Flushing. A different take
- Thread starter charface
- Start date
charface
Well-Known Member
Your very patient.
Dunbar Santiago
Well-Known Member
Organic material isn't npk, it isn't until that material is broken down by microbes that you get npk. That npk is no different than what comes in a bottle. Salts in your plant is also a myth. Ask hydroponic tomato or cucumber farmers if they flush. When they tell you no, ask why the tomatoes don't taste like chemicals, and why theres no salts in that shit. Your theory is plausible by the way it sounds, but it isn't how it works. Which is why people still think flushing is benefiting them, because it makes sense by the way it sounds. Kinda like how folks still think doing sit-ups will make them lose belly fat. It sounds like it makes sense, but it doesn't work that way.
Plus since cucumbers and tomatoes are like 98% water, don't you think it would be completely obvious if you needed to flush. If there were really nutes and salts left over, the tomato would be a deal breaker. But it's not because there are no nutes or salts in there. No different than cannabis or any other plant.
May11th
Well-Known Member
^ Dunbar, I don't agree. I do sit ups and push ups to turn fat into muscle. I would flush my Chem to get rid of unbroken down Chem nutes. I believe your hiring false info sir. Please don't get mad for this is just a discussion but I've had hydro tomatoes and I've had organic tomatoes, big difference, hydro tomatoes looked incredible but d I don't have the same flavor as organic, I bet them hydro farmers don't "flush" but run straight water the last week of flower, if they didn't I'm sure you would taste it In the end product. I've ran organic straight through with no flush and couldn't taste unused nutes but i believe in a good fade with my organics and a nice white ash on my joint tells all. Later
charface
Well-Known Member
How about watering.
I have been trying for better roots by
letting my medium dry alot more but
Im sure this is hard on the soil bennies.
What percentage of moisture do you guys let remain.
100% being completely saturated.
0% Being completly dry.
Dunbar Santiago
Well-Known Member
No offense, but you have no clue about anything you just said. Any of it. I worked at a gym for 5 years while in college. You need cardio to burn fat, not situps. Sit ups will work your ab muscles, but it won't burn much fat. It's a very common misconception that the average person still believes. And your organic/hydro comparison with the tomato flavor is the placebo effect, the only difference is in your head. You wanted the organic tomato to taste better, so that's what your brain did.
Ash color depends on how quickly the bud was dried and the moisture level in the bud, which affects burning temp, which in turn affects ash color. You're allowed to be naive to placebos and longtime myths, I'm not mad. The human brain isn't perfect. And seriously man, the unused nute theory is a MYTH.
[video=youtube;8Zqe4ZV9LDs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Zqe4ZV9LDs[/video]
hyroot
Well-Known Member
^^^^^ you are wrong. Flushing rids the plants of salt build up caused by synths and chems. Natural organics do not create those salts. If those inorganic salts are still present in the buds, the ash will be black. No matter how wet or dry. Natural organics will always have grey ash even after only 2 days of drying and still wet. Increasing flavor has to do with brix levels. Give the plant more sugars / carbs and that raises the brix levels. Grow some plants and you will learn this. Not just what you hear at the dispensary.
Trousers
Well-Known Member
If you feed properly then you will not get a build up. I had no problems once I realized the Lucas formula was almost twice as strong as my many of my plants wanted. If their is build up, it is not in the buds.
They aren't. Buds can't do that.
That is a myth. Black ash is more likely due to no curing or improper curing and or drying.
I stopped flushing when I grew in coco using GH and never had black ash.
I don't believe that, but I will never find out. I properly dry and cure my weed.
Did you hear about the black ash at a dispensary?
Your implication that buds store nutrients is incorrect.
May11th
Well-Known Member
I'm not arguing dunbar I just have my own experience. My looks are different than yours. I have great organic fruits all around me. I can taste the difference and I know that the quality is far better with organics in many ways. I will never touch chemical stuff unless I run out.
Barbarajax
New Member
We picked up a used 09 TB a few weeks ago. Seller gave us a quick primer on the trailer, but when we got home, we got busy and forgot most of it. What is the process of flushing the water system and getting it ready to use? Thanks.
Olears
Well-Known Member
^this guy makes sense. This seems like a no-brainer.
st0wandgrow
Well-Known Member
I agree with some of what you say, but disagree with you on other things.
Flushing does not make sense. This agree with, but for different reasons. Flushing makes no sense because flushing what is (or could be) in your soil serves no purpose. The things that are supposed to be "flushed" have already accumulated in the plant matter. You wrongly stated that "salts in your plant is a myth". No it's not. Plants absolutley bio-acumulate chemicals, minerals, etc. Comfrey is a prized plant for organic gardeners for this very reason. It's tap root goes deep down and uptakes minerals that aren't normally found near the soil surface, and accumulates those minerals in it's leaves. Plants also have the ability to acumulate chemicals and toxins ..... synthetic fertilizers being no different.
