Yet another B3590 build; 180w UFO KILLER! ;)

[vahpor]

Just another guy jumping on this high efficiency COB bandwagon. I've been dabbling with some cheap-CN 100w chips for a bit, and seeing great results. I've ran a cheap-CN 180w UFO LED (92w draw) and wasn't all that impressed, lots of heat, required a large distance to canopy, lack of density/size due to distance from light, not dimmable. In the pic below I'm running each 100w chip between 30 and 50w, I've had to turn them down due to heat issues when I fired up the UFO..

I'm flowering in a 2x2x3' mini-tent (because thats what I have space for).
I will be adding a full tent DIY SCROG insert (1/2" PVC and some elbows), and be running a single plant in a 5 gal (or larger??) Smart Pot on my next flower run.

My build:

1x HLG-185H-C1400B (w/ 100k potenti & knob)
4x CXB3590 3000k CB (top bin)
4x Ideal holders
4x Arctic Alpine 64 GT Rev 2 (80mm fan, 70w dissipation)
Arctic Silver 3 TIM

Drilled and tapped heatsink, 3mm screws.
Frame designed from 1/2" x 1/20" thick angle alu. and some 1/4" eye bolts (would go 1 size smaller with this 1/2" alu next time). 2 chips/hs/fans per 'light rig'; 18" x ~2 3/4". The heatsinks will be adjustable and slide inwards/outwards as needed. Maybe useful if I use the light in a larger space and need more coverage?

I plan to run the light at lower amperage, hoping to push 50-55% efficiency or so @ 110-130w total. Its my understanding 700ma is 58% with this 3000k CB bin?

I spent the day beginning the physical build. Got the first frame built.

And the fans wired up to a 6v, 250mA source. Still not sure if this PSU will cut it, I tested draw on 1 fan and then 2 in parallel. 67mA for one, ~130mA for two. Voltage is at exactly 6.00v with two fans, w/o a load it read ~6.16v, so maybe with four the voltage will droop further, and keep me within the 250mA, but its likely too close for reliability. I will likely source a MW 8w 5v, but really would like to find a 6v to be sure the fans start. Maybe a universal @ 7.5v?

I drilled, tapped, and installed two chips thus far. Its taking me quite a while to drill the sinks, the tapping goes well. I'm just going very slow RPM (set your drill at its lowest speed, and also use very low pressure on the trigger), very low pressure applied to bit (the weight of the drill), and using a lot of WD40 for lube. No broken bits or taps! I do need to get a T handle for my taps, a crescent wrench isn't the smoothest way to tap a hole this size..

No pics, but I also installed wiring for this pair of COBs, I wish I had solid wire, but got the 18 gauge stranded to work OK. Soldered a AC plug onto my driver too.

Waiting on 100k pots.
Waiting on new hacksaw blades to finish cutting my alu for my 2nd light rig.

I'm hoping to get a couple more heatsinks drilled, tapped, and COBs installed in the mean time. Then have all the wiring completed and ready to install in light frame. Maybe running by end of week!?

Very excited about this COB lighting and its efficiency. These large grows/warehouses are going to have to wake up to the fact that running thousands of 1000+w HIDs aren't going to be sustainable as the cannabis movement and industry grows and develops further. We need to get this tech in these large grow ops, and make them aware. I hope a large LED builder can get behind this and meet demand.

 

[Will Thayer]

Hello Vahpor,
Looking good! I am excited to see your results with scrog under COBs. Please keep the updates coming to feed my grow nerd habit.

I think COB warehouse grows are still cost prohibitive at today's prices but should prove a viable option in the future for sure.

Keep up the Good Growing.

Cheers,
Will

 

[vahpor]

Just finished tapping 2nd pair of sinks. Attached COBs, wired fans and chips up. Just back from a test run.
>> More pics <<

First issue seems to be the fans at 6v is not enough to cool this heatsink.. I'll find a 12v adapter and do further testing.
Using a laser thermo I saw temps up to ~120*F on the heatsink and shut it down. All sinks are quite warm, in the 100-120* range.
Update: I think this has to do with the sinks being on their sides and the light heat dumping into the table and heat soaking the table and thus the heatsink. I just did a quick test and checked temps of the wood table...110+. The fans do not have a place to move the air properly in this configuration (on there sides). I will report back after I can suspend the light array properly, so that the light heat isn't being absorbed and heat soaked by the sink.

Voltage reading was 138v from the driver side. Amperage @ 1.46-1.47A. DIM wires left open (full power). 201.48w - 202.86, calculated. Maybe at 700-900mA the 6v fans will work, but I think I'd rather just run them at 12v as they make little to no noise, a lot quieter than my exhaust fan currently.

 

[SupraSPL]

What part of the heatsink did the measurement come from? If the light from the COB was exposed to the thermometer it can interfere with the reading quite a bit and aluminum can be problematic on top of that. At 6V they should do a great job handling a 50W COB but if heatsink temps are 120F there is definitely a lot to be gained by increasing fan speed.

