IF you are new to LED and want help choosing what to buy, POST HERE!

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nomofatum

nomofatum

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nomofatum said:
You are still confused about up front dollars. Lets put it this way.
Upfront:
Epistars: $13 per sqft for ideal lighting 2400w (total $415)
CMH: $78 per sqft for ideal lighting 1500w (total $2500)

Operating costs based on 12/12 and 11c per KWA. (adjust as needed to your local)
CMH: $1.98 per day.
Epistars: $3.17 per day. That is $1.19 more per day.

Making break even be at 1752 days. If you run for 1753 days the CMH will be the better deal.
Click to expand...
This actually makes me think, Fuck decision tree, maybe a calculator with a supplemental mini decision tree would be better, the tree only for weird size/shape spaces.

Pick the lowest cost item for your needs/abilities. That would be perfect, what do you guys think?
 
nomofatum

nomofatum

Well-Known Member
JimmyIndica said:
I have an opinion that LED is Present and future! HID is the past and the sooner everyone gets on board the better for everyone! Now its just a matter of whos research and development you support!
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LED is the most promising tech, but it's not done being developed, it will soon become the only option, but that may still be another 5+ years.
 
nomofatum

nomofatum

Well-Known Member
The unsheilded T9 CMH's are the most promising bulb type I've ever seen.

If we can get $200 ballast/fixtures for them, they will have a strong place. (they give free UVB in addition to the normal grow spectrum, perfect for super dank.
 
JimmyIndica

JimmyIndica

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I still see so many 1000 hps in tents and I don't even bother checkin em out anymore! Its a waste of time? too me that is! I would be outdoor for life! if it wasn't for LED development over last 5 years! If the next 5 years are 1/2 the development we got over the last 5 will be awesome!
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

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Would like some advice. I've spent a lot of time crawling through the various threads and want to especially thank Greengenes, Supra, Gaius and Hyroot for their wonderfully rich and easy to read posts.

A couple of decisions that I've already made:
When it becomes legal to grow in Oregon (mid summer 2015) want to be ready for indoor growing.
Willing and able to build a DIY LED system.
Cree CXA 3070 COB
Soil
Organic

Grow room parameters:
6' W x 6' long x 8' high
Able to provide power, ventilation, climate control to the room
Limit is four plants
Am thinking of 3x3 growing area that can spread to 3.5 x 3.5 but am not firm on this

Searches on the web yielded limited selection choice for single unit purchases of the 3070 COBs. I only find two on the Mouser site:
1) CXA3070-0000-000N00Z240F (4000 K, 70 CRI, ~7500 luminous flux)
2) CXA3070-0000-000N00Z230F (3000 K, 80 CRI, ~7500 luminous flux)

Seeking recommendations for the lighting system and grow area

Could anybody recommend a supplier with a better 3070 COB selection for the small purchaser?
Assuming only one type of COB, should I choose the 4000 K or the 3000K?
Seeking suggestions for heat sinks and light spacing. I'm assuming that I'll be using an active heatsink but maybe not? Gaius's solution using open fans- glued to the COB doesn't appeal to me.
What about a reflector? I found this one: http://www.mouser.sg/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=F13402_ANGELINA-Wvirtualkey56980000virtualkey928-F13402ANGELINAW
 
nomofatum

nomofatum

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
Would like some advice. I've spent a lot of time crawling through the various threads and want to especially thank Greengenes, Supra, Gaius and Hyroot for their wonderfully rich and easy to read posts.

A couple of decisions that I've already made:
When it becomes legal to grow in Oregon (mid summer 2015) want to be ready for indoor growing.
Willing and able to build a DIY LED system.
Cree CXA 3070 COB
Soil
Organic

Grow room parameters:
6' W x 6' long x 8' high
Able to provide power, ventilation, climate control to the room
Limit is four plants
Am thinking of 3x3 growing area that can spread to 3.5 x 3.5 but am not firm on this

Searches on the web yielded limited selection choice for single unit purchases of the 3070 COBs. I only find two on the Mouser site:
1) CXA3070-0000-000N00Z240F (4000 K, 70 CRI, ~7500 luminous flux)
2) CXA3070-0000-000N00Z230F (3000 K, 80 CRI, ~7500 luminous flux)

