LED COB bar project

[testiclees]

http://kingbriteled.en.alibaba.com/

i spoke w jerry yesterday. i asked for 3590cd 72v 3500k.

He tried to sell me a different bin. I declined. I will message him again if you have successfully ordered that particular cob.

let me know. many thanks

 

[bmdiyh]

i spoke w jerry yesterday. i asked for 3590cd 72v 3500k.

He tried to sell me a different bin. I declined. I will message him again if you have successfully ordered that particular cob.

let me know. many thanks

I haven't yet. I talked with the suppliers he says they are out of them, but they'll have a new shipment on the 17th of july, or something like that. I still have time until my project starts. For now I'm just gathering info on the parts I'll need. I hope what I found helps.

 

[testiclees]

I haven't yet. I talked with the suppliers he says they are out of them, but they'll have a new shipment on the 17th of july, or something like that. I still have time until my project starts. For now I'm just gathering info on the parts I'll need. I hope what I found helps.

ya sounds good. im just getting my parts together as well.

i grabbed my drivers from ali. im runnen 4 cobs @.700ma.
I have a huge recycled heatsink so i am good w passive cooling.
Super simple pontoons (2) each holding 1 driver 2 3590s, passively cooled with an optic vero 360 in the middle.

 

[littlejacob]

Bonjour
@SupraSPL is any led seller contact you for a job? If they don't they are blind... You are more "efficient" than any people (pro or not) I am talking to (i know you are not the only one on R.I.U but you are the "reference" the one we call when there is no hope...oups no this one is Superman! But you know what i mean...
Thanks again for your patience and your time

 

[bmdiyh]

ya sounds good. im just getting my parts together as well.

i grabbed my drivers from ali. im runnen 4 cobs @.700ma.
I have a huge recycled heatsink so i am good w passive cooling.
Super simple pontoons (2) each holding 1 driver 2 3590s, passively cooled with an optic vero 360 in the middle.

It'll be very nice if we can get some pictures of your build.

 

[testiclees]

It'll be very nice if we can get some pictures of your build.

I havent made any progress since this post https://www.rollitup.org/t/heatsinks-for-diy-led-lamps.851907/page-45#p.

The pic below gives a general idea. Im waiting to receive the drivers. I have an improved and balanced rig to hang the apparatus. i, like you, am on hold for the cxb's. Im cool waiting because Summer here is too hot for flowering.

 

[bmdiyh]

I am thinking over the concept (of my life)

Could 5 x Cree CXB3590 3500K CD @ 1.4A cover 2x4ft space. They would put out 245 Dissp.W at over 50% efficiency I'll have over 15 PAR W per square foot.
What do you guys think? Can I cover 4X8ft space with for of those?>

 

[SupraSPL]

Unless you are planning on using separate drivers, they would probably be easiest in bunches of 4 because 4 fit on the HLG-185H-C1400. So that would give you 196W Diss @ 56% = 110 PAR W - 10% reflector/lens/wall losses = 99/8 = 12.4 PAR W/ft² or 617 PPFD. I think that would work well but not quite up to the intensity of the 1000 HPS DE in a 4X4 that many are comparing to (~950 PPFD, with hot spots and 40 CRi caveats) So you are right 5 would be better for those who want to get on the higher side of intensity but it does not play nice logistically if you have 4 separate tents. If your 4X8ft space is one tent with no walkways and you want higher intensity you could build 5 or 6 of those lamps instead of 4.

Another option, if we get access to the HLG-240H-C series drivers you could run 5 CXB3590s at 1.4A on the HLG-240H-C1400, although still logistically unfriendly in terms of using 5 COBs to evenly cover a rectangle space.. With the HLG-240H-C1750 we could run (4) CXB3590s at 62W ea @ 52.5% efficiency. That is 130 PAR W *9 = 117/8 = 14.65 PAR W/ft² or 729 PPFD.

 

[bmdiyh]

Unless you are planning on using separate drivers, they would probably be easiest in bunches of 4 because 4 fit on the HLG-185H-C1400. So that would give you 196W Diss @ 56% = 110 PAR W - 10% reflector/lens/wall losses = 99/8 = 12.4 PAR W/ft² or 617 PPFD. I think that would work well but not quite up to the intensity of the 1000 HPS DE in a 4X4 that many are comparing to (~950 PPFD, with hot spots and 40 CRi caveats) So you are right 5 would be better for those who want to get on the higher side of intensity but it does not play nice logistically if you have 4 separate tents. If your 4X8ft space is one tent with no walkways and you want higher intensity you could build 5 or 6 of those lamps instead of 4.

