Lets Debunk Advanced Nutrients Once and For All, A Guide For Every Noob.
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churchhaze
Well-Known Member
midcoastgrow
Member
Dr.Pecker
Well-Known Member
calmag plus has the proper ratios though. If I said put some calcium and mag in this 120 gallons of soil are you going to know how much of each to use? You pay for the convenience all you have to do is mix half a teaspoon to a gallon of water. I spent $15 on a bottle well over a year ago and still have some. Them fucking devils.
churchhaze
Well-Known Member
I spent 30 dollars on a 50 pound bag of calcium nitrate in 2009 and still have most of it.
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
This is an excellent question. The answer is that calcium nitrate is a macro nutrient; the plants need as much or more of both of these minerals as they do anything else. Epsom salt, aka magnesium sulfate, is needed in much lower quantities. This is already taking the balance out of the grower's hands. Worse is the 'plus': iron. Fine, but where's the REST of the micros? Still gotta find and add them... without ending up with iron toxicity. Then, you need a PK booster...
The base salts are still ten, twenty, even fifty times cheaper. And there aren't any 'magic ingredients', hidden conveniently off label.
MOAB is the strongest of the bloom boosters for a very simple reason; it's just straight MKP- with banana fragrance to throw off the uneducated. Hydro stores will sell you a little twelve ounce jar for $79?! Fuck, THE WHOLE FIFTY POUND BAG COST ME LESS THAN THAT! It still smells good without the fragrance, too.
Y'all getting the picture now? You're buying water and paying for freight- and profit. And in Advanced Nutrients' case, helping finance the owner's vacations to eastern Europe where he can get his jollies sodomizing little girls. TRUTH.
The only commercial ops I know of that used water bottled nutrients... are out of business. Truth.
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
TRUTH. Yara Liva brand? That's the brand I got.
churchhaze
Well-Known Member
Yep. And I use it more than any other salt by mass, so these people all look like knuckleheads. It's the main ingredient!
WeedFreak78
Well-Known Member
I just got a bunch of AN nutes for free. My buddy was raving about them, quoting magazines and whatnot. I told him i was happy with my GH 3 part for $75 ( which has lasted my a couple grows so far) and i wasn't about to spend close to $200 on just veg nutes..F that.. i told him you like it you buy it for me..well he showed up with A&B grow and a couple additives, lol. guess I'm giving it a try..I can't see it outperforming GH enough to warrant the huge price difference.
Aeroknow
Well-Known Member
I'm pretty sure calmag+ uses magnesium nitrate, not Magnesium sulfate.
Just an fyi.
Here's A pic of that satanic addative: lol
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churchhaze
Well-Known Member
It uses magnesium nitrate because you can't mix magnesium sulfate and calcium nitrate in the same concentrated bottle without (calcium sulfate) gypsum precipitating out.
Magnesium nitrate is a lot more expensive than magnesium sulfate though, and cal-mag+ is one of the few places I actually see it used. As long as the magnesium isn't in the same stock solution as the calcium, you will not need magnesium nitrate.
If you don't have any other sources of S, MgSO4 provides a good amount. (which means not using any potassium sulfate )
Magnesium nitrate is a lot more expensive than magnesium sulfate though, and cal-mag+ is one of the few places I actually see it used. As long as the magnesium isn't in the same stock solution as the calcium, you will not need magnesium nitrate.
If you don't have any other sources of S, MgSO4 provides a good amount. (which means not using any potassium sulfate )
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I agree. But, have you tried growing with a simpler, less hyped product?
I'm using a simple, inexpensive, dry product. Just all-pupose and flower&bloom (which I mix together in transition and flower). It seems to work as well as the GH Flora 3-part I used to use. Simpler, 1/8th the cost. No "come on" that sounds like the "Make Money Fast" guy on late-night teevee.
GrowUrOwnDank
Well-Known Member
Maxibloom powder. $17 I think. Enough for 250 gallons using the Lucas formula recipe. I think.
So.... What I learned from this thread? Not a damn thing. Never even thought about AN.
GroErr
Well-Known Member
After seeing yet another post trashing AN for one thing or another, none of it seemingly from experience. I'm thinking there's a handful of users here with some personal vendetta against AN. I use the AN base A&B nutes to supplement my medium, particularly through flowering. No additional supplements or products as I don't think they're necessary and just marketing hype. If you buy into any manufacturers bull-shit or add-on's, don't blame them, blame yourself. I've estimated my nute cost at somewhere between $0.06 and $0.09 per gram of output, depending on the type of run I'm doing and final weight. At that cost I don't care what the fuck is in it, I have more important areas of my grow to spend time on and improve. If you say they don't work or I'm doing something wrong here, please educate me...
GrowUrOwnDank
Well-Known Member
Well fuck yeah! If you make that shit work good on ya brutha. I'll just keep using what's good for me. Thanks.
WeedFreak78
Well-Known Member
Amen! Anyone who listens to any advertising, without doing any research deserves what they get. Almost everyone i know has been taken at one point or another because they trusted the advertising of a product, or worse a salesman. Many people are very naive when it comes to product marketing and believe they have to be truthful in what hey say..lol.
Exactly right, all nutrients work just fine if you use them properly. Over the years I have aquired just about every type of nutrient on the market and every one of them has worked just fine. If you want to spend 100 bucks a bottle, it is your money, if you want to spend 5 bucks a bottle, it is your money. They all work if used properly.
With Sea Grow or Jack's, you could be at 1/2 a cent per gram.
I agree with you that at the pennies level it seems pointless. But, it still comes out to spending $100 per year vs $10. Most people, when faced with saving $90...
Also, even though you only use the base nutrients, why support a company that preys unnecessarily on growers with all the other bottles you have found you don't need? Why support a company that makes it sound like cannabis needs special treatment? If generic stuff like Sea Grow or Jack's works as well, why not decouple from the Mad Magazine-style of AN?
If your minimal use of AN is your defense for using AN, why stay with something you have to defend? There's something clearly wrong (predatory) with AN's style. You imply that via your defense of using AN. Why support a company that preys on growers?
If your response is: "why do you care?" I don't. I agree, the obsession (crusade against) AN seems unnatural. But... I still don't understand when someone defends AN by saying "I don't use much, it's not like I've fallen for their nonsense. And, what little I use is cheap enough." If those are positives, why not be more positive by using none of it (and saving even more money)?
GrowUrOwnDank
Well-Known Member
I'm gonna go out on a limb here. Now we all see newb growers come on the RIU on a daily basis. They be talking about buying this and that, DIY a DWC, gonna get 1000 watt HPS and 1100 LED. Gunna use these nutes and that, blah, blah, blah.
Confession. I own the recipe for success kit. Stuff works, but like 8 parts? I also own a DWC I used once. I have 2 LED lights, this ginormous 65 watt CFLs $25 a piece(still have 3, broke two. A small $125 dollar induction light that don't work and just recently bought a 150 HPS. Not to mention, everything else I've got laying around or is long ago found its way to the trash.
So, what do you do when a noob wants to spend his dough. Well lets see. In Vegas they just comp you so you be like, he'll yeah. For everyone else you make his spending experience as pleasant as possible. Just saying.
It ain't illegal to sell over priced popular stuff. Ask Nike and Michael Jordan?
I dunno. I just use Maxibloom powder. $17
GroErr
Well-Known Member
I'm not defending anything, the point was that it's not enough money for me to worry about it and it works well enough that I can concentrate on tweaking other factors/technology or doing things I like to do vs. making my own nutes. I also don't care what anyone else uses, none of my business. The only reason I posted here was that it just seems like another trash AN thread, getting old.