Need some help choosing an organic method.

G

GrowUrOwnDank

Well-Known Member
I love the information on Rollitup and appreciate all the experience everyone shares freely. But, the differing methods are sometimes overwhelming to newbs. And I am admittedly a brand Newb when it comes to organics, super soils and living soils.

So, I want to get my feet wet. I am germing some lemon tree seeds, 15 total and would like to plant 3 in a living soil. It could take up to 40 days to germ so I got time before I will transplant into odd 3 gallon pots I have laying around. Or 5 gallon buckets, whatever I have. I will eventually move them into 5 or 10 gallon decorative pots so I can move them inside when it's cold.

I am looking for a cheap, simple and effective method to making a living soil. I have some Amazon Bloom Earth juice soil I really like and can get more of that. I mix it with a lot of perlite for aeration and to avoid the soil from
compacting. Also keep in mind that the Lemon Trees could live for decades.

I know the information is probably already here if someone could just link me up to an easy, cheap, effective, not so challenging method for a brand newb to get started. Heck I might even try two or three different methods.

Thank you.
 
sunny747

sunny747

Well-Known Member
Yes, a good organic soil recipe can be confusing or too much work. I was looking for a "water-only" mix that was simple and didn't require a chemistry set to feed.

This was the solution.

  • Fox Farms Happy Frog or OF
  • Perlite
  • Happy Frog dry nutes for fruit and flower (It's organic with all the good things people add to a base soil. comes with mycos) Comes in a bag. $13-$20.
  • Fox Farms Big Bloom. I believe this has mycos and other beneficial items.
  • Dolomite Lime
See link for Happy Frog Nutes. http://www.amazon.com/FoxFarm-FX14060-Happy-Flower-Fertilizer/dp/B002JLCBNM

I added the Happy Frog dry nutes to the lower section of the pot since I will not be potting up, This way the plant will get the nutes when it needs it. So far in a 3 gallon pot all I have done is give her bottled water with a little big bloom, calmag and rooting aid. I have done no PH ing at all. I do know that the PH of the bottled water (RO) is 7.0.

If I feel that I need more nutes I can always supplement by scratching in a little bit of Happy Frog Dry Nutes or use some liquid nutes that I have.

I do have some nute burn, but this an autoflower that likely requires very little nutes, initially.
 
SCorganictroth831

SCorganictroth831

Well-Known Member
start with a base mix you can source one online from sunshine growers or a similar company. To that add ewc, compost, alaska humus, seed meals (cotton seed, neem, soy bean meal the more diversity the better. Alfalfa meal is a very important additive for my soils along with kelp meal and oyster shell powder or crab meal. From my experience the more ingredients the better! maybe some vermiculite if the mix doesnt come with it. dont want to get to carried away but you get the idea, feel free to let me know if i missed anything guys
 
Pattahabi

Pattahabi

Well-Known Member
You're going to have to do some reading on organics. There are varying opinions because this this isn't a hydrostore bottled nute where you add 10ml of the red bottle with 15ml of the green bottle, pH and that's that. Cannabis has many cultivars that grow in many areas of the world in many different environments. Like Hyroot said, I'd read at least the first several pages of the ROLS thread and use that as a template to get started. You will then need to tweek things to how you like to grow. There will be a learning curve, but it is well worth it imho.

I do wish there was a little better starting resource for organic growers on this site. Headtreep did a great job of listing out the components, but I think the overall method/message is not as clear as in some ROLS/No-Till threads. Remember , this is not about NPK. We are building a living soil - an entire ecosystem underground. ;)

Peace!

P-
 
SCorganictroth831

SCorganictroth831

Well-Known Member
Its not as complicated as it seems. All these different methods and recipes might overwhelm you but just start with the basics and build your soil as you gain knowledge of what ingredients do what. Their is a much bigger buffer for error in organic grows compared to bottled nute grows, so do some expierimenting
 
G

GrowUrOwnDank

Well-Known Member
I appreciate all of the advice and insights guys. Especially the "overwhelmed" part. Haha. Organics really does seem like rocket science. Whew. I'm gonna heed all of your advice and muster up the courage to take the plunge. I've even explored throwing some red fiddlers in the mix. I dunno.

If it weren't for the fact that these plants will hopefully last for decades, Im probably too lazy to jump into this for just MJ.

Kudos to all of your kind offerings of obviously educated advice. And I bow to all of your knowledge and understanding of this technical rocket science.

Sometimes, if you can wade through the muck, trollitup is an awesome resource. I am constantly reminded of just how amazingly intelligent "some" stoners really are.

Thanks again.
 
_MrBelvedere_

_MrBelvedere_

Well-Known Member
Organic can be a million times easier and bulletproof than salt fertilizers if you let it. A 20 year tried and true method is simply use 50/50 perlite/vermiculite in a square bucket and use Earth Juice grow and bloom "original". And occasionally molasses. Fill a milk jug with tap water add a capful of bottled earthjuice, shake really good and let it sit overnight to steep. In the morning it will be perfect room temperature, a nice tea, so shake again to oxygenate and hand water.

