First Ebb and Flow Grow

Hello room, thanks for taking the time to read my post.

I have been successfully growing weed in soil for years and have just recently decided to move indoors for better control of temperature, light, nutrients etc. After a bit of research online and talking to a few other growers I came across the "Ebb and Flow" method. This system basically includes a reservoir full of water, nutrients and a pump that, at regular intervals, will flood another container or "flood table," in which the potted plants sit. As I could control when the pump turned on and off to the second with a digital timer, I found this method more appealing than using terracotta pots or other manual irrigation techniques.


First, I found a 40/45L container measuring 40cm/70cm/20cm in my garden shed, perfect for my flood table. While I was looking around for other things I could use in my grow, I came across a wire shelf from an old fridge that fit perfectly into my container. This would raise the pots about 4/5mm to help ensure they fully drain between floodings. I then had to sort out an overflow system so when the flood table filled to a certain level, it would prevent the water and precious nutrients spilling over the sides. A small length of plastic conduit (pipe) 20mm diameter, sealed with silicon worked a treat. The pots Im using are about 18cm tall, so I set the pipe to begin draining once the table had flooded to 15cm. (It is best to have the water stop just below the top of the growing medium as you want to avoid the stalks of your plants getting wet and rotting.)

Fortunately I also found another container, slightly bigger than my flood table that would work perfectly as a reservoir. (50L, 40cm/70cm/30cm) It fits under the flood table so well, the overflow can drain straight back into it without the use of a hose or anything, so when the overflow splashes back into the reservoir, it also helps aerate the water, although i am still using an airstone. I purchased a small aquarium pump to fill the flood table, it takes 4mins to fill and 5mins to drain. Knowing this I have set the pump to flood the container every 3 hours. At the moment I have the light on for 20 hours a day, so the pump is turned on 7 times a day. (This is just a first estimate and I will continue to fine tune the flood frequency as I go.)

So after purchasing a grow tent online (1.2m/1.5m/0.6m) and setting it up in my house, I germinated 7 seeds;

2 - Caramelicious strain. (Purchased online, paid absolute top dollar for them)
5 - Caramelicious cross. (Cara strain, crossed by one of the best growers I know, with a strain hes been developing for several years)

I used rockwool cubes, in a humididome, under a fluro light and all the seeds germinated and had tap roots out the bottom of the cubes within 4 days.
So it was only today that I potted my rockwool cubes in clay balls and put them on the flood table for the first time, so excited.

Basically, all I aim to do with my first run is perhaps put a few plants to seed, as no doubt, Ill get a male or 2, and keep the strongest 2 or 3 plants as mothers to clone and pass off to other local growers. I DO NOT WANT TO PUT THESE PLANTS TO BUD. I have a very hardy and potent strain and take pride in the thought I am preserving it and improving its exposure. (Plus, its a lot easier to hide 2/3 mothers in comparison to 3/4 fully budding skunk plants.)

So take a hit, then feel free to browse my setup and let me know what you think. Im so excited but cant tell anyone so Ill have to vent online and I like to vent. A lot. Haha.

Peace.

Hi everyone, the plants are going great, except Ive already hit my first speedbump. I managed to cut costs by purchasing old equipment off another grower, (Ballast, shield, light bulb etc.) but the 'Grolite Ultra Blue 14000k' bulb I was using has given up the ghost and I need a replacement ASAP. Just wondering if there were any recommendations as to a good bulb for cloning and sustaining mother plants in an ebb and flow system?

Also, Im unsure how often I should replace the water and nutes in my res.? Should I be changing the full 50L everyday? Or just test for each nute and ph and adjust accordingly? Im using an airstone, but Im sure water freshocity would play some factor?

Any advice would be muchly appreciated.
Thanks everyone, Ill keep you all posted!

Back again for an update. Here are the little babies at 12 days. A few of the little tackers were growing really long, thin trunks that I assume would be caused by having the light so far away from them? So I lowered my light down until it was almost touching the sprouts. (Its a fluro so it gives off no heat.) Is this the case? Or would nutes have a part to play? As it is Im using about a 75% strength Cana veg part A & B, Rhyzotonic and Cannazyme, would that be too strong a solution for my seedlings? I dont have unlimited space and anything to help maximize, or just increase, each plants net yield would be great.
Thanks again for your time, feel free to leave some tips or tricks that have helped you in the past.

Cheers.

Hi PetFlora, I really appreciate your advice and have taken to hand watering from the top for a while now to promote lateral root growth. Unfortunately, I dont have a metre to measure the ppm of each nute as they are slightly out of my price range at the moment. Would there be any other ways of determining how strong my mix is without using/purchasing one?
Thanks again for your comment, your setup looks amazing. My babies are now at 3 weeks and I was wondering how soon I could sex them? I have attached some more photos to keep you updated with everything and I'd like to note that my 2 best looking plants, although theyre the same strain, 1 is growing a lot taller and thinner than the other. (Im assuming that the bigger, more spindly plant will be a male?) But Im nowhere near sure enough to start ripping plants already.
In the pics, the plant on the left is the assumed male in comparison to the (hopefully) female.

So good to get advice and tips to maximise my yeild. Thank you to everyone who posts, or even just peruses my journal.
Happy growing!

I know of no substitute for a TDS meter unless you are using a nutrient like Hydroponic-Research. Their measured amounts fall within the acceptable range when using RO water that has < 30ppm.

As for when to sex, this depends on how much height you have available. To determine sex all you have to do is increase the ppms (again you need a TDS/ppm meter) from ~ 400 ppms to ~ 500 ppms. The additional P & K is sufficient to signal the plant to sex. Once that happens, you can pull the males and lower the light schedule

You can't assume sex, even by height. Now if you are only seeing 2 leafs per set, with a long distance between each node, most likely that would be a male. But even females will flip to male if they are sufficiently stressed.

