20% runoff question

[AfgooCBD]

I have tap water that is too high ppm and too high alkaline (8.?-9.?). I mix 1/2 distilled and 1/2 tap, and get the ppm down to 125. Ph is then around 7.3. Then add nutes, or if just water, add some ph down (to 6.5). I usually water with that, until I get 20% runoff.

My question is: Is it cool to flush out the salts with tap water that is too high ppm and too high alkaline FIRST, THEN water with the 1/2 tap, 1/2 distilled (ppm 125), ph'd to 6.5? OR will the soil absorb the first watering, which is too high ppm and too high a ph?

Could I water with the proper ph/nutes water FIRST, and the soil will absorb that, and then flush (20% runoff) with tap water? Or will that flush out the nutes?

One grow I flushed with the tap water first, waited 20 minutes, then watered with nutes until I saw runoff, then stopped, hoping that the nutrient water stayed in the container and was available for the roots. I thought I could flush out the salts first, then add the nutrient water later. My concern is that the soil will absorb the water that is not the proper ph or ppm and mess with the roots.

I would think that the water you pour in first (whether you top or bottom feed) gets absorbed by the soil, then any other watering just runs through, washing out whatever is built up (salts) around the soil.

Am I over-thinking this? It's been on my mind.

 

[$bkbbudz$]

I assume you are using soil. Personally, I have never even thought once about PPM in my grows, I feel it is pretty much pointless in soil, hydro is a different story.

Now do I think you are making too much of this? YES. Use correctly ph'd water whether it is tap, distilled, RO, spring or even rainwater. Feed when they need it and stop worrying so much! Nothing kills more plants than 'loving them too death'.

Good Luck and Great Grow.

 

[GrowinDad]

I agree with the above. PH your tap and you are good. You may want to let it sit out a day to get rid of chlorine. I bought a PPM/EC meter and never use it..

 

[Rrog]

If you're dumping bottles of fertilizer in soil, who knows? That's just one step up from hydro, but many growers enjoy it. I sure don't, but apparently many do

 

[AfgooCBD]

Cool, thanks everyone!

 

[jeroly]

I assume you are using soil. Personally, I have never even thought once about PPM in my grows, I feel it is pretty much pointless in soil, hydro is a different story.

Now do I think you are making too much of this? YES. Use correctly ph'd water whether it is tap, distilled, RO, spring or even rainwater. Feed when they need it and stop worrying so much! Nothing kills more plants than 'loving them too death'.

Good Luck and Great Grow.

If one is using unamended soil, or in some opinions late in the grow after there are no longer many nutrients still available in the soil, then you're going to want to add nutrients (which can be organic if desired - my own opinion is that nitrogen is nitrogen more or less) at some point in the grow, and when you do it's always good to check the TDS parts-per-million to make sure you haven't goofed and are about to poison your ladies.

 

[az2000]

My question is: Is it cool to flush out the salts with tap water that is too high ppm and too high alkaline FIRST, THEN water with the 1/2 tap, 1/2 distilled (ppm 125), ph'd to 6.5? OR will the soil absorb the first watering, which is too high ppm and too high a ph?

Just mix enough nutrient volume for your runoff. If you're worried about wasting expensive nutrients, you probably got suckered into buying expensive nutrients. If you try to pre-saturate/runoff the soil and then displace that with nutrient mix, you're just going to end up with dilute nutrients in the soil and no idea what strength of nutrient you're actually feeding.

As far as flushing or generating a lot of runoff, I shoot for 20-30% runoff. But,I measure my runoff's PPM. If it reaches 2000ppm, I cut back on nutrient strength and/or increase the runoff volume next time. If it goes above 2200 I'm in trouble. 2500 seems to be where deficiencies start. I like 1600-1800. But, it can be much lower during veg before the salts accumulate.

BTW: My tap water is very high PPM, higher than the nutrient PPMs I add. I cannot grow with it. People who say "it doesn't matter" are fortunate to have water that doesn't matter. If yours is very high, I would not pour it into the soil. You'll just replace salts with salts that probably aren't available to the plant. That was my experience. Like you, I mix my tap to RO filtered water for 150ppm starting point.

 

[MrStickyScissors]

Th

I have tap water that is too high ppm and too high alkaline (8.?-9.?). I mix 1/2 distilled and 1/2 tap, and get the ppm down to 125. Ph is then around 7.3. Then add nutes, or if just water, add some ph down (to 6.5). I usually water with that, until I get 20% runoff.

