churchhaze
Well-Known Member
Being warm white
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Being warm white
Doer
Well-Known Member
Another way to look at this, however is that it is narrow band
- Red: 630, 660nm
- Infrared: 730nm
- Ultraviolet: 380nm
- White: 12000k
churchhaze
Well-Known Member
You don't need to calculate LER on narrow band emitters when they give you output flux in radiant power instead of lumens, and either way, it's much easier to find the LER of narrow band emitters.
If output is given in mW instead of lm, you save a lot of steps doing the math to find efficiency.
If output is given in mW instead of lm, you save a lot of steps doing the math to find efficiency.
testiclees
Well-Known Member
Thanks P, very optimistic. My experience with Mars was very satisfactory until it smoked up. I grew a few primo+ ladies with it. Never had bleaching @~24" . I had some decent aroma during flowering. The cured product wasnt hayish but it wasnt really fine either.
What characteristics of vero 29s make for better fragrance and eliminate bleaching issues?
Thank you. Would you agree that about 16" is safe distance from canopy?
Doer
Well-Known Member
Ah this one.
And they bother to calculate PAR density
Actual Power Consumption: 360 Watt
LED Type: 6 High Powered BridgeLux Vero LED Chips (4000K)
Working Voltage: 85v – 265v
Power Supply: 42V @ 2.15A ( 4 Power Supply's )
Operating Temperature: 90°F -110°F (32.2°C – 43.3°C)
Full Spectrum: 400nm-800nm
Thermal Management: 6 x 80mm dual bearing cooling fans
Product Dimensions: 12.25” x 18.3” x 3"
Product Weight: 15 lbs
Lens Angle: 90 degree
Coverage Area: 48″ x 48″ @ 16” above canopy
(PAR): 1,800.4umol @ 14"
Lux: 144,000 @ 16"
---------------------------------------
Consuming 360w at 40% gives 144wPAR and $5.55 a PAR Watt.
wait, I just noticed they are running at 2.15a so more like 30% efficient.
churchhaze
Well-Known Member
16" would probably be good. At that high of a drive current with white light, it's not bleaching i'd be worried about, but charring from radiant heat.
I'm not taking sides. I don't like what doer and sativied are doing to this thread. But, I agree with the point above. I feel I've seen reverse trolling before. Deliberately setting up the conditions for a thread they (the inner LED circle) didn't like to be shut down. Contributing to the heat, then voicing opinions like "this thread should be closed because it's nothing but heat."
Sorry. I get *a lot* more from the people doer and sativied are arguing with. But, nobody's perfect and he's got a point above.
Epistar (Taiwan) isn't terribly bad. The problem is that it's been licensed all over the mainland, produced (or counterfeited) with no standards. Light makers may buy unfinished dies, encapsulating them on-site to no standards. It's not so much Epistar that's the problem. It's that it lost control of its supply chain. The pedigree, process control, etc.
This isn't debatable. The Chinese government mandated higher standards for the LED industry this year due to the bad reputation it has earned. They're intervening instead of waiting for "the market to sort it out" which is what's happening when we advise against epi-whatever fixtures.
Hopefully things will get better.
testiclees
Well-Known Member
Ah this one.
And they bother to calculate PAR density
Actual Power Consumption: 360 Watt
LED Type: 6 High Powered BridgeLux Vero LED Chips (4000K)
Working Voltage: 85v – 265v
Power Supply: 42V @ 2.15A ( 4 Power Supply's )
Operating Temperature: 90°F -110°F (32.2°C – 43.3°C)
Full Spectrum: 400nm-800nm
Thermal Management: 6 x 80mm dual bearing cooling fans
Product Dimensions: 12.25” x 18.3” x 3"
Product Weight: 15 lbs
Lens Angle: 90 degree
Coverage Area: 48″ x 48″ @ 16” above canopy
(PAR): 1,800.4umol @ 14"
Lux: 144,000 @ 16"
---------------------------------------
Consuming 360w at 40% gives 144wPAR and $5.55 a PAR
Watt.
wait, I just noticed they are running at 2.15a so more like 30% efficient.
That is the correct company but i think the 360w lamp has just 4. vero29s.
I dont know the math or concepts to prove or disprove your calculations. Your numbers do not agree with Supras. If you are interested i can likely find the message (private) that shows the values he arrived at.
testiclees
Well-Known Member
does excellent air exchange and movement remedy charring concerns?
churchhaze
Well-Known Member
I really wouldn't listen to Doer. He's new to designing things.