Another option, if we get access to the HLG-240H-C series drivers you could run 5 CXB3590s at 1.4A on the HLG-240H-C1400, although still logistically unfriendly in terms of using 5 COBs to evenly cover a rectangle space.. With the HLG-240H-C1750 we could run (4) CXB3590s at 62W ea @ 52.5% efficiency. That is 130 PAR W *9 = 117/8 = 14.65 PAR W/ft² or 729 PPFD.

As you remember my original plan was to build 8 bars each having 4 COBs which in this (196W Diss @ 56%) case would mean 49 Dissp. W/sq ft @ 56% = 27.4 PAR W / sqft. From what I have read this is more than enough. Given the fact that I am planning a SOG grow (128 plants in the 8x4 ft), and the plant are going to be as short as possible I believe that I would get by beautifully with 15 PAR W/sqft which at that efficiency translate roughly into 30 Dissp.W/sqft. (always rounding up) which is 960 Dissp.W for the whole space.

Knowing that I could run CXB3590s at 1.4A at 49 Dissp.W gave me the idea the idea that I can get by with 20 COBs (980 Dissp.W) instead of 32. If I am wrong correct me! I am trying to get optimal coverage and wattage for my space at the least amount of money. I know that haven the 32 chips and running them soft is going to be ...... I am just trying to reduce costs as much as I can and at the same time keeping the efficiency over 50%.

I am still trying to figure out how to arrange 20 to maybe 24 COBs in the 4x8 so I can get as even coverage as possible. If everything that I've written here about the Watts, PAR etc. I am aiming for the bold numbers. If I could get any suggestions on spacing and number of COBs and also number of drivers, please!

Edit: I also have the idea of reducing the chips per bar to three thus covering everything with 24 chips. Just a thought.

 

[Greengenes707]

As you remember my original plan was to build 8 bars each having 4 COBs which in this (196W Diss @ 56%) case would mean 49 Dissp. W/sq ft @ 56% = 27.4 PAR W / sqft. From what I have read this is more than enough. Given the fact that I am planning a SOG grow (128 plants in the 8x4 ft), and the plant are going to be as short as possible I believe that I would get by beautifully with 15 PAR W/sqft which at that efficiency translate roughly into 30 Dissp.W/sqft. (always rounding up) which is 960 Dissp.W for the whole space.

Knowing that I could run CXB3590s at 1.4A at 49 Dissp.W gave me the idea the idea that I can get by with 20 COBs (980 Dissp.W) instead of 32. If I am wrong correct me! I am trying to get optimal coverage and wattage for my space at the least amount of money. I know that haven the 32 chips and running them soft is going to be ...... I am just trying to reduce costs as much as I can and at the same time keeping the efficiency over 50%.

I am still trying to figure out how to arrange 20 to maybe 24 COBs in the 4x8 so I can get as even coverage as possible. If everything that I've written here about the Watts, PAR etc. I am aiming for the bold numbers. If I could get any suggestions on spacing and number of COBs and also number of drivers, please!

Edit: I also have the idea of reducing the chips per bar to three thus covering everything with 24 chips. Just a thought.

Both 3 and 4 are factors of 24...so if you going 24 cobs...and are trying to spend as little as possible, plus the chips are already scaring your budget...why use strings of 3 and have to buy more drivers??? Put as many COBs as you can, on the least amount of total drivers possible. Each driver is 60$ plus shipping. Plus more wiring for your inexperience to possibly mess up.
For 20cobs I would look into the 240h-c1400...but IMO...20 is not enough, 24 is required to get closer to getting the potential from that space. Plus you can always dim.
You will get all of you bold numbers if you just listen and stop question things that have been answered for you many times already.

 

[bmdiyh]

I was thinking about the coverage, COBs per driver, number of chips etc. I came up with something which holds 6 COBS driven by either one 240W driver or two 120W ones for a space of 2x4ft. I know it´s maybe too much but the 3D models help me imagine better what I want, so here it is.

Edit: It's nothing more if not less than other DIY lights I've seen on the forum, but I really worked on the spacing to make as even as possible.