My question is: Is it cool to flush out the salts with tap water that is too high ppm and too high alkaline FIRST, THEN water with the 1/2 tap, 1/2 distilled (ppm 125), ph'd to 6.5? OR will the soil absorb the first watering, which is too high ppm and too high a ph?

Could I water with the proper ph/nutes water FIRST, and the soil will absorb that, and then flush (20% runoff) with tap water? Or will that flush out the nutes?

One grow I flushed with the tap water first, waited 20 minutes, then watered with nutes until I saw runoff, then stopped, hoping that the nutrient water stayed in the container and was available for the roots. I thought I could flush out the salts first, then add the nutrient water later. My concern is that the soil will absorb the water that is not the proper ph or ppm and mess with the roots.

I would think that the water you pour in first (whether you top or bottom feed) gets absorbed by the soil, then any other watering just runs through, washing out whatever is built up (salts) around the soil.

Am I over-thinking this? It's been on my mind.[/QUOT tap watter has fucked up so many grows that i have seen recently. Plants get lock out. Just do yourself a favor and get a RO or get water by the 5 gallon jug at the store

 

[$bkbbudz$]

If one is using unamended soil, or in some opinions late in the grow after there are no longer many nutrients still available in the soil, then you're going to want to add nutrients (which can be organic if desired - my own opinion is that nitrogen is nitrogen more or less) at some point in the grow, and when you do it's always good to check the TDS parts-per-million to make sure you haven't goofed and are about to poison your ladies.

I don't even know (and don't really care) what TDS is. I have never had an issue with nutes (aside from minor yellowing, and a few calcium, and magnesium ticks). But, I learned how to listen to my girlz by reading and research. I don't need toys or gadgets to reassure me that I am not in error, I know I am not.

 

[AfgooCBD]

Just mix enough nutrient volume for your runoff. If you're worried about wasting expensive nutrients, you probably got suckered into buying expensive nutrients. If you try to pre-saturate/runoff the soil and then displace that with nutrient mix, you're just going to end up with dilute nutrients in the soil and no idea what strength of nutrient you're actually feeding.

As far as flushing or generating a lot of runoff, I shoot for 20-30% runoff. But,I measure my runoff's PPM. If it reaches 2000ppm, I cut back on nutrient strength and/or increase the runoff volume next time. If it goes above 2200 I'm in trouble. 2500 seems to be where deficiencies start. I like 1600-1800. But, it can be much lower during veg before the salts accumulate.

BTW: My tap water is very high PPM, higher than the nutrient PPMs I add. I cannot grow with it. People who say "it doesn't matter" are fortunate to have water that doesn't matter. If yours is very high, I would not pour it into the soil. You'll just replace salts with salts that probably aren't available to the plant. That was my experience. Like you, I mix my tap to RO filtered water for 150ppm starting point.

Yep. We are in the same boat. I used to measure runoff ppm too, forgot about that. My nutes aren't that expensive: Botanicare.

 

[Alienwidow]

i love my ppm meter. Knowing whats in your big rez is not over rated...at all.

 

[$bkbbudz$]

i love my ppm meter. Knowing whats in your big rez is not over rated...at all.

I am guessing by Big Rez you mean reservoir, or hydro. As I stated previously, knowing PPM and TDS (not too mention the $ spent on uneeded gadgets) is inconsequential when growing in soil.

But I am sure there are other opinions out there.

 

[Alienwidow]

I am guessing by Big Rez you mean reservoir, or hydro. As I stated previously, knowing PPM and TDS (not too mention the $ spent on uneeded gadgets) is inconsequential when growing in soil.

But I am sure there are other opinions out there.

Good thing you dont know what your talking about. Have fun with that whole not having a clue thing. I bet your the kinda guy thats gonna run around riu "helping" people too.....nahhhh man, you dont need to know whats going on in the root zone maaaan. It dont matter. Just pour in whatever you think and itll work out.

Im glad you grew one plant, once, in your moms basement, but real growers use ppm or ec meters.

 

[$bkbbudz$]

Good thing you dont know what your talking about. Have fun with that whole not having a clue thing. I bet your the kinda guy thats gonna run around riu "helping" people too.....nahhhh man, you dont need to know whats going on in the root zone maaaan. It dont matter. Just pour in whatever you think and itll work out.

