Organic Soil Basics Help Please

mrorganics

mrorganics

Active Member
I would like to mix my own soil because I don't wanna pay 90 bucks for 5 cu ft mixing light warrior and ocean forest 5050. My question is, is there a way to make a GREAT organic soil with the same quality and nutrient value that would be more cost effective? I don't mind spending it cuz I know it works but if I could make one for cheaper and it would outperform I would definately give it a go. I don't want something that's packed full of nutes to carry it thru harvest just something like the ocean forest that uses up its nutrients in 3 weeks or so. Thanks guys
 
Nullis

Nullis

Moderator
K, so besides the fact that Tiger Bloom and Grow Big ARE NOT ORGANIC... your response doesn't even really pertain to the OP's question at hand.

Of course you could make your own decent soil mix, and there are tons of threads with recipes for them around here and in the Old School organics forum. You could also do the next best thing and just recycle your store bought soil mix after harvest. There are also threads on that around here; you're basically just adding in fresh amendments and letting that all cook for 30-60 days until you can use it.

The only reason I buy my soil is because I just don't have the time to acquire all of the ingredients and mix it myself. If you were to start mixing it up yourself I would imagine you'll likely end up spending more money up front for everything, but some ingredients/amendments can last quite a while so in the long run it definitely would be cheaper.
 
G

growone

Well-Known Member
no question you can save money, i haven't gone quite that far, i use cheap MG Organic Garden as a base soil, few additions actually makes a good MJ soil
from what i've read, composted manure is a much used base, add in some peat moss and you're ready to add the nutrient richer parts
bone meal is a great addition, some dolomite is good, alfalfa is a good plant based nitrogen additive, and the list goes on
 
W

Wetdog

Well-Known Member
The sticker shock for mixing yer own is at least the same, if not more, than buying FFOF. BUT, if you recycle, the cost drops very dramatically the next and subsequent go rounds.

Let's take kelp meal for example. A 5Lb bag cost ~$12. A good chunk of change when you have 10 more amendments to add, but that 5Lb bag is enough for 12-15CuFt of mix. The other amendments are similar to a lessor or greater degree. You don't need to re purchase every time you make up a fresh batch and if you recycle, you don't need to add the full amount, or even all of them.

That first batch is a shot though. LOL

Wet
 
Gastanker

Gastanker

Well-Known Member
I'm moving soon and am debating on weather to have my outdoor veggie garden in smart pots with soil or a hydro system (cement yard). Looking at what I have available this is what I would do:

Buy a yard of soil from my local worm farm - this is 80% compost and 20% worm castings. Worm castings add a bit of nitrogen which is great for starting plants off and more importantly load the soil with beneficial organisms - many of the organisms necessary for the breakdown of other organic nutes (remember they need to be mineralized before becoming available). I would toss in a couple bags of sand for aeration, a small bail of coco for aeration and to boost the CEC, several buckets of the local clay soil for CEC and water absorption, either a bag or two of perlite or small wood chips, a bag of 10-3-1 bat guano, a bag of 6-9-0 bone meal, and several cups of 20-20-20 kelp meal. Oh and of course some lime.

The non nute components are there to hold the nutrients (that's what a higher CEC does), hold the water, provide space for air exchange, buffer the pH, and provide a comfortable structure for root growth.

The nutrients I have listed will start off with a higher nitrogen content (the earthworm castings and bat guano), while delivering a time released quantity of nitrogen and phosphorous (bone meal) complimented with just a general feeding from the kelp meal.

Everything depends on local availability though - your base compost may be different, perhaps they don't have maxsea 20-20-20 kelp meal at your local shop...
 
Wolverine97

Wolverine97

Well-Known Member
Gastanker said:
I'm moving soon and am debating on weather to have my outdoor veggie garden in smart pots with soil or a hydro system (cement yard). Looking at what I have available this is what I would do:

Buy a yard of soil from my local worm farm - this is 80% compost and 20% worm castings. Worm castings add a bit of nitrogen which is great for starting plants off and more importantly load the soil with beneficial organisms - many of the organisms necessary for the breakdown of other organic nutes (remember they need to be mineralized before becoming available). I would toss in a couple bags of sand for aeration, a small bail of coco for aeration and to boost the CEC, several buckets of the local clay soil for CEC and water absorption, either a bag or two of perlite or small wood chips, a bag of 10-3-1 bat guano, a bag of 6-9-0 bone meal, and several cups of 20-20-20 kelp meal. Oh and of course some lime.

The non nute components are there to hold the nutrients (that's what a higher CEC does), hold the water, provide space for air exchange, buffer the pH, and provide a comfortable structure for root growth.

The nutrients I have listed will start off with a higher nitrogen content (the earthworm castings and bat guano), while delivering a time released quantity of nitrogen and phosphorous (bone meal) complimented with just a general feeding from the kelp meal.

Everything depends on local availability though - your base compost may be different, perhaps they don't have maxsea 20-20-20 kelp meal at your local shop...
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Regarding adding coco; it has very little CEC, you'd do better by mixing in a peat based medium if that's your goal.
 
