Why No Clay? Manure? Sand? Forest Mould?!

[st0wandgrow]

Cool, what about oyster shells... That should help aerate to a degree too right?

Sure, providing it's not flour. You should be aiming for bits that are 1/4" to 1/2"

 

[tyson53]

this year I grew in a almost straight compost....it was 95% horse and leaf compost and rest peat moss to help retain water....i also amended to compost with kelp meal...bone meal...azomite..lime..alfalpha pellets..crab meal...worn castings..bloodmeal...I grow in a green house and outside in 25 gal dirt pots....I make my mix and set the compost in pots or in greenhouse beds...i water it for 2 weeks till its done cooking off...then i plant in it..never had a burnt plant..the compost is close to 2 years old...i get 15 yards of it at a time...

Now before using this mix I made my own soils using peat and other bagged soils..cost me over 600 a year..now its close to 150 a year...and the plants grew way better this year than ever...as long as the compost is a year or older its good to go..it has to be will rotted ..like dirt...no chunks...or its not done composting...it should be loaded in worms also...a good sign...

 

[Rrog]

I like having some stone material in there, given that I'd like to run 12+ generations recycled.

The high cellulose / lignin of ice hulls and leaf mold mean they'll be the last to break down, so that's cool

Tyson- thanks for sharing that bro

 

[Rrog]

St0w speaks organic like a BOSS!!!

 

[cannakis]

this year I grew in a almost straight compost....it was 95% horse and leaf compost and rest peat moss to help retain water....i also amended to compost with kelp meal...bone meal...azomite..lime..alfalpha pellets..crab meal...worn castings..bloodmeal...I grow in a green house and outside in 25 gal dirt pots....I make my mix and set the compost in pots or in greenhouse beds...i water it for 2 weeks till its done cooking off...then i plant in it..never had a burnt plant..the compost is close to 2 years old...i get 15 yards of it at a time...

Now before using this mix I made my own soils using peat and other bagged soils..cost me over 600 a year..now its close to 150 a year...and the plants grew way better this year than ever...as long as the compost is a year or older its good to go..it has to be will rotted ..like dirt...no chunks...or its not done composting...it should be loaded in worms also...a good sign...

nice thanks i like this! yeah worms indicate its good to use.

 

[tyson53]

if you go to a farm store you can get crushed oyster shell used to feed chickens...I buy it in 50# bags for around 10.00 a bag..that was one of the things I forgot to include in my mix along with greensand...

 

[DonPetro]

Yeah! This thread is now packed with alot of solid, useful info! As mentioned above, i also found a big bag of crushed oyster shell at an Ag store. Can't wait to incorporate them as well as the bio-char.
@st0wandgrow you ever make your way up here again we gotta link for sure! Feel like i've known you for years lol.
@Rrog you need to stop by the organic section more often!

 

[Rrog]

Worms...

 

[st0wandgrow]

Yeah! This thread is now packed with alot of solid, useful info! As mentioned above, i also found a big bag of crushed oyster shell at an Ag store. Can't wait to incorporate them as well as the bio-char.
@st0wandgrow you ever make your way up here again we gotta link for sure! Feel like i've known you for years lol.
@Rrog you need to stop by the organic section more often!

For sure DP! Not sure of your exact local but I have family in Red Deer and Edmonton. Good chance we'll be heading there around Christmas

 

[greasemonkeymann]

Another article



P-

well, it seems as though I may have had a small blessing in disguise... evidently my landlord didn't recall the numerous conversations about me re-using my soil, and anyways he dumped like ten of my smartpots out... damnit... SO, it appears that i'll be experimenting with biochar a lil sooner than anticipated, luckily I have a bunch of old that I need to use anyways.
so to rejuvenate i'm going to add a quarter cup of the following, per cubic foot.
neem meal
kelp meal
crab meal
oyster shell meal (coarse chunks)
fish bone meal ( I have an old box I need to use up)
rabbit manure
then my minerals---
per cubic foot one cup of each
greensand (see note for fish bone meal)
azomite
glacial rock dust
oyster shell dust
and for each cubic foot I add 4 cups fresh EWC.
i'm thinking about 8 cups of biochar on top of it all.
Sound about right?