Im glad you grew one plant, once, in your moms basement, but real growers use ppm or ec meters.

whatever troll...As said before I have never used or needed one, If you need gadgets to grow a plant and do not know what it needs just by looking at it then you are as ignorant as you are rude. Good Day to you.

 

[az2000]

I have never used or needed one, If you need gadgets to grow a plant

You grow outdoors, without a tent or light?

PPM meters are just a tool. Like any tool, information is valuable when dialing in a new soil or nutrient. Once dialed in, it's not needed. Hobbies are fun. People buy tools to have fun. Or, they might read the product label to determine a light is 2500k versus 6000k -- letting someone else use a gadget on their behalf.

 

[Alienwidow]

whatever troll...As said before I have never used or needed one, If you need gadgets to grow a plant and do not know what it needs just by looking at it then you are as ignorant as you are rude. Good Day to you.

Call me whatever you want. You will eventually run into problems. You sound rediculous telling people ppm meters are useless. Its the MOST important tool in growing besides a light. I grow. I know. The only way your advice is correct is if your mixing some version of super soil, which id say 80% or more of growers dont do, and they have to feed their plants base nutes and calmag.
Answer me this, if you do have a deficiency how do you correct it and prevent it on the next run? You just guess? Doesnt seem exactly professional to me at all.
If you told a carpenter to go to work without his tape measure youd probably get the response, "kick rocks", and everyone on the jobsite would tell you the same thing.

 

[$bkbbudz$]

Call me whatever you want. You will eventually run into problems. You sound rediculous telling people ppm meters are useless. Its the MOST important tool in growing besides a light. I grow. I know. The only way your advice is correct is if your mixing some version of super soil, which id say 80% or more of growers dont do, and they have to feed their plants base nutes and calmag.
Answer me this, if you do have a deficiency how do you correct it and prevent it on the next run? You just guess? Doesnt seem exactly professional to me at all.
If you told a carpenter to go to work without his tape measure youd probably get the response, "kick rocks", and everyone on the jobsite would tell you the same thing.

15 years, many many harvests...never needed one...still don't. And BTW the MOST important tool in growing great cannabis is NOT any toy...it is knowledge. As far as 'advice' or telling others what they should or should not do,.read my posts, the only thing I ever advise people to do is to read and learn. Each grow and grower are different. What I do, may or may not work for anyone else. If my plants have a deficiency or excess, they will let me know. Soil is very forgiving and none of my plants ever have, nor will they ever die in a day.

But again, if you or anyone else feels the need to have a PPM meter for a soil grow, more power to ya.

 

[$bkbbudz$]

Oh and by the way...insulting someone by saying they have only grown 1 plant in their mothers basement, is quite childish and ridiculous...Good Luck and Good Grow...Peace out!

 

[Alienwidow]

15 years, many many harvests...never needed one...still don't. And BTW the MOST important tool in growing great cannabis is NOT any toy...it is knowledge. As far as 'advice' or telling others what they should or should not do,.read my posts, the only thing I ever advise people to do is to read and learn. Each grow and grower are different. What I do, may or may not work for anyone else. If my plants have a deficiency or excess, they will let me know. Soil is very forgiving and none of my plants ever have, nor will they ever die in a day.

But again, if you or anyone else feel the need to have a PPM meter for a soil grow, more power to ya.

Poppy cock. You stated ppm meters are uneeded gadgets, and you dont need them when growing in soil. Both of those statements are false, and you just asked where am i telling people to do shit? Well right there bubba. You wanna advise people to read and learn whell why wouldnt they read a ppm meter so they can learn what effect different nutrient ratios has on the plant at different stages. Or you can teach em all to be hacks and chuck nutes in a pail?....

 

[$bkbbudz$]

hey, I have been very nice and polite about this whole thing, where is your hostility coming from? I am very sorry that apparently someone dropped a house on your sister. You sir are an arrogant, pompous, jackass. DO AS YOU WILL WITH YOUR OWN GROWS. IF IT WORKS FOR YOU ALL THE BETTER. You act is if someone does not use a ppm meter, their grows are doomed to failure. How idiotic can a person be? There are ALOT of grows done without such tools and they are successful. I have been doing it for years and so have many others. Why don't you come off your high horse and admit you are WRONG!!

With that I am out...post what you will on this thread that YOU Jacked from the original poster. I will no longer respond to your childishness and animosity

P.S. I am sure that if you did not use a ppm meter your plants would die within hours.

Good Luck and Great Growing