ttystikk
Well-Known Member
To an ultra conservative authoritarian, EVERYONE to their left is a socialist, or worse.
EXCUSE ME?!..The OFFICIAL Bernie Sanders For President 2016 Thread
- Thread starter schuylaar
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BustinScales510
Well-Known Member
Who are you voting for if Sanders doesnt get the nomination?
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
Well I am, as my father once so incisively put it, vacillating forthrightly!
I'm a political centrist. The only one of those in the race is Mr Sanders. The rest, including the other 'Democrat' in the race, are all right wing authoritarian nut jobs who are okay with the status quo, but for maybe a tweak or two.
Voting FOR Shillary as a vote against the Republican nominee strikes me viscerally as a distinction without enough difference to matter, although @Fogdog was persuasive in his argument that she wouldn't be 'as bad'.
WHY THE FUCK WOULD I WANT TO VOTE FOR 'NOT AS BAD'?!
The Democratic party is just as bought and paid for as the Republican side, their job now is to continue enacting corporate friendly policies while saying they aren't as onerous as if the Republicans did it.
I'm just not sure I could live with myself if I supported that with my vote. I am far from alone; I keep running across anecdotal evidence of a mass movement within Democratic voters, especially younger ones, that if they can't vote for their beloved Bernie they will just stay home.
How big a movement this is I don't know... but it wouldn't have to be a very big proportion of the party to sink Mrs Clinton in the general, seeing how she's already polling just nose to nose with Ted Cruz.
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
Man.. I just can't argue with this..
Everything you said here is exactly right..
So what are we to do?
Take it to its irrational conclusion, Trump wins. Then what? 4 years of mayhem, more debt, more xenophobia/racism. Then 2020, rebuilding on all of that, and a likely economic crash. Unemployment, social issues, more gun control issues since more people are killing people.. More natural disasters since nobody adequately addresses climate change.. More intervention overseas since the military industrial complex relies on international conflicts..
Not to be a Debbie Downer, but as Sanders supporters, what does opposing a Clinton administration do for us as a collective in the long run? What do we actually gain out of this? So we prevent Clinton, the establishment democrat from gaining office, and the republican counterpart - likely Trump or Cruz - gains office. So then what? I still feel like having Clinton as a president benefits us in almost every way I can think of than a Trump or especially Cruz presidency. If we vote against her, I feel like we lose in both ways. We don't send any kind of actual message to the establishment that's funding both Cruz and Clinton's campaigns, (Trump being a blank card to a certain extent), they still win if Cruz becomes president, and we get even less out of it since the republicans will be - without question - against the social issues just to quell their retarded base..
So what do we get out of the republicans winning if we choose not to vote for Clinton out of principle?
why stay home?
if you want to make a statement, write in Sanders in the general if he's not the nominee.
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
What do we get out of it?
ChesusRice
Well-Known Member
Sanders need to keep on getting his message out. But the facts are. He will not win the primary and if he did he would lose the general election. Writing him in the general if he is not the democratic nominee is not only childish. It is destructive to our country
londonfog
Well-Known Member
Sounds crazier then someone talking about Sanders for a whole year, but did not vote for him in the primary. You would do better by not voting again. Save your gas money.
londonfog
Well-Known Member
I hear he is still far behind in delegates, which probably means he will not get the nod
abe supercro
Well-Known Member
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
Where is your evidence he'd lose in the general election? The polls say the exact opposite, and they go on to say that he'd win by a wider margin than Mrs Clinton.
This debate is raging here and in diners and greasy spoons nationwide and a citizen consensus is appearing; left or right, folks are tired of voting against their worst fears and instead want to vote FOR someone. Mr Obama rode that to office eight years ago.
Bernie's opposition isn't comprised of the American People, it's the establishment du jour; the very ones who feel entitled to get their way because, after all, they PAID for it, didn't they?
londonfog
Well-Known Member
small business grants, the ACA, and his two liberal picks for SCOTUS.
and yet Bernie polls most positive approval ratings..think of the current negative rating lineup (Clinton trump Cruz) as leftovers in the fridge you're hungry and must choose one however you want none..same old same old even though your hungry you lose your appetite just looking at the options until you realize you have thr ingredients for an awesome meal but it's gonna take time and work..
which do you choose?.stop being so lazy kicking the can down the road men..if not now, when?
londonfog
Well-Known Member
Says the person who did not even vote in the primary. You let Bernie down and when he loses, you have no one to blame but you. Clinton will be your next POTUS. I suggest you find somethings you like about her or you will be one frustrated person.
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
I'm a pretty big fan of his ACA, myself.
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
Time for another french word; souffle!
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
You know, I've tried to do exactly that and I just can't seem to pull it off. Again, I AM FAR FROM ALONE. In the face of a potential mass walkout on the establishment pick, perhaps it would behoove the party to actually listen to its constituents. Right now, it's doing its level damndest to shove the pick it made FOR us down our throats. That doesn't square with any definition of democracy I am aware of. I'm not going along with it and neither should you.