Two weeks into flower switch to the 0 nitrogen PK "bloom" formula and use that until flush. Super easy no more reading required :) no more hot crazy recipe soils, no ph meter. Just room temp tap water and a capful of EJ. Been growing exactly like this for 20 years indoors and never ever fails. Dead Simple. EJ is one of the best priced full spectrum organic ferts on the market, for over 25 years. Two simple bottles- grow and bloom! No other products needed.
 
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hydroMD

hydroMD

Well-Known Member
_MrBelvedere_ said:
Organic can be a million times easier and bulletproof than salt fertilizers if you let it 20 year tried and true method is simply use 50/50 perlite/vermiculite in a square bucket and use Earth Juice grow and bloom "original". And occasionally molasses. Fill a milk jug with tap water ad a capful of bottled earthjuice, shake really good and let it sit overnight to steep. In the morning it will be perfect room temperature, a nice tea, so sha again to oxygenate and hand water.

Two weeks into flower switch to the 0 nitrogen PK "bloom" formula and use that until flush. Super easy no more reading required :) no more hot crazy recipe soils, no ph meter. Just room temp tap water and a capful of EJ. Been growing exactly like this for 20 years indoors and never ever fails. Dead Simple. EJ is one of the best priced full spectrum organic ferts on the market, for over 25 years. Two simple bottles- grow and bloom! No other products needed.
Click to expand...
Just a tid bit... tap, well, and spring water are a no go for organics... as well as the fact that aerobic bacteria is what your after, 24 hours of a non aerated soak is going to allow anerobic bacteria to get the upper hand, (bacteria multiply every 20 seconds or so) s providing the acceptable conditions for the microbes you want are very Important.

Id suggest adding an air stone that provides bubbles no less than 1mm in diamteter as this will also hinder fungal growth. (Fungus spores are very fragile and too small of air bubbles will literally shred them Apart

:) hope someone finds this useful.
 
SCorganictroth831

SCorganictroth831

Well-Known Member
hydroMD said:
Just a tid bit... tap, well, and spring water are a no go for organics... as well as the fact that aerobic bacteria is what your after, 24 hours of a non aerated soak is going to allow anerobic bacteria to get the upper hand, (bacteria multiply every 20 seconds or so) s providing the acceptable conditions for the microbes you want are very Important.

Id suggest adding an air stone that provides bubbles no less than 1mm in diamteter as this will also hinder fungal growth. (Fungus spores are very fragile and too small of air bubbles will literally shred them Apart

:) hope someone finds this useful.
Click to expand...

So whats wrong with well and spring water? Also i would not recommend air stones because they are to hard to clean the biofilm from them. I use pvc pipes with 1/16 inch holes drilled that provides alot of aeration and big bubbles.
 
hydroMD

hydroMD

Well-Known Member
SCorganictroth831 said:
So whats wrong with well and spring water? Also i would not recommend air stones because they are to hard to clean the biofilm from them. I use pvc pipes with 1/16 inch holes drilled that provides alot of aeration and big bubbles.
Click to expand...
Well water can contain contaminants from ground soil and spring water already has a microbial system living in it. These will compete with your beneficial bacteria making thingsless affective.

Edit: spring, well & tap can be used with carbon filtering as long as your ppms stay below 100. 50-60 is ideal in my experience. If you cant get your ppm that low with just carbon, reverse osmosis is recomended


Good call on the pvc :)

I do the same for my big dog, but lil stones are easily cleaned if were talking a few gallons of teas once a month :)
 
SCorganictroth831

SCorganictroth831

Well-Known Member
hydroMD said:
Well water can contain contaminants from ground soil and spring water already has a microbial system living in it. These will compete with your beneficial bacteria making thingsless affective.


Good call on the pvc :)

I do the same for my big dog, but lil stones are easily cleaned if were talking a few gallons of teas once a month :)
Click to expand...

Ahh i see, that is a very good point about the water. Never really thought about it that way. Do you know anything about using creek water, i heard it was really good for teas!
Yeah if your not using the stones much its probably fine. Thanks for the response bro.

AKS
 
hydroMD

hydroMD

Well-Known Member
SCorganictroth831 said:
Ahh i see, that is a very good point about the water. Never really thought about it that way. Do you know anything about using creek water, i heard it was really good for teas!
Yeah if your not using the stones much its probably fine. Thanks for the response bro.

AKS
Click to expand...
This depends on a lot of variables. Any runoff of chemicals at any point upstream Will spell ttrouble. Any pollutants in general will spell trouble.

The only natural water source i know of that is 100% safe for living organics is rain water.

Water and their contaminants can spread a long way in the soil pan. Creeks and streams are often an outlet for these chemicals into water supplies
 
SCorganictroth831

SCorganictroth831

Well-Known Member
Right on i think im gonna test my water and see what ppm it is.

So do you think it is really necessary to run good tap through a filter or would bubbling it out work well enough? Maybe with some ewc idk.
 
hydroMD

hydroMD

Well-Known Member
SCorganictroth831 said:
Right on i think im gonna test my water and see what ppm it is.

So do you think it is really necessary to run good tap through a filter or would bubbling it out work well enough? Maybe with some ewc idk.
Click to expand...
Check your local water supplies website and checkb if your water is treated with chlorine or chloromine. Chlorine will bubble out, chloromine will not. If your water contains the latter you will need to run ot through carbon
 
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