because the media is now flushed of nutrientshatter through the plant absorbing them. Then no more good stuff left in media je next is the leaves.
Flushing first DWC grow
- Thread starter Med4us
- Start date
Dumme
Well-Known Member
I suggest you please learn as much as you can, outside cannabis growers on how plants grow, as I'm sure you learned "flushing is good for better taste" from people whom are also mis-informed. Good luck, my friend, as I my intentions were not of that to argue.
And to say there is no evidence behind it. Well next time you get great looking bud with a shitty taste or burn then go to the grower and find out exactly what was done like we did and you will find out 9 out of 10 times a a shitty bur and shitty smoke in great looking bup isn't flushed properly.
Dumme
Well-Known Member
Dumme
Well-Known Member
I've been to many growers for cannabis in my younger years, and never again, especially with all the mos-information going around (i.e. Like this subject).
Let me re-assert that Chlorophyll is the reason why harsh smoke and chemical taste happens. If you've been smoking stuff like that, the grower needs to learn more before hooking you up.
Pat666
Well-Known Member
Good question. I've seen multiple people write and ask questions here and in other sites about "flushing their DWC" sorry to have offended you with my stupidity I beg your pardon
Dumme
Well-Known Member
Stupidity and ignorance are two completely different things. The site is full of mis-information. This subject I predict, will unfortunately repeat itself endlessly because of all the pseudoscience.
Douglas.Curtis
Well-Known Member
$0.02 from a long time DWC grower...
I prefer DWC, it's been the absolute easiest method I've used to grow the cleanest cannabis. Having to keep the res at 68F means my canopy is at 71-72F, perfect for high quality cannabis. Using reverse osmosis water means there are no excess elements from my water for cannabis to absorb. Using pharmaceutical grade nutrients, balanced for cannabis and a full pH swing, I grow what people call "The smoothest, softest hitting, most flavorful and aromatic, organic bud I've ever tasted."
How do I do it?
Mono-crop per reservoir, all plants require the same feed level, use clones for exact timing and nute requirements
Feed the bare minimum nutrients necessary for full and robust growth
Watch your transpiration rates, keep them high as oil production starts (this auto 'fades' the plants)
Change your res out (one and only one time) at the end for plain reverse osmosis water. Osmosis will pull excess nutes from the plant.
Cannabis is a dynamic accumulator, any excess of an element and any element absorbed which is not needed for growth... gets packed into new growth where it stays forever. You can flush or fade forever and that junk isn't coming back out. Only elements still moving in the plant and a few select elements 'properly' used for new growth can be flushed/faded out.
When done right your cannabis will burn smooth, feel soft and cool (difficult to tell you're even getting a hit) and will be so full of flavor and aroma it'll knock your socks off. You'll be biting the smoke as you exhale, it's that damn tasty, even after being burned.
The last hit in the bowl will barely have a burnt taste or smell to it, almost as tasty and delicious as the first hit. The ash will be light and fluffy, slightly off-white, and drop out easily with a tap or puff of air.
Cannabis flowers like this...
So... I recommend both fading and flushing cannabis, regardless of the methods you use to feed it. It makes a significant difference in the end product.
Douglas
I prefer DWC, it's been the absolute easiest method I've used to grow the cleanest cannabis. Having to keep the res at 68F means my canopy is at 71-72F, perfect for high quality cannabis. Using reverse osmosis water means there are no excess elements from my water for cannabis to absorb. Using pharmaceutical grade nutrients, balanced for cannabis and a full pH swing, I grow what people call "The smoothest, softest hitting, most flavorful and aromatic, organic bud I've ever tasted."
How do I do it?
Mono-crop per reservoir, all plants require the same feed level, use clones for exact timing and nute requirements
Feed the bare minimum nutrients necessary for full and robust growth
Watch your transpiration rates, keep them high as oil production starts (this auto 'fades' the plants)
Change your res out (one and only one time) at the end for plain reverse osmosis water. Osmosis will pull excess nutes from the plant.
Cannabis is a dynamic accumulator, any excess of an element and any element absorbed which is not needed for growth... gets packed into new growth where it stays forever. You can flush or fade forever and that junk isn't coming back out. Only elements still moving in the plant and a few select elements 'properly' used for new growth can be flushed/faded out.
When done right your cannabis will burn smooth, feel soft and cool (difficult to tell you're even getting a hit) and will be so full of flavor and aroma it'll knock your socks off. You'll be biting the smoke as you exhale, it's that damn tasty, even after being burned.
The last hit in the bowl will barely have a burnt taste or smell to it, almost as tasty and delicious as the first hit. The ash will be light and fluffy, slightly off-white, and drop out easily with a tap or puff of air.
Cannabis flowers like this...
