winner and still undefeated: increasing the minimum wage

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SGT BONGRIP

New Member
The Post 9/11 G.I Bill pays the full tuition at a state school the individual is a resident of. They also give you 9 months of BAH a year for whatever location the school is located.
 
OGEvilgenius

OGEvilgenius

Well-Known Member
SmokeyDan said:
Buck, everyone likes the idea of raising the minimum wage. Even Bill O'Reilly thinks it's time to raise it.

The debate is about how much to raise it, and what it's purpose is.

too much of a spike will harm those in the $12+/hr bracket.

If you're making $14/hr and the minimum wage goes from just over 7 to 10 bucks an hour is it good or bad for you?
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It's bad for anyone not making minimum wage in terms of purchasing power etc. Odds their salary goes up commensurate with the minimum is about 0%. So they get the increased prices and live on the same wage. Quite frankly this is the exact kind of issue where people fight over it but don't necessarily fully understand the issue. I guess that goes for most things people fight about. Carry on.
 
OGEvilgenius

OGEvilgenius

Well-Known Member
TerminatorT800 said:
How much should employers be forced to pay uneducated, unskilled workers who do menial jobs?

There's not much value (to an employer) of an employee who performs a menial McJob.

Want a good job? Then get a good education, or develop a good skill, in a field that pays good.

But don't expect me to pay $5 for a damn fast-food hamburger just so some dumb ass people with no skills can flip burgers and afford a nice car. The economy can't support that kind of waste.
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You don't understand how the economy works very well. All that money people will be receiving will go somewhere, effect demand and in turn effect prices (which will rise). They'll still be affording the exact same stuff they currently cannot afford. Just bringing everyone's standard of living down a bit. Meanwhile the institutional and fundamental problems with the economic system remain and will continue to suck the wealth from the poor souls who don't understand the system into the hands of those who do.
 
OGEvilgenius

OGEvilgenius

Well-Known Member
Well, a minimum wage worker is going to have no savings. So that money goes into the economy. Which increases demand and in turn prices. It makes things more equal, sure - equally shitty for all. The issues of economic disparity have nothing to do with minimum wage. It's a stupid issue used to divide people.

It also creates shortages that hurt business, increases unemployment and in general is not the real problem with how things are, although it somehow gets tossed around like it's an important issue dramatically effecting the growing wealth gap between the haves and have nots.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
OGEvilgenius said:
Well, a minimum wage worker is going to have no savings. So that money goes into the economy. Which increases demand and in turn prices. It makes things more equal, sure - equally shitty for all. The issues of economic disparity have nothing to do with minimum wage. It's a stupid issue used to divide people.

It also creates shortages that hurt business, increases unemployment and in general is not the real problem with how things are, although it somehow gets tossed around like it's an important issue dramatically effecting the growing wealth gap between the haves and have nots.
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Where is the evidence? I'm not interested in reading your opinions on the subject. I'm interested in reading real evidence backed up by peer review. Can you provide that or not?
 
C

ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
OGEvilgenius said:
You don't understand how the economy works very well. All that money people will be receiving will go somewhere, effect demand and in turn effect prices (which will rise). They'll still be affording the exact same stuff they currently cannot afford. Just bringing everyone's standard of living down a bit. Meanwhile the institutional and fundamental problems with the economic system remain and will continue to suck the wealth from the poor souls who don't understand the system into the hands of those who do.
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Well Shit!
Let's cUT everyone's wages in half and see prices fall.
 
OGEvilgenius

OGEvilgenius

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
Where is the evidence? I'm not interested in reading your opinions on the subject. I'm interested in reading real evidence backed up by peer review. Can you provide that or not?
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I'm not sure why I should have to spoon feed you things that are very easily discovered. Or why you have an opinion without even realizing/understanding/recognizing some of the basic underlying economic principles.

You think making employers pay more for workers will ensure they hire more workers? It won't. Not that the small raises proposed would have a dramatic effect on anything anyway.

Clearly you have an issue with wealth disparity. And I don't blame you, I do too. But it seems you lack the understanding as to why this disparity exists in the first place. It isn't minimum wage that's the problem.

Here's a short article from the NYT to consider on the subject. It tries to be balanced and I could debate some thoughts in it, but it generally gives a pretty good overview as to why most economists see this issue as not really important - at least on the surface without delving into more in depth subjects (although I guess you could say that economics is always like this which is why most studies are somewhat dodgy at best).

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/03/business/the-minimum-wage-employment-and-income-distribution.html?_r=0
 
OGEvilgenius

OGEvilgenius

Well-Known Member
ChesusRice said:
Well Shit!
Let's cUT everyone's wages in half and see prices fall.
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Again, I recommend not having opinions on subjects you don't understand at even a basic level. The larger point is though, that simply manipulating the money supply isn't actually changing the situation of the real economy. The disparity is still there. The fundamental problems with the system itself ignored.
 
C

ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
OGEvilgenius said:
Again, I recommend not having opinions on subjects you don't understand at even a basic level. The larger point is though, that simply manipulating the money supply isn't actually changing the situation of the real economy. The disparity is still there. The fundamental problems with the system itself ignored.
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How was the economy 6 years ago?
How is it now?
 
Big Trees

Big Trees

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
The GI bill isn't "free"
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Ya, its a benefit from a job that pays decent since soldiers don't have any expenses. They are given a food, housing and cost of living allowance that is not included as pay(so that 18k or more is cash in hand with no tax). And No soldier is E1 after boot camp unless they fuck up and get demoted.
 
Big Trees

Big Trees

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
Show me some evidence of this

The price increase is marginal, the benefits of raising minimum wage far outweigh the costs
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This since minimum wage represents such a small part of our economy, the negatives won't stack as high as some think. Now the price to raise it to is controversial.
 
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