Make your own nutrients?

[churchhaze]

Here's my part A+B mix for hard water. Don't try using this for RO (although it'd probably work anyway) (ignore 136g on the bottom of the part B... that was the old label for that bottle)


Good riddance to the 5 bottles..



Although 5 bottles could be more useful for designing/tweaking formulas, I'm glad to have 2 now, and used in equal parts...

 

[firsttimeARE]

That's a big, long list that's far more complicated than it really needs to be for us end users. We don't need to mix them, just use them properly:

Most dry chemical manufacturers take the hard work out of mixing most of those salts by providing a base 'mix'. The one I use is called 'hi K' from Hydrogardens.com, and it has the whole list above already in it and in the right proportions, with only the following exceptions;
Calcium nitrate
Epsom salt (mag sulfate hep.)
MKP

Thus the mix already created for you has the right ratios of ammonia for pH stability, all the micronutrients and is guaranteed soluble at high concentrations to make stock solutions.

So why isn't EVERYTHING in there already? Also pretty straightforward; calcium nitrate needs to be mixed separately so it doesn't react with the rest of the nutes. The others are only needed at certain times in the growth cycle or for certain plants, so you can add them only as you need them.

My stock solution isn't particularly strong, but it is convenient; one gallon for a one hundred gallon changeout of my RDWC system.

In one bucket, I put in epsom salt, MKP if needed and some hot water to dissolve them. Once they've done so, I add the stock solution made from the mix I just explained. That's part one of two parts.

Part two is putting the calcium nitrate in a separate bucket and dissolving that in water. It dissolves very readily and doesn't need to stand for long, if at all. This is why I do it first and put it in the res before I mess with the other part. This way it gets plenty of time to mix and dilute so it can't react when I dump in the other bucket.

Pour the two buckets into your nutrient reservoir, which needs to be at least half full of fresh water- this is necessary so parts A and B don't get together at too high a solution strength and undergo any unwanted chemical reactions.....

If I made my own stock solution how long would that last?

Does this have to be RO water or distilled? I was reading that.

You`ll likely need to make up a micro stock solution unless your res is pond sized Using Fe-DTPA is preferably to EDTA. Potassium sulphate is a very useful chem if you need extra K but dont want the extra N from potassium nitrate. Magnesium nitrate can be used to replace all or part of the magnesium sulphate to tweak the N. Magnesium nitrate also plays nice wih calcium nitrate which can be helpful for some recipes eg: Cal-mag.

Thank you for that. Gives me some different options to tweak ratios for stages. This micro stock solution has just the calcium nitrate?

 

[ttystikk]

How much stock solution you want to make depends on how long you want to go between mixes and how much you use.

I use my tapwater, it's fine here. Your water quality may vary.

 

[Atomizer]

The stocks should be made with ro or distilled to keep them as pure as possible. The chemical weight needed for the micro`s has an effect on accuracy, for example, you cant physically weigh boric acid accurately enough to make up a litre of nutes containing 0.05ppm of B. The amount of stock solution is less important than the concentration with micro`s. even a very highly concentrated micro stock wont use much of each chemical, just a few grams.

 

[firsttimeARE]

Yeah the thing I was reading was for boric acid the guy went over an example. If you're using 17% boric acid take the inverse of that and multiply it by the target ppm. This guy was targeting .3ppm so he needed 6.7mg/gal. But even still thats a hard number to weigh out. I'd need those thousand dollar scales I used in college chem. that can weigh a fingerprint.

Is that the right way to figure out how much you need?

My tap is 10pH and 80ppm. Not terrible, but I have an RO filter I could use.

 

[Atomizer]

I would use ro to make stocks if you have the option. Boric acid is 17.482%, a 1L stock solution containing just 6.495g of boric acid at 1ml/gallon would give you 1000 gals with B= 0.3ppm. You have to strike a balance because accurately measuring fractional mls of stock (liquid) has the same issues as weighing ridiculously small amounts of dry chems. Cu typically has the lowest ppm in a nute so it tends to dictate the concentration of a micro stock

 

[ttystikk]

Yeah the thing I was reading was for boric acid the guy went over an example. If you're using 17% boric acid take the inverse of that and multiply it by the target ppm. This guy was targeting .3ppm so he needed 6.7mg/gal. But even still thats a hard number to weigh out. I'd need those thousand dollar scales I used in college chem. that can weigh a fingerprint.

Is that the right way to figure out how much you need?

My tap is 10pH and 80ppm. Not terrible, but I have an RO filter I could use.

Why go to this kind of trouble when dry nutrient makers have already done the work for you?

You gonna play with MICROnutrient ratios? REALLY? WHY?

Otherwise, why Fuck with them at all? The mix has all the micros and you aren't going to save anything- trust me- if you try to make your own micros from scratch.

I'm telling you that a mix that's designed to be complete when used with calcium nitrate, MKP and epsom salt is the best of both worlds; you get the ability to change the ratios of the stuff that matters- and the pain in the ass stuff that doesn't matter is already taken care of. Problem solved!

So why put yourself thru all the brain damage?