Seeking recommendations for the lighting system and grow area

Could anybody recommend a supplier with a better 3070 COB selection for the small purchaser?
Assuming only one type of COB, should I choose the 4000 K or the 3000K?
Seeking suggestions for heat sinks and light spacing. I'm assuming that I'll be using an active heatsink but maybe not? Gaius's solution using open fans- glued to the COB doesn't appeal to me.
What about a reflector? I found this one: http://www.mouser.sg/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=F13402_ANGELINA-Wvirtualkey56980000virtualkey928-F13402ANGELINAW
Click to expand...
2700-3100k is your target spectrum for bloom, 6000k-6500k is your target spectrum for veg. For best results use a mix of both leaning in the direction of 3000k for bloom and 6500k for veg, aka put 75-80% 3000k in a bloom area, 60% if dual purpose, 25% or so in veg area, remaining percent go to 6500k.

I would recommend against a reflector. The light is directional, so a back reflector is not needed. You just need to ensure your height is appropriate that the beam angles get proper coverage without excessive overlap. If you have a tent/mylar-lined-room sized to your grow space the walls will act as the reflector you need to push the overlap back to the plants.

I would also avoid any lenses or optics, they all just add light loss and heat, aka reduce your efficiency.
 
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Greengenes707

Greengenes707

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
Would like some advice. I've spent a lot of time crawling through the various threads and want to especially thank Greengenes, Supra, Gaius and Hyroot for their wonderfully rich and easy to read posts.

A couple of decisions that I've already made:
When it becomes legal to grow in Oregon (mid summer 2015) want to be ready for indoor growing.
Willing and able to build a DIY LED system.
Cree CXA 3070 COB
Soil
Organic

Grow room parameters:
6' W x 6' long x 8' high
Able to provide power, ventilation, climate control to the room
Limit is four plants
Am thinking of 3x3 growing area that can spread to 3.5 x 3.5 but am not firm on this

Searches on the web yielded limited selection choice for single unit purchases of the 3070 COBs. I only find two on the Mouser site:
1) CXA3070-0000-000N00Z240F (4000 K, 70 CRI, ~7500 luminous flux)
2) CXA3070-0000-000N00Z230F (3000 K, 80 CRI, ~7500 luminous flux)

Seeking recommendations for the lighting system and grow area

Could anybody recommend a supplier with a better 3070 COB selection for the small purchaser?
Assuming only one type of COB, should I choose the 4000 K or the 3000K?
Seeking suggestions for heat sinks and light spacing. I'm assuming that I'll be using an active heatsink but maybe not? Gaius's solution using open fans- glued to the COB doesn't appeal to me.
What about a reflector? I found this one: http://www.mouser.sg/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=F13402_ANGELINA-Wvirtualkey56980000virtualkey928-F13402ANGELINAW
Click to expand...
Your yield needs will determine the wattage and space needed. How much do you need to pull per harvest?
 
nomofatum

nomofatum

Well-Known Member
Greengenes707 said:
@nomofatum
What kind of led's do you use and what are your results/yeilds??
Click to expand...
First grow was 1200w in 4x5 space, right around 475g, don't remember exact, northern lights. Epistar 3w chips on 50x boards powered at 100w (2/3rds rated.) I have 8 boards of warm (3000k) and 4 of cool white(6500k) Just got my new 30w ones and am in the process of setting up my new room. I really actually need to stop being lazy and get up and go to home depot for parts. I'm also going to run two tanning bulbs for UVB.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Greengenes, regarding how much I "need". well, I don't need anything but want an adequate harvest. This will be for recreational purposes once the prohbition is lifted in Oregon. I'm not smoking right now. Back in the day of the less potent stuff (we're talking seedy Columbian, not the gold) I went through about an ounce a month.

SO, back-calculating from: space available, your recommendation (in previous threads) of 40 watts/sq foot, others description of how much space four plants require and simple greed, I'm planning 3'x3' or 9 sq feet and 360 - 400 Watts in all. I know that others could grow a fair amount in that space -- when all goes right. I doubt that I could right away. What I'd like to do is get the lighting as good as I can and then move on to other aspects of the grow room.