I have had to abandon non contact thermometers for reading heatsink temps. I have been using this and I wonder where has it been all my life:
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Taylor-Pivoting-Digital-Food-Thermometer/17785567

 

[vahpor]

What part of the heatsink did the measurement come from? If the light from the COB was exposed to the thermometer it can interfere with the reading quite a bit and aluminum can be problematic on top of that. At 6V they should do a great job handling a 50W COB but if heatsink temps are 120F there is definitely a lot to be gained by increasing fan speed.

I have had to abandon non contact thermometers for reading heatsink temps. I have been using this and I wonder where has it been all my life:
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Taylor-Pivoting-Digital-Food-Thermometer/17785567

I was testing w/ lights on, and the sides right next to/behind the cobs, not in direct light. I tested them as soon as I powered off as well. And, hand test indicated warm-hot. I'll get an extra hygro to confirm temps tomorrow night. Thanks for the tips on laser thermo.

86-87*F in the tent today... Coldest part of winter so far...and I'm battling heat. I need a cold air intake I guess, and to finish this light!

 

[ttystikk]

Very excited about this COB lighting and its efficiency. These large grows/warehouses are going to have to wake up to the fact that running thousands of 1000+w HIDs aren't going to be sustainable as the cannabis movement and industry grows and develops further. We need to get this tech in these large grow ops, and make them aware. I hope a large LED builder can get behind this and meet demand.

I'm taking on the job of proving this to be true, at scale.

 

[vahpor]

I'm taking on the job of proving this to be true, at scale.

I've been meaning to check your Vert grow out! Working on some of that at work as well. Thank you for this effort! I'll def be checking in on your project/grow.

Update on the hot heatsink issue, updated above post: I think this has to do with the sinks being on their sides and the light heat dumping into the table and heat soaking the table and thus the heatsink. I just did a quick test and checked temps of the wood table...110+. The fans do not have a place to move the air properly in this configuration (on there sides). I will report back after I can suspend the light array properly, so that the light heat isn't being absorbed and heat soaked by the sink.

But, feeling accomplished tonight, just need a saw blade to finish a frame for the 2nd pair of COBs. Knowing I have the wiring sorted and all the drilling/tapping done is reassuring. On the home stretch!

 

[ttystikk]

I've been meaning to check your Vert grow out! Working on some of that at work as well. Thank you for this effort! I'll def be checking in on your project/grow.

Update on the hot heatsink issue, updated above post: I think this has to do with the sinks being on their sides and the light heat dumping into the table and heat soaking the table and thus the heatsink. I just did a quick test and checked temps of the wood table...110+. The fans do not have a place to move the air properly in this configuration (on there sides). I will report back after I can suspend the light array properly, so that the light heat isn't being absorbed and heat soaked by the sink.

Oh, have you have your girls climbing the walls too? Pics or it didn't happen! LOL

Seriously, the only way to move this industry forward in terms of efficiency is to do it ourselves.

 

[vahpor]

Oh, have you have your girls climbing the walls too? Pics or it didn't happen! LOL

Seriously, the only way to move this industry forward in terms of efficiency is to do it ourselves.

Oh, by vert I thought you meant stacks of racks with multiple bays 2-3+ high. This is where LED has an advantage, as long as plant counts are non-issue. 2x (or more) the number of plants in the same space, instead of 1000w with huge canopy distances. Still in search of yield/density...but it looks like these COBs are the key.

And I'm with you on pushing efficiency and awareness of the subject. That is why I'm here, building something to present to R&D. R&Ding on my own dime and time..go figure, at least I'll have something to use as a result!

 

[ttystikk]

Oh, by vert I thought you meant stacks of racks with multiple bays 2-3+ high. This is where LED has an advantage, as long as plant counts are non-issue. 2x (or more) the number of plants in the same space, instead of 1000w with huge canopy distances. Still in search of yield/density...but it looks like these COBs are the key.

And I'm with you on pushing efficiency and awareness of the subject. That is why I'm here, building something to present to R&D. R&Ding on my own dime and time..go figure, at least I'll have something to use as a result!

You just described what I'm doing, lol

 

[vahpor]

Light rig complete. Doing a test run now. Heatsink temps are lower, but still ~100*F. Warm to touch, not hot. BUT, 2 of the LEDs are heat soaking my glass table ~8" away, glass temp was ~115*. So, still not sure if I have a cooling concern yet. Will see how it performs in the tent. Can always add more fan voltage as needed, and run an inline fan speed controller.

Still waiting on my pot...does USA not make pots? We just grow the pots? Should be an easy install later on.

I have one wire I want to shorten, the COB to COB connection between each light rig was a tad bit long, easy peasy. Being able to connect/disconnect wires to the COB so easily is a nice feature. My cheap-CN chips are soldered on.

I also plan to run the driver outside the tent, so I just need to solder on a longer lead to the driver. Anyone see issues/concern utilizing the barrel connector for a load like this? I don't feel any noticeable heat (nor does the temp gun) at the connections. Sure makes it nice having a quick disconnect.