This article deals with biosolids, but the premise can be applied to whatever you are using in your soil for nutrients ....
http://www.environmentalhealthnews.org/ehs/newscience/soy-plants-accumulate-drugs-antibacterials-from-biosolids/
Dunbar Santiago
Well-Known Member
I know plants can take in chemicals, like motor oil, or antibiotics. But we're talking about nutrients. You can't compare nutrients to harsh chemicals and antibiotics. Not only do they affect plants differently, they are processed differently inside the plant. Please tell me what is in bottled nutes that accumulates in cannabis that should be flushed out, and how it differs from it's organic counterpart in the soil. Names of the chemicals and how they're considered salts inside the plant. I've been waiting years for a valid answer to that question. And no black ash bullshit answers either.
st0wandgrow
Well-Known Member
This is seriously a newsflash for you? Here, I'll copy and paste a little blurb from the first article of a google search. This paragraph deals with senescence which is of particular relevance to what we're discussing considering that most people "flush" towards the end of the plants life cycle .....
"During leaf senescence, a portion of the plant’s nutrients are reabsorbed into the leaves. The nutrient concentrations in litterfall differ from the nutrient concentrations in the mature foliage by the reabsorption of constituents during leaf senescence.[SUP][2][/SUP] Plants that grow in areas with low nutrient availability tend to produce litter with low nutrient concentrations, but a larger proportion of the available nutrients is reabsorbed. After senescence, the nutrient-enriched leaves become litterfall and settle on the soil below.
A budget for organic matter in a mature (120-year-old) Scots pinemonoculture (SWECON site). Based on data from Andersson et al.(1980). Units are in kg of organic matter per ha. Att. -attached; Surf. -surface; min. -mineral; and veg. -vegetation[SUP][13][/SUP]
Litterfall is the dominant pathway for nutrient return to the soil, especially for nitrogen (N) and phosphorus (P). The accumulation of these nutrients in the top layer of soil is known as soil immobilization. Once the litterfall has settled, decomposition of the litter layer, accomplished through the leaching of nutrients by rainfall and throughfall and by the efforts of detritivores, releases the breakdown products into the soil below and therefore contributes to the cation exchange capacity of the soil. This holds especially true for highly weathered tropical soils.[SUP][14][/SUP]
Leaching is the process by which cations such as iron (Fe) andaluminum (Al), as well as organic matter are removed from the litterfall and transported downward into the soil below. This process is known as podzolization and is particularly intense in boreal and cool temperate forests that are mainly constituted byconiferous pines whose litterfall is rich in phenolic compounds andfulvic acid.[SUP][2][/SUP]
By the process of biological decomposition by microfauna, bacteria, and fungi, CO[SUB]2[/SUB] and H[SUB]2[/SUB]O, nutrient elements, and an exceedingly resistant organic compound called humus are released. Humus composes the bulk of organic matter in the lower soil profile.[SUP][2]"[/SUP]
Dunbar Santiago
Well-Known Member
Thanks mr newsflash, but you didn't answer my questions with your copy/paste job. You just copy/pasted the process of leaves and pine needles falling to the ground, biodegrading in the soil, and feeding the plants. Your little paragraph about senescence isn't accurate either. Here: http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/463317/plant-development/63903/Senescence-in-plants
I won't bother copy/pasting the whole thing, but you're free to click the link and educate yourself.
Let's try this again. Please tell me what is in bottled nutes that accumulates in cannabis that should be flushed out, and how it differs from it's organic counterpart in the soil. Names of the chemicals and how they're considered salts inside the plant.
I won't bother copy/pasting the whole thing, but you're free to click the link and educate yourself.
Let's try this again. Please tell me what is in bottled nutes that accumulates in cannabis that should be flushed out, and how it differs from it's organic counterpart in the soil. Names of the chemicals and how they're considered salts inside the plant.
hyroot
Well-Known Member
that doesn't say one thing about fertilizers. Only about plant biology. Read your links first. That back fired on you. Synthetics or chemical boron, sodium, phos, potassium, copper, etc.. All create innorganic salts . Here some university studies.
http://ucanr.org/sites/uccesc/files/51474.pdf
http://www.ijesd.org/papers/191-X30004.pdf
chuck estevez
Well-Known Member
this right here says it all
Another way salts in the soil water can affect the growth of plants is by specific ion
toxicities. Ions are atoms or groups of atoms with a net positive or negative charge. Ions
of soil minerals which make up salts, such as chlorine, boron, and sodium, are absorbed
by the plant roots and accumulate in the plant stem and leaves over time. These
accumulated ions can become toxic to plants, and ions such as boron can be toxic to
plants even at low concentrations. Symptoms of ion toxicity can vary by crop tolerance
and stage of growth, but oftentimes ion toxicity will manifest itself as “leaf burning” at
the leaf edges, especially on the older leaves.
The above has been a brief guide to why salts can be harmful to plants.
if you don't over abuse chem nutes, you won't need to flush anything.
Another way salts in the soil water can affect the growth of plants is by specific ion
toxicities. Ions are atoms or groups of atoms with a net positive or negative charge. Ions
of soil minerals which make up salts, such as chlorine, boron, and sodium, are absorbed
by the plant roots and accumulate in the plant stem and leaves over time. These
accumulated ions can become toxic to plants, and ions such as boron can be toxic to
plants even at low concentrations. Symptoms of ion toxicity can vary by crop tolerance
and stage of growth, but oftentimes ion toxicity will manifest itself as “leaf burning” at
the leaf edges, especially on the older leaves.
The above has been a brief guide to why salts can be harmful to plants.
if you don't over abuse chem nutes, you won't need to flush anything.