Medic posted a link to a good deal for 3000K COBS with the AB or Z4 split. At Tc= 55 C, 1400 mA and 37.5 V, each COB uses about 52 Watts. I don't know how many PAR Watts this would be. I also don't know if your recommendation is 40 PAR Watts/sq ft or 40 input Watts/sq ft.

Medic, Thanks for the link. I'm probably going to order those COBS. I guess I need 7 COBs but maybe I need eight?

thanks for your help and kind responses.

dog in a fog
 
Greengenes707

Greengenes707

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
Greengenes, regarding how much I "need". well, I don't need anything but want an adequate harvest. This will be for recreational purposes once the prohbition is lifted in Oregon. I'm not smoking right now. Back in the day of the less potent stuff (we're talking seedy Columbian, not the gold) I went through about an ounce a month.

SO, back-calculating from: space available, your recommendation (in previous threads) of 40 watts/sq foot, others description of how much space four plants require and simple greed, I'm planning 3'x3' or 9 sq feet and 360 - 400 Watts in all. I know that others could grow a fair amount in that space -- when all goes right. I doubt that I could right away. What I'd like to do is get the lighting as good as I can and then move on to other aspects of the grow room.

Medic posted a link to a good deal for 3000K COBS with the AB or Z4 split. At Tc= 55 C, 1400 mA and 37.5 V, each COB uses about 52 Watts. I don't know how many PAR Watts this would be. I also don't know if your recommendation is 40 PAR Watts/sq ft or 40 input Watts/sq ft.

Medic, Thanks for the link. I'm probably going to order those COBS. I guess I need 7 COBs but maybe I need eight?

thanks for your help and kind responses.

dog in a fog
Click to expand...
Just input watts. I think that 30-40 is a good point. 40 being for big ass plants and max yield. 35 is more general.

I have 6 cxa AB's at 1400ma over a 3x3.5 and it's great. pulling ~370w at the wall. And could push the coverage a little more if need be too.

You space is more than enough for your needs...so ya 3x3+ is fine and will get you what you need and hopefully some more.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Nomofatum,

I've already decided to go with the CXA3070 COB and am not going to get dragged into a discussion on white light vs specific wavelengths for bloom and veg. I'm just a noob and my opinion doesn't matter. But I am interested in learning more.

The link below is to an article (2008) that has a good summary of what is known about the need for white light and the benefits of red and blue light. Bottom line is that nobody really knows the specific recipe for any plant. However, plants need all wavelengths to be healthy and probably don't need as blue light as much as they need red.

http://hortsci.ashspublications.org/content/43/7/1951.full

Thanks for your suggestions regarding the reflector. It is an idea that I wanted to bounce off the learned ones on this board.

thanks for your help and kind responses.

dog in a fog
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Greengenes707 said:
Just input watts. I think that 30-40 is a good point. 40 being for big ass plants and max yield. 35 is more general.

I have 6 cxa AB's at 1400ma over a 3x3.5 and it's great. pulling ~370w at the wall. And could push the coverage a little more if need be too.

You space is more than enough for your needs...so ya 3x3+ is fine and will get you what you need and hopefully some more.
Click to expand...
OK then, 6 CXA's it is. At this time I don't know if they have Z4 or AB in stock. The relative difference in output is about 9% so I hope that its the AB in stock. In any case, 6 COBs at 52 Watts each makes 315 Watts over 9 sq feet and 35 W/sq ft. On paper, this works out. Thanks.

dog in a fog
 
Positivity

Positivity

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
OK then, 6 CXA's it is. At this time I don't know if they have Z4 or AB in stock. The relative difference in output is about 9% so I hope that its the AB in stock. In any case, 6 COBs at 52 Watts each makes 315 Watts over 9 sq feet and 35 W/sq ft. On paper, this works out. Thanks.

dog in a fog
Click to expand...
I checked last week and they were z4s. Still good...but im no rush so im waiting

Maybe 4 or 5 vero 29 at 80w each would be good also
 
nomofatum

nomofatum

Well-Known Member
You want to be in the 5000-7500 lumen/sqft range. I'm guessing your design puts you on the lower end of that range, and that is fine, leaves you room to add whatever other lighting options you may fancy for round 2,3,4. If you are waiting until summer you might be interested in the next round of LEDs that will be coming out just before then. At a minimum we should see the current gen ones drop a bit in price.
 
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