So... I recommend both fading and flushing cannabis, regardless of the methods you use to feed it. It makes a significant difference in the end product.
Douglas
Dumme
Well-Known Member
Well Douglas, if you don't mind answering.
What's pharmaceutical grade nutrients?
And if theyre pharmaceutica nutrients, how it's it still organic bud?
Is there a source as to where you acquired info that cannabis is a dynamic accumulator?
You mentioned Monocropping. Do youu keep one crop per tent? Or just one plant per reservoir. ...and if so,
How do you measure you transpiration rate vs evaporation rate? And how would you increase them when oil begins , ...and what oil?
What's pharmaceutical grade nutrients?
And if theyre pharmaceutica nutrients, how it's it still organic bud?
Is there a source as to where you acquired info that cannabis is a dynamic accumulator?
You mentioned Monocropping. Do youu keep one crop per tent? Or just one plant per reservoir. ...and if so,
How do you measure you transpiration rate vs evaporation rate? And how would you increase them when oil begins , ...and what oil?
Are you to imply N, P, K, Ca, Mg, S, B, Mn, Mb, Cu, Fe, Cl, and Zn, somehow get stored in the cells of the plant in raw form?
Does this mean the few chemicals you use, are what you think make the buds grow directly?
Douglas.Curtis
Well-Known Member
Pharmaceutical grade means 99.9% free of contaminants. I never said it was organic, I said people call it organic. I've been called a liar when I tell them it's hydro. Multiple times.
Dynamic accumulator?
Heavy Metals http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4235884/
Potassium, Silica https://www.cannabis-world.org/vanilla/discussion/1788/dynamic-nutrient-accumulator-plants
Copper http://web1.sssup.it/pubblicazioni/ugov_files/303124_2004_153.pdf
Hydrocarbons and PCB's, Heavy Metals, Radionuclides http://www.ibaf.cnr.it/phytoremediation/cannabis-sativa-cd-cr-ni-pb-zn-organics-radionuclides.pdf
Monocropping? I use one strain per reservoir, can be one or many plants, all must be from the same mum.
Evaporation rate stays the same throughout a flower run. Transpiration rate changes, you can see the change when you go to top off your reservoir. (yes, I manually top off for several reasons) Transpiration changes as nutrient needs of the plant change. Lower your nutrient strength and transpiration goes up.
What oil? Cannabinoid and terpene oils, silly.
I say "oil production" when I really mean "Main Oil Production." Cannabinoids and terpenes are constantly being produced during flower, they increase after the main swelling of flower structures slows, about a month into flower for most 60'ish day strains.Yes, elements are stored in new growth in their raw form. Just look at a 12" plant, transplanted and thrown straight into flower using a heavily amended supersoil. Massive contamination from excess elements, hot smoke, dark ash, poor yield. What do you think is the cause of the dark green? (Edit: I meant the dark color of the plant, not dark green. Apologies)
I grow with refined minerals. The main Macro elements NPK and the standard Micro Iron, manganese, sulfur and so on. The only 'chemicals' (by your definition, I believe) would be the ammonium nitrate, for the nitrogen. Everything else is mined out of the ground and refined to 99.9% purity. Much cleaner than organics, btw.
Yes, the NPK and micro elements are what cannabis use to grow directly. The only non-essential element I use is silicon, during veg and stretch, for structural and vascular tissue system strength. Don't ever use silicon/silica in flower, it's completely unnecessary for flower formation. It also burns hot and harsh, not a pleasant thing.
Does that help?
Douglas
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Dumme
Well-Known Member
Not really...
It might seem like im tearing into you, but im not. Im just trying to understand why you wrote your post the way you did. I find it very criptic and very hard to understand. Sorry for saying, but it just sound like a used car sale, the way you posted.
You didnt say it, but implied that it was organic in you wording.
Why even post it then?
All fruiting plants would be a "dynamic accumulator" by the definition in the sources you listed, as theyre using what's, toxic to humans, but required by large fruiting plants. Man,... who puts arsenic in there reservoir? Were you speaking of controlled grows, as most of us don't use cannabis for the intended purpose to clean the environment , or just tossing seeds in the wild, for harvest?
..Ok, ok, so your plants are controlled nutrients....as is everyones is whom grow here.
Where exactly within the plant do you think plants store their raw nutrients? What cell within the cannabis plant wants to store nitrogen, for example? Or did you mean, "use" instead of "store". I'm only asking because it seem like your implying cannabis has an storage chamber somewhere that the elements get trapped.
It might seem like im tearing into you, but im not. Im just trying to understand why you wrote your post the way you did. I find it very criptic and very hard to understand. Sorry for saying, but it just sound like a used car sale, the way you posted.
You didnt say it, but implied that it was organic in you wording.
...oh, other people say it's organic...
Why even post it then?