>> Album <<

 

[ttystikk]

Looks good! Interesting about the glass table. Plants will be better able to deal with that heat, as they can transpire more water.

 

[vahpor]

I'm trying to finalize my wiring and as I may have mentioned above, I plan to run the driver it remotely/outside tent, preferably on the cool floor.

I'm using/have in my posession ~100' of 18g copper wire that I'd prefer to use, unless absolutely not recommended.
Is it likely preferred to keep the shortest length possible to avoid adding resistance and current loss? What would a safe length be? Max length?

I'm considering ~3.5 feet? Could run it a bit shorter since I have a good length of lead from my light, that should at least get it to exit the tent side hole, and make my connection outside of the tent, which I feel is likely safest??

Update: Just looked into the details on my wire, and it looks like I should get something different/rated for higher voltage. Here is what I'm using. Any suggestions/links for what will work well with COB wiring, and the driver to COB patch cable?

Update more: Something like this? 300v hook up wire 18g? I'll have to see what Ace has.

 

[churchhaze]

Do you have a link to the product those green connectors plug into? I have so many of those green connectors!

Light rig complete. Doing a test run now. Heatsink temps are lower, but still ~100*F. Warm to touch, not hot. BUT, 2 of the LEDs are heat soaking my glass table ~8" away, glass temp was ~115*. So, still not sure if I have a cooling concern yet. Will see how it performs in the tent. Can always add more fan voltage as needed, and run an inline fan speed controller.

Still waiting on my pot...does USA not make pots? We just grow the pots? Should be an easy install later on.

I have one wire I want to shorten, the COB to COB connection between each light rig was a tad bit long, easy peasy. Being able to connect/disconnect wires to the COB so easily is a nice feature. My cheap-CN chips are soldered on.

I also plan to run the driver outside the tent, so I just need to solder on a longer lead to the driver. Anyone see issues/concern utilizing the barrel connector for a load like this? I don't feel any noticeable heat (nor does the temp gun) at the connections. Sure makes it nice having a quick disconnect.

>> Album <<

 

[vahpor]

Do you have a link to the product those green connectors plug into? I have so many of those green connectors!

These? 2.1mm x 5.5mm CCTV. Also, likely not rated for high voltage? I got them for fans initially. 10x were cheap. I'll likely convert to something with a solder-on / pig tail design instead of the screw downs.

 

[vahpor]

Light installed into tent. >> Album <<

Temps are a bit high @ 1.4a. ~102-104*F in the heatsink even with fans upped to 12v (only lowered temps by 3-5* going from 6v). ~80-88*F near canopy height.. Driver temp @ ~90*F+ is also higher than I anticipated, with an oscil fan blowing across it even.

I'm going to have to find a resistor local, can't wait for the potenti from CN. Any suggestions on wattage for a 50k ohm? Hoping 1/2 the power/amperage will work OK.
Update: Looks like a Radio Shack has a couple different 100k pots in stock. Audio-taper and Linear-taper. Whats the difference? Which is better? The linear taper has a 20% tolerance..seems pretty poor to me, but, it'd solve my current problem, so I'm not going to get too nit picky.

Poor sickly plant doesn't need more light stress and heat right now. I'll look for something tomorrow.

 

[ttystikk]

Light installed into tent. >> Album <<

Temps are a bit high @ 1.4a. ~102-104*F in the heatsink even with fans upped to 12v (only lowered temps by 3-5* going from 6v). ~80-88*F near canopy height.. Driver temp @ ~90*F+ is also higher than I anticipated, with an oscil fan blowing across it even.

I'm going to have to find a resistor local, can't wait for the potenti from CN. Any suggestions on wattage for a 50k ohm? Hoping 1/2 the power/amperage will work OK.

Poor sickly plant doesn't need more light stress and heat right now. I'll look for something tomorrow.

You need a swamp cooler in that tent, asap. It will help until the plant can transpire enough water on its own to help regulate temps.

 

[vahpor]

You need a swamp cooler in that tent, asap. It will help until the plant can transpire enough water on its own to help regulate temps.

Are there swamp coolers that small? Or a DIY solution? I have a humidi running outside the intake vent, but have a feeling i'm just pulling the cool moisture right out the exhaust, which is at max right now.

Edit: I wonder if this DIY 'baby sampy' would be practical for my scale.. Also how often it would require refilling.

 

[ttystikk]

Are there swamp coolers that small? Or a DIY solution? I have a humidi running outside the intake vent, but have a feeling i'm just pulling the cool moisture right out the exhaust, which is at max right now.

Lots of ways to add some humidity. You could hang some damp towels, that will help. I've found that blasting the exhaust fan generally isn't the solution.

 

[mc130p]

where is your exhaust? I don't see it in the pic, even though I think I can see the top of the tent.

edit: oh nvm...i think i see it in the album...what size is it?