 

[Pattahabi]

well, it seems as though I may have had a small blessing in disguise... evidently my landlord didn't recall the numerous conversations about me re-using my soil, and anyways he dumped like ten of my smartpots out... damnit... SO, it appears that i'll be experimenting with biochar a lil sooner than anticipated, luckily I have a bunch of old that I need to use anyways.
so to rejuvenate i'm going to add a quarter cup of the following, per cubic foot.
neem meal
kelp meal
crab meal
oyster shell meal (coarse chunks)
fish bone meal ( I have an old box I need to use up)
rabbit manure
then my minerals---
per cubic foot one cup of each
greensand (see note for fish bone meal)
azomite
glacial rock dust
oyster shell dust
and for each cubic foot I add 4 cups fresh EWC.
i'm thinking about 8 cups of biochar on top of it all.
Sound about right?

Grease, what is in your old soil? I'm curious what the base is? i.e. I use approx 33% peat, 33% aeration, 33% EWC/Vermicompost. And if you knew what kind of amendments where in there?

Peace!
P-

 

[greasemonkeymann]

Grease, what is in your old soil? I'm curious what the base is? i.e. I use approx 33% peat, 33% aeration, 33% EWC/Vermicompost. And if you knew what kind of amendments where in there?

Peace!
P-

the soil is three year old vermifire, its an organic soil with a good mix of typical nutrients, akin to roots/ocean forest/fox farm... I've amended about 10% leaf compost in there too, I wish I had more but my compost pile isn't ready yet, so that's all I have right now.
I've grown two harvests through it, and the second harvest I just used AACT (it was an experiment, on no added nutes) anyways I imagine it's rather used up, I really like the volcanic rock and texture of the soil so I figured I'd "wake it up" a lil, by adding some stuff.
I figure adding a 1/4 cup of most of those amendments will do that, without loading the soil up too much, I may leave out the rabbit manure and fish bone meal, as I think it may have enough food in there as is. the biochar I'm inoculating with a comfrey/dandelion/alfalfa tea, I figure that has a nice amount of nitrogen in it to keep the biochar from stealing my nitrogen.
It's my first biochar experience sooo, not sure if 8 cups a cubic foot is too much or not, maybe 6 cups?
I wish I could tell you more of what the initial makeup of the soil was, I just can't justify throwing soil away, especially the vermifire, just the volcanic rock alone is worth re-using it, and I've grown some spectacular herb using just vermifire, back when I didn't recycle soil yrs ago....
anyways, it's a shame to throw it away, so here I am.

 

[Pattahabi]

the soil is three year old vermifire, its an organic soil with a good mix of typical nutrients, akin to roots/ocean forest/fox farm... I've amended about 10% leaf compost in there too, I wish I had more but my compost pile isn't ready yet, so that's all I have right now.
I've grown two harvests through it, and the second harvest I just used AACT (it was an experiment, on no added nutes) anyways I imagine it's rather used up, I really like the volcanic rock and texture of the soil so I figured I'd "wake it up" a lil, by adding some stuff.
I figure adding a 1/4 cup of most of those amendments will do that, without loading the soil up too much, I may leave out the rabbit manure and fish bone meal, as I think it may have enough food in there as is. the biochar I'm inoculating with a comfrey/dandelion/alfalfa tea, I figure that has a nice amount of nitrogen in it to keep the biochar from stealing my nitrogen.
It's my first biochar experience sooo, not sure if 8 cups a cubic foot is too much or not, maybe 6 cups?
I wish I could tell you more of what the initial makeup of the soil was, I just can't justify throwing soil away, especially the vermifire, just the volcanic rock alone is worth re-using it, and I've grown some spectacular herb using just vermifire, back when I didn't recycle soil yrs ago....
anyways, it's a shame to throw it away, so here I am.

If it's straight vermifire, I'm not sure I would add that much oyster shell is what I was thinking, Bio-char I have heard 5-15%, but I usually error on the light side, so I'd go closer to 5%.

P-

 

[smokey the cat]

if you go to a farm store you can get crushed oyster shell used to feed chickens...I buy it in 50# bags for around 10.00 a bag..that was one of the things I forgot to include in my mix along with greensand...