 

[testiclees]

Nice work. I think you could be shy on power (for max yield) using that in a 2x4' space. If you ran 6 3590s getting 40 dissipated watts each, you'd have sweet efficiency and you could keep em close but would that be par enough ~144?

My frame has a very similar outline measuring 31x12".
My plan uses 8cobs for ~230 par watts. Ive been hanging it at 12-16".
Or maybe i. overdoing it. I most def agree with your spacing. i think it would be better w 80w cobs.

 

[bmdiyh]

Nice work. I think you could be shy on power (for max yield) using that in a 2x4' space. If you ran 6 3590s getting 40 dissipated watts each, you'd have sweet efficiency and you could keep em close but would that be par enough ~144?

My frame has a very similar outline measuring 31x12".
My plan uses 8cobs for ~230 par watts. Ive been hanging it at 12-16".
Or maybe i. overdoing it. I most def agree with your spacing. i think it would be better w 80w cobs.

Man, that a lot of juice! How many plants do you have under the fixture? How tall are they?
I am aiming for higher efficiency and lower Dissp.W. According to what I've come up with as numbers even if I am running at 50% at 40 Dissp.W per COB, I still get 20 PAR W per COB which is 480 PAR W all together, giving me 15 PAR W/sqft. I am following numbers given to me by users in this thread. Having the short SOG plants I hope this is enough.

Edit: One more question concerning the efficiency. In the above setup, how low should I run the CXB3590 CD 3500K chips to get away with passive cooling. Or do I have to change the heatsinks all together to be able to cool them passively?

 

[alesh]

Man, that a lot of juice! How many plants do you have under the fixture? How tall are they?
I am aiming for higher efficiency and lower Dissp.W. According to what I've come up with as numbers even if I am running at 50% at 40 Dissp.W per COB, I still get 20 PAR W per COB which is 480 PAR W all together, giving me 15 PAR W/sqft. I am following numbers given to me by users in this thread. Having the short SOG plants I hope this is enough.

Edit: One more question concerning the efficiency. In the above setup, how low should I run the CXB3590 CD 3500K chips to get away with passive cooling. Or do I have to change the heatsinks all together to be able to cool them passively?

CPU coolers aren't designed for passive cooling. You'd have to change them.

 

[bmdiyh]

CPU coolers aren't designed for passive cooling. You'd have to change them.

Thanks man, I figured that one out myself.

After a lot of questions, A LOT, thinking over designs, number of chips, number of drivers, heatsinks, fans etc. I had the time to contact a few suppliers get the prices for everything that I might need, which was again a lot of asking. When I finally had all the data from the suppliers, from the datasheets, and from the advice you've had all given me, I made some simple calculation concerning more the financial side of the story. And I came up with the following:

All the prices are in euros and have been given to me by the suppliers that I have contacted

4xVero29 x 10 bars
10 x HLG-185H-C1400B x 43.90 euro = 439 + 45.07 shipping
40 x Vero29 x 24.79 euro = 991.60 + 112.67 shipping
158834

4xVero29 x 50.96 [email protected]@43.03% = 21.93 PARW x 4 = 87.71 PARW/bar


4xCXB3070 AD x 10 bars
10 x HLG-185H-C1400B x 43.90 euro = 439 + 45.07 shipping
40 x CXB3070 AD x 32.87 euro = 1314.80 + 112.67 shipping
1977.87

4xCXB3070 AD x 49.83 [email protected]@48.02% = 23.92 PARW x 4 = 95.71 PARW/bar


4xCXB3590 CD x 10 bars
10 x HLG-185H-C1400B x 43.90 euro = 439 + 45.07 shipping
40 x CXB3590 CD x 41.87 euro = 1674.80 + 112.67 shipping
2271.54

4xCXB3590 CD x 49 [email protected]@56.2% = 27.54 PARW x 4 = 110.15 PARW/bar

You can clearly see the difference in PARW and prices. The PARW is per square foot for my setup. Is it worth it to pay 840 euros more for 5 PARW increase per square foot, maybe for some people. I would be happy with even with less then 20 PARW/sqft, so I don't see the point of paying that much.