Cannabis Krew 420

Cannabis Krew 420

Active Member
get a bale or promix and add in batt guano and worm castings easiest and cheapest way do it i think thats all my plants needed through veg last summer with the addition of fish emulsions every 2nd watering. guano and worm castings are ideal for your situation i think because they give enough boost to feed your plants for quite a while but you wont have to worry about burning your plants with the addition of your FF nutes, its very difficult to burn with guanos and worm castings, and theyll go a long was as far as feeding goes.
 
Nullis

Nullis

Moderator
Cannabis Krew 420 said:
get a bale or promix and add in batt guano and worm castings easiest and cheapest way do it i think thats all my plants needed through veg last summer with the addition of fish emulsions every 2nd watering. guano and worm castings are ideal for your situation i think because they give enough boost to feed your plants for quite a while but you wont have to worry about burning your plants with the addition of your FF nutes, its very difficult to burn with guanos and worm castings, and theyll go a long was as far as feeding goes.
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The only Fox Farm fertilizers I would consider using in my organic grow would be Big Bloom and maybe their Peace Of Mind dry fertilizer line. I cannot stress enough that the rest of the FF liquid nutrient line IS NOT COMPLETELY ORGANIC, which is indeed confusing considering that their soils are. I wouldn't worry about burning my plants with worm castings, but guano can indeed be very potent fertilizer. Granted, there are a lot of guano mixtures/guano based products which are diluted but the pure bat and seabird guano (Sunleaves guanos for instance) are much easier to overdo. The concern here is primarily for young plants.
 
woodsmaneh!

woodsmaneh!

Well-Known Member
Well there is organics and then there is Organics and finally ORGANICS. Your between the last two. I started mixing my soils 10 years ago and at first it was a labor of love but after rolling a 50 gal full of everything up and down the hall in the winter there had to be a better way. Most soil mixes use some sort of lime in them and need to age or will burn the roots. I came up with this soil mix after lots of experimenting with different choices and have used it for the last 3 years, got lots of pics. Any way this is what I use

20% promix, 20% coco, 20% black earth, 20% worm castings and the other 20% is made up of, cow compost, land and sea compost, blood & bone meal, kelp, green sand, Spanish River Carbonatite mix use and just water.

this is what you get, o did I mention all I do is water thats it. No ph, no teas, just leave them the fuck alone and water. I get 700 to 900 g per 1000w and just water. After the chop I just top dress with the compost, every 3 or 4 grow I add the last 20% all over again. O did I mention I have been using the same soil for 4 years now, no not recycling it, I just pull the plant out by the roots and cut the root ball of in a pail and stick a new plant in.


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TDM

TDM

Active Member
3 parts Pro-Mix BX
1 part top soil
1 part worm castings
2 tsp Bird Guano 13-12-1

Use worm tea for fert until Veg
 
canefan

canefan

Well-Known Member
woodsmaneh! said:
Well there is organics and then there is Organics and finally ORGANICS. Your between the last two. I started mixing my soils 10 years ago and at first it was a labor of love but after rolling a 50 gal full of everything up and down the hall in the winter there had to be a better way. Most soil mixes use some sort of lime in them and need to age or will burn the roots. I came up with this soil mix after lots of experimenting with different choices and have used it for the last 3 years, got lots of pics. Any way this is what I use

20% promix, 20% coco, 20% black earth, 20% worm castings and the other 20% is made up of, cow compost, land and sea compost, blood & bone meal, kelp, green sand, Spanish River Carbonatite mix use and just water.

this is what you get, o did I mention all I do is water thats it. No ph, no teas, just leave them the fuck alone and water. I get 700 to 900 g per 1000w and just water. After the chop I just top dress with the compost, every 3 or 4 grow I add the last 20% all over again. O did I mention I have been using the same soil for 4 years now, no not recycling it, I just pull the plant out by the roots and cut the root ball of in a pail and stick a new plant in.


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Amen, I do much the same with my soil. I don't have all the amendments available in Costa Rica has I had available to me in the States but have finally gotten my soil up to par. My basic soil here is volcanic clay soil, which is very rich in minerals but also it rock hard when it starts to dry out.
Taking this soil, starting a good compost pile and mixing in, lol, I don't roll a barrel up and down the hall but do have a barrel I roll around the garden area to mix. I mix into the soil, about 30% by volume abono compost which is a compost for coffee plants, 50% by volume my compost, 20% by volume charcoal and then chop up banana leaf stems and bird of paradise stems into the mix to act as my perlite and keep the soil from compacting.
I have been using the same soil now for 4 years and I finally am getting it built up to the point where my use of nutes has been decreased with each cycle. Is this the best mix, certainly not, wish I could get the bat shit and bone and blood meal, but if you want good organic soil and have time to work with it you will have far superior results over what you buy. I know that my soil is truly alive with the microbes, worms slithering around in most handfuls of dirt you pull up out of the pile. there is no Phing involved, just some fish emulsion, seaweed exstract and lots of TLC.
Organics the best tasting and smoothest smoke available.
 
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