 

[firsttimeARE]

I thought that this is what making your own nutrients was all about? So I googled how and google just told me what I asked of it.

Im all for making things simple. I just thought this was where the savings was and not mixing something someone else already measured for you.

So calcium nitrate, mkp and epsom will only give me, N,P,K,Ca,Mg, S and you get the hi-k stuff for the rest? It'd probably help my understanding to check this hi-k stuff out. The thing I was reading was saying i'd get more calcium out of calcium nitrate than I would nitrogen. I imagine this hi-k stuff will have additional nitrogen?

 

[Atomizer]

A single micronute ratio doesnt serve all purposes, if the ratio is fixed you`re stuck with it.
If you have the individual elements you can have whatever ratio mix you like. The cost of 1000 gal worth of a custom ratio (excl iron) is around $0.50

 

[ttystikk]

I thought that this is what making your own nutrients was all about? So I googled how and google just told me what I asked of it.

Im all for making things simple. I just thought this was where the savings was and not mixing something someone else already measured for you.

So calcium nitrate, mkp and epsom will only give me, N,P,K,Ca,Mg, S and you get the hi-k stuff for the rest? It'd probably help my understanding to check this hi-k stuff out. The thing I was reading was saying i'd get more calcium out of calcium nitrate than I would nitrogen. I imagine this hi-k stuff will have additional nitrogen?

Hydrogardens.com

Hi K hydroponic mix; 5-12-26 plus micros. So yes it does have additional nitrogen, just the right amount to balance the calcium nitrate, in fact. That's plenty of P for rooting and veg, and most flowering plants want plenty of K. Again, the micros are already in there, in the correct ratios. I like Hydrogardens.com better than JRPeters 'Jacks' brand because Hydrogardens doesn't have dye, and it has more micros by about double. This ensures your girls will never get strange deficiencies if the fert is used correctly.

Price? Less than $45 for a 25lb bag of dry mix, enough for roughly 5000 gallons of nutrient solution! Yara Liva brand calcium nitrate is the recommended match, as it has a bit of ammoniacal nitrogen in it to help balance pH. This will run you some sixty bux or so for a FIFTY pound bag. They sell small amounts of MKP, no need to get a big bag- unless you're a dispensary, you'll never use it all. Get epsom salt at Wal-Mart, their price is as good as anywhere else.

 

[ttystikk]

A single micronute ratio doesnt serve all purposes, if the ratio is fixed you`re stuck with it.
If you have the individual elements you can have whatever ratio mix you like. The cost of 1000 gal worth of a custom ratio (excl iron) is around $0.50

This is a pot plant, it's not rocket science. They're happy with the same thing that grows tomatoes. No such thing as a magic micro mix that will instantly make your plants blow up.

 

[Atomizer]

Nope, i agree, not rocket science. Its also true to say theres no fixed ratio magic micro mix that will work with all growing media, RW, Coco etc. The growing method used makes a difference, micro`s for recirc are much higher than for drain to waste. I guess it boils down to the grower`s choice, some spend more time measuring out additives to throw in the res than it takes to mix a complete custom nute

 

[firsttimeARE]

Hydrogardens . com didn't work for me

I found a hydro-gardens . com but after searching all 24 pages of their fertilizer section I could't find anything on this "hi-K" stuff you are talking about.

 

[Atomizer]

Its prolly the chem-gro hydroponic special formula 5-11-26

 

[ttystikk]

Hydrogardens . com didn't work for me

I found a hydro-gardens . com but after searching all 24 pages of their fertilizer section I could't find anything on this "hi-K" stuff you are talking about.

https://hydro-gardens.com/product/hydroponic-special-formula-25lbs-bag-5-11-26/

This. They just redid their website and it sucks.

 

[Atomizer]

That 25lb bag could be made for under $30 even without bulk chem discounts I dont begrudge them that kind of profit margin, its more than fair compared to the 1000% and more thats on most bottled nutes.

 

[ttystikk]

That 25lb bag could be made for under $30 even without bulk chem discounts I dont begrudge them that kind of profit margin, its more than fair compared to the 1000% and more thats on most bottled nutes.

Perhaps, but it's balanced, complete and ready to use. And forty bucks to make 5000 gallons of nutrient solution is plenty affordable for me, saving another ten isn't worth the additional brain damage.

 

[Atomizer]

The issue with premixed dry nutes is whether you can be 100% sure each spoonful from a 25lb bag is chemically identical to the next. If you dump the whole 25lb bag into a stock tank it would reduce the likelihood of inaccuracies. When you weigh out individual chems there`s no question of whats going into the stock solution even if its a 1L stock.

 

[ttystikk]

The issue with premixed dry nutes is whether you can be 100% sure each spoonful from a 25lb bag is chemically identical to the next. If you dump the whole 25lb bag into a stock tank it would reduce the likelihood of inaccuracies. When you weigh out individual chems there`s no question of whats going into the stock solution even if its a 1L stock.

Very true- so I used a ceramic lined 55 gallon drum for a stock tank and did the whole bag. It's easier to work with this way, as well.

 

[Atomizer]

Might be sitting in the drum for a while, depending on how fast you can burn through 4000 gallons of nutes