Anyway I am very glad for all your help, suggestions and advice. I think I have reached my final decision. That may not be the case in a day or two, because I thought that a couple of times already, but now I am happy with the cost, spread, PARW, everything. If there is something incorrect in the calculations or my explanation, anything, please comment on it, i really appreciate all your feedback. Thanks!

Edit: First total was wrong! Had to change it.

 

[alesh]

Thanks man, I figured that one out myself.

After a lot of questions, A LOT, thinking over designs, number of chips, number of drivers, heatsinks, fans etc. I had the time to contact a few suppliers get the prices for everything that I might need, which was again a lot of asking. When I finally had all the data from the suppliers, from the datasheets, and from the advice you've had all given me, I made some simple calculation concerning more the financial side of the story. And I came up with the following:

All the prices are in euros and have been given to me by the suppliers that I have contacted

4xVero29 x 10 bars
10 x HLG-185H-C1400B x 43.90 euro = 439 + 45.07 shipping
40 x Vero29 x 24.79 euro = 991.60 + 112.67 shipping
1430.60

4xVero29 x 50.96 [email protected]@43.03% = 21.93 PARW x 4 = 87.71 PARW/bar


4xCXB3070 AD x 10 bars
10 x HLG-185H-C1400B x 43.90 euro = 439 + 45.07 shipping
40 x CXB3070 AD x 32.87 euro = 1314.80 + 112.67 shipping
1977.87

4xCXB3070 AD x 49.83 [email protected]@48.02% = 23.92 PARW x 4 = 95.71 PARW/bar


4xCXB3590 CD x 10 bars
10 x HLG-185H-C1400B x 43.90 euro = 439 + 45.07 shipping
40 x CXB3590 CD x 41.87 euro = 1674.80 + 112.67 shipping
2271.54

4xCXB3590 CD x 49 [email protected]@56.2% = 27.54 PARW x 4 = 110.15 PARW/bar

You can clearly see the difference in PARW and prices. The PARW is per square foot for my setup. Is it worth it to pay 840 euros more for 5 PARW increase per square foot, maybe for some people. I would be happy with even with less then 20 PARW/sqft, so I don't see the point of paying that much.

Anyway I am very glad for all your help, suggestions and advice. I think I have reached my final decision. That may not be the case in a day or two, because I thought that a couple of times already, but now I am happy with the cost, spread, PARW, everything. If there is something incorrect in the calculations or my explanation, anything, please comment on it, i really appreciate all your feedback. Thanks!

You can always buy a HPS if you're concerned about price per PAR watts.

 

[bmdiyh]

You can always buy a HPS if you're concerned about price per PAR watts.

Yes I am. I cannot afford the most expensive stuff, well for now anyway. Electrical bills are gonna be lower with the COBs, not significantly but at least... Where I live is hot all year round. I cannot deal with heat that well without spending a lot on ventilation. Don't HPS have this as a con, the excessive heat?

 

[alesh]

Yes I am. I cannot afford the most expensive stuff, well for now anyway. Electrical bills are gonna be lower with the COBs, not significantly but at least... Where I live is hot all year round. I cannot deal with heat that well without spending a lot on ventilation. Don't HPS have this as a con, the excessive heat?

I tried to hint you that you wouldn't be paying more for few PAR W more but rather for increased efficiency (which means less heat, lower demands on ventilation, etc).
HLG-185H-C1400 + 4x CXB3070 AB (@ $28.5 each) seems like the best compromise to me. I also have some doubts that 4x Vero29 + HLG-185H-C1400 would work at full power, though I haven't tested it.

 

[bmdiyh]

I tried to hint you that you wouldn't be paying more for few PAR W more but rather for increased efficiency (which means less heat, lower demands on ventilation, etc).
HLG-185H-C1400 + 4x CXB3070 AB (@ $28.5 each) seems like the best compromise to me. I also have some doubts that 4x Vero29 + HLG-185H-C1400 would work at full power, though I haven't tested it.

Sounds good, but I don't think you have the price right. I can't find it anywhere that low, the lowest I find it is $36.5.

 

[alesh]

Sounds good, but I don't think you have the price right. I can't find it anywhere that low, the lowest I find it is $36.5.

Last time (a month ago) I asked Jerry from Kingbrite, I got quoted @ $28.5 for the AB bin and $36.5 for he AD bin.
HLG-185H-C1050 + 6x Vero18 is another cheap possibility (although not that efficient - ~40%).