Hey Tyson and other experienced folk

Will be grabbing next bag I come across.

Just wondering - how quick do bigger bits disappear compared to smaller pieces?

 

[tyson53]

Hey Tyson and other experienced folk

Will be grabbing next bag I come across.

Just wondering - how quick do bigger bits disappear compared to smaller pieces?

it takes time for it to decompose..why i mix a little lkime in there to act a bit faster...but I recycle my soil..so in time the oyster shell becomes part of the soil...if you soil is alive the microbes will work on the shell...its not that big any ways...rice size or smaller

 

[tyson53]

I forgot to mention ..if you go to a good grain store you can get 50 pound bags of organic kelp meal they use to add in animal food...it is from Maine...I forget the name off hand but will look when I go to supply shed...i get 2 bags to amend soil and also make teas...it was 51.00 a bag....the grow shop wanted 98.00 a bag ..and they both look Identical..PLANTS LOVE Kelp...to me its a must add soil amendment and tea additive....I even throw a few pounds on my compost piles.....and at the end of the grow season I add kelp and some Espoma orgaic fert to my grow beds outside and greenhouse to keep soil alive thru winter....

 

[st0wandgrow]

the soil is three year old vermifire, its an organic soil with a good mix of typical nutrients, akin to roots/ocean forest/fox farm... I've amended about 10% leaf compost in there too, I wish I had more but my compost pile isn't ready yet, so that's all I have right now.
I've grown two harvests through it, and the second harvest I just used AACT (it was an experiment, on no added nutes) anyways I imagine it's rather used up, I really like the volcanic rock and texture of the soil so I figured I'd "wake it up" a lil, by adding some stuff.
I figure adding a 1/4 cup of most of those amendments will do that, without loading the soil up too much, I may leave out the rabbit manure and fish bone meal, as I think it may have enough food in there as is. the biochar I'm inoculating with a comfrey/dandelion/alfalfa tea, I figure that has a nice amount of nitrogen in it to keep the biochar from stealing my nitrogen.
It's my first biochar experience sooo, not sure if 8 cups a cubic foot is too much or not, maybe 6 cups?
I wish I could tell you more of what the initial makeup of the soil was, I just can't justify throwing soil away, especially the vermifire, just the volcanic rock alone is worth re-using it, and I've grown some spectacular herb using just vermifire, back when I didn't recycle soil yrs ago....
anyways, it's a shame to throw it away, so here I am.

5%-10% by volume is where you want to be for the bio char. I'd err on the side of less as P mentioned above. 5% would come to roughly 6 cups per cf.

 

[greasemonkeymann]

If it's straight vermifire, I'm not sure I would add that much oyster shell is what I was thinking, Bio-char I have heard 5-15%, but I usually error on the light side, so I'd go closer to 5%.

P-

maybe less oyster shell and more neem (1/2 cup per)is what I was thinking, not sure if i'll get the attributes(anti-bugs) that I want from neem at 1/4 cup per cubic foot...
so, lose the oyster flour, I would like to use the oyster chunks, they are big ones, it the stuff used for poultry or pet-birds, so the chunks are fairly large. I like it for drainage, i'd have a lot of different types of drainage/aeration material in this mix, the vermifire comes with volcanic rock as well as perlite, and i'm adding oyster chunks and biochar. Plus my compost has chunky bits of sticks/leaf material and such.

 

[smokey the cat]

How do you rate neem as a food source - is it low and slow, or fast and easy break down?

Just thinking about how it would go in other mixes in the house - palms and succulents which could do with a low impact systemic to fight off pests and stuff.

 

[greasemonkeymann]

How do you rate neem as a food source - is it low and slow, or fast and easy break down?

Just thinking about how it would go in other mixes in the house - palms and succulents which could do with a low impact systemic to fight off pests and stuff.

its a slow release , can't remember the NPK, but i speculate that doesn't matter much as it breaks down over several grows, i don't use it for the NPK source, i use it for my constant battle with the myriad of mites that live in the redwoods that i live in, and they eat my plants, every damn time. Not to mention it works well on gnats that love the organic soil. It worked pretty good on my wormbin too.