I really can't see why he's already so eager to "help" noobs... he clearly understands very little himself.
churchhaze
Well-Known Member
You traitor LED HATER!!! lol
Depends on the company. Most epi-whatever fixtures are sold on Amazon, eBay and AliExpress. Those companies may not be viable in 2 years. They usually aren't on-shore. They usually require you to send the light back to China. They know that's not feasible, it's just their opening salvo in negotiating a "settlement." They'll offer you $20 and you keep the light.
The high-end epi-whatever brands like Platinum, Kind, Lush, HydroGrowLED, et. al. may provide better support. But, at the price they charge, why not buy something that has less mystery and hype? Something that's more of a long-term investment instead of a throwaway?
It seems like people new to LED don't quantify why they are considering LED. If it's to reduce energy consumption and cooling costs, you have to pay $3-$5 per watt. If it's not for those purposes, there's no reason paying $1 per watt for Chinese epi-whatever when you can get more light for the same money from ceramic metal halide. (Which means there's no reason to buy high-end epi-whatever "mystery" brands. Those brands are simply predatory. They're not the best value for the dollar. And, the discount direct-from-China fixtures are barely valuable when you compare them to CMH.).
As XML diodes and higher-end COBs find their way into fixtures (and lower-end fixtures step up to remain competitive) this will be less of an issue. But, for now, you should be looking at efficient LED like A51, or Phillips agro CMH.
Doer
Well-Known Member
Yet who is actually helping?
You are not. Only me today, so far. And I have looked at two commercial lights, for people. I have engaged in 3 or 4 technical discussions with right thinkers. And yet you all will never shut up. You are all polluting the thread you claim to protect. How foolish is that?
So why don't you all quit bitching and try to help?
stardustsailor
Well-Known Member
Ah this one.
And they bother to calculate PAR density
Actual Power Consumption: 360 Watt
LED Type: 6 High Powered BridgeLux Vero LED Chips (4000K)
Working Voltage: 85v – 265v
Power Supply: 42V @ 2.15A ( 4 Power Supply's )
Operating Temperature: 90°F -110°F (32.2°C – 43.3°C)
Full Spectrum: 400nm-800nm
Thermal Management: 6 x 80mm dual bearing cooling fans
Product Dimensions: 12.25” x 18.3” x 3"
Product Weight: 15 lbs
Lens Angle: 90 degree
Coverage Area: 48″ x 48″ @ 16” above canopy
(PAR): 1,800.4umol @ 14"
Lux: 144,000 @ 16"
---------------------------------------
Consuming 360w at 40% gives 144wPAR and $5.55 a PAR Watt.
wait, I just noticed they are running at 2.15a so more like 30% efficient.
A small correction there ...
Vero 29 ,version 1.2 - 3000K - 80Ra , operating at 2200 mA with Tc = 55°C has 37% radiant efficiency .
I'm not aware though ,how efficient is the cooling system of the particular fixture and if it is capable
of maintaining a Tc of 55°C ,when Ta=25°C .If the COBs operate at a higher Tc ,efficiency is less than 37% ,of course .
Cheers.
Doer
Well-Known Member
Well, what do you mean by charring? I have light burned them big time. It would not cure right and tasted sickening. Then 1/2 way thru cure it kinda got cardboard like and molded. Still I was able to extract good goo.
So, if it is just too close to a big light that is different from heat burn.
Doer
Well-Known Member
A small correction there ...
Vero 29 ,version 1.2 - 3000K - 80Ra and operating at 2200 mA with Tc = 55°C has 37% radiant efficiency .
I'm not aware though ,how efficient is the cooling system of the particular fixture and if it is capable
of maintaining a Tc of 55°C ,when Ta=25°C .If the COBs operate at a higher Tc ,efficiency is less than 37% ,of course .
Cheers.
Right Veros are a bit different from Cree.
Then why ask? I am just trying to help with your limited information.
churchhaze
Well-Known Member
No. If it's too close, the radiant power will fry the canopy, good circulation or not. I've had vero 29 turn tops black at only 1.4A getting within 6 inches. The light is very powerful, and can actually burn your house down if you point it at the floor or a wall point blank. (point blank is some serious radiant heat)
I also have charred circles on my wood floor from vero 18 at only 500mA just from a panel sitting on the floor on for only 30 seconds.
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testiclees
Well-Known Member
11 23rd
Bro think before getting snappy with me.
i didnt ask. You volunteered those incorrect calculations.Right Veros are a bit different from Cree.
Then why ask? I am just trying to help with your limited information.
Bro think before getting snappy with me.
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