All fruiting plants would be a "dynamic accumulator" by the definition in the sources you listed, as theyre using what's, toxic to humans, but required by large fruiting plants. Man,... who puts arsenic in there reservoir? Were you speaking of controlled grows, as most of us don't use cannabis for the intended purpose to clean the environment , or just tossing seeds in the wild, for harvest?
..Ok, ok, so your plants are controlled nutrients....as is everyones is whom grow here.
So, what exactly do you think people use as nutrients, whom are on this site? What contaminants do you speak of?
Where exactly within the plant do you think plants store their raw nutrients? What cell within the cannabis plant wants to store nitrogen, for example? Or did you mean, "use" instead of "store". I'm only asking because it seem like your implying cannabis has an storage chamber somewhere that the elements get trapped.
So when your lights are on (vs) when your light are off, RH never changes? How do you accomplish this?
Are you implying that hot smoke, and dark ash is directly related to nutrients used? Because it sounds like you're referring to undried, uncured buds, which have nothing to do with nutrients.
Im not sure how to interpret this. You're mining it? Or the plant mines it? ..and if the plant mines it, how is it not organic, or, "cleaner than organic"?
Douglas.Curtis
Well-Known Member
To point out how cleanly you can grow cannabis with clean nutrients.
No, most plants are not dynamic accumulators. Cucumbers do not absorb excess nutrients and make cucumbers out of them, at least not nearly to the same degree as dynamic accumulators do. Organic and Hydro grown plants both look the same, when they have too much nutrient in the root zone, they look dark and their growth suffers. The higher the amendment/nutrient strength, the slower the plant grows and the lower the yield.
Cannabis is extremely sensitive to overfeeding, much more than the majority of growers realize.
The majority of nutrients being used for cannabis are "hobby" nutrients, nowhere near pharmaceutical grade. Agricultural and Horticultural grade are usually not pharmaceutical grade. GH, AN and a few others are.
Any elements that exceed the natural plant capacity for 'reserves' is tucked out of the way. Read up on dynamic accumulator plants. They mainly store it in the new growth tips, which are the flowers during flower.
It's called environmental control.
I'm stating that dark cannabis is because of excess nutrients or elements absorbed during flower. Nutrients, silica, tap water contaminants, whatever. Cannabis absorbs it and packs it into new growth when it has no immediate use for it.
Dried, cured bud will be harsh and leave a dark ash, when it was improperly grown in the first place. Locked in excess does not flush/fade out.
Mined, out of th earth by machines, refined in a factory to remove contaminants. People have a misconception about refined mineral nutrients vs organic nutrients.
Does that help?
Douglas
Douglas.Curtis
Well-Known Member
TYVM
Spent a lot of time on this subject, lol, nearly been divorced several times over it. (wife gets tired of seeing the back of my head all the time, sitting at a computer looking up new stuff to experiment with.)
Douglas
Dumme
Well-Known Member
Be nice...
Ok, "tons" of plants, better? "Very long lists" of commonly grown fruiting plants.
And there's probably a ton that haven't been tested.
It's my understanding Silica and Potassium the only two elements that are relevant to cannabis. I'm not exactly sure what effect Silica toxicity would have, but Potassium toxicity is not dark cannabis. (I'm assuming leaves)
This sound like nitrogen to me, being one of the most used nutrients feed.
I'd be nice if you had a source of where you got your information from.
Lol lol Douglas Curtis good job man. No sensemble wasting your breath on this guy. Couple stupid questions. How does he keep his rh. Well how do you think. I am sure he is a smart guy and has his environment controls down to a t. With my setup. Whatever I set my digital readout to it gets it there within 5 minutes. DehumidifieING is a little slower to reach your number. And once again typical typical person saying hot black smoke and ash is due to uncured undried bud. Typical response from someone who doesn't know. And if you follow some top growers and top medical facilities they absolutely flushe or do whatever they do to remove trace minerals from there plants. And for growers at home who don't have the finances to grow all organic or whatever the case do there best to flush minerals out. That is if they care about what they are smoking and not trying to make money. It just makes sense. I sound like a niobium and thatsee because I am Douglas Curtis I'm very impressed with what you had to say.
Dumme
Well-Known Member
I really don't understand what the hell your talking about.
Dumme
Well-Known Member
I don't know why you come here, but I come here to learn and share. Why you would down anyone be asking "how", is simply retarded and unproductive.
I never once said douglas is full of shit, he's just new. I know very little about him or his grow.
While I may or may not agree with his methods, understand his method is key to my personal knowledge and growth.
Grow up
I never once said douglas is full of shit, he's just new. I know very little about him or his grow.
While I may or may not agree with his methods, understand his method is key to my personal knowledge and growth.
Grow up
You clearly don't understand how botany works.