According to the pictures, you're doing good so far. Be careful not to wet the rock wool. water closer to the outside of the pots

Looks good, only thing I dont see is a constant circulation pump in the res, unless I missed it. I get little 20 dollar ones at petco and it runs 24/7 in the res it mixes the solution around and keeps it from settling to the bottom between cleanings. I find this also cuts back on any odor as the fish crap from nutes does not make a ring in the res. I also run two airpumps in the res 24/7 also so the o2 is mixed into the water all day and night. Looks good and I like you elevated the pots in the tank to dry out I would cover that grate with something to block the light as the roots will want to grow on the bottom of the tank as the plants grow and they hate light, the roots must be kept dark to grow giant so figure out a way to do that before you start seeing the roots coming out of the bottom.

Hey Petflora, thanks again for your speedy reply. I think Ill have to purchase a metre this wkend. Any preferred brands/anything I should look for? Or just make sure it can measure nitrogen, p and k? And youre saying I should measure my water too? All Ive been doing is using tap water, (that has sat for 24-36 hours to de-chlorinate) adding the nutes and then balancing the pH. If my plants are growing this well with just that, cant wait to see what happens when everything is refined. Would it be worth investing in some water conditioner as well? or is that trivial with the nutes Im using?
From the top of the clayballs to the bottom of the light at max height is about 70/75cm, so I still have plenty of growing to do, but is it really ideal to let a mother plant grow to full size before taking clippings for clones? Or should I do this as it is still maturing?
Sorry about all the questions, just so excited and want to make sure everything is dialled in. Love your system and definitely have taken a few notes for my next generation.
Cheers Pet.

Hey Chrishydro, I did buy some airstones to throw in the res, but they were dirt cheap and dont appear to do anything. I was hoping that the nute water falling back through the overflow would aerate the water enough, but I have definitely noticed a very fishy smell in my tent. Nitrogen in the fish crap I think? But I think you may be onto something there, is it just a normal fishtank filter/pump that you use to keep the res fresh? Do you find it takes any nutes out?
Im also so happy that you mentioned my little grate that the pots are sitting on, I wasnt really thinking about it, but when I found the flood tray in my garage, it was under some old fridge racks that fit perfectly inside, how could I say no. haha. Before I filled each pot with the clay balls, I actually laid down a fine mesh/almost flyscreen material. It is almost like teabags but made of cloth, so water can pass through it with ease, but hopefully will stop the roots. Although the more I think about it, plant roots can grow even grow through cement so..... Would the plants die/the roots rot if they saw light? Or just shock the shit out of them?

Cheers heaps guys, cant wait to update you with more photos. All your hints and advice is invaluable to me and I cant thank you enough. Wish I could share some of the spoils with you, but Ill just have to have a few on your behalf.

Thanks again, Caramelicious.

CarameliciousEbbandFlo said:

Hey Petflora, thanks again for your speedy reply. I think Ill have to purchase a metre this wkend. Any preferred brands/anything I should look for? Or just make sure it can measure nitrogen, p and k? And youre saying I should measure my water too? All Ive been doing is using tap water, (that has sat for 24-36 hours to de-chlorinate) adding the nutes and then balancing the pH. If my plants are growing this well with just that, cant wait to see what happens when everything is refined. Would it be worth investing in some water conditioner as well? or is that trivial with the nutes Im using?
From the top of the clayballs to the bottom of the light at max height is about 70/75cm, so I still have plenty of growing to do, but is it really ideal to let a mother plant grow to full size before taking clippings for clones? Or should I do this as it is still maturing?
Sorry about all the questions, just so excited and want to make sure everything is dialled in. Love your system and definitely have taken a few notes for my next generation.
Cheers Pet.

Thanks again, Caramelicious.

Click to expand...

Link to pH meters. Be very careful. If it drops to the floor (even from ~ 1.5 ft, you can break the probe) http://www.amazon.com/dp/B005H78ZI0/ref=pe_225750_24507060_pe_vfe_dt1

Chlorine is not a big deal FOR PLANTS. I am very health conscious and have owned either distillers or RO systems for 30+ years (yeah Im that old ). Using RO water is a no-brainer as you control all the nutrients (especially Ca + Mg). And in my 3 set ups (all small) during flower I use ~ 15 G of RO water each week. Doesn't seem like much until you realize an RO produces ~ 2g before the tank drains. It takes ~ 6 hours to fill back up. There are tankless systems (Merlin), or pump assisted (which I could add, but requires pump pressure switch and solenoid)

Cloning: There are lots of vg Ytube videos, but basically do not clone until the branches you want to clone (lower branches) have at least 4 nodes. 4 days ago I took 2 clones from Big Girl: she is half way to harvest. So far they are looking good

Aerating your rez: Read my Journal intro for best (KISS) way to aerate. The key is a HIGH VOLUME pump + multiple stones. The long thin blue ones are crap. I use Oxystones

Excellent link Pet, once again you have come up with the goods. I have had a water filter/cooler for the last 4 or 5 years and have never looked back, tap water is terrible. The only reason I havent filtered my res water is that it would take several hours to filter that much. haha.
Im so keen to start my cloning, but theres no way Id do anything to stress the mother, so I guess its just a waiting game for the moment. So its best to start flowering then clone? Or just after 4 or more nodes have grown? The blue airstones are woeful, or even worse than woeful. I have invested in a little aquarium filter (thanks Chrishydro) and already the fishy smell/ring around the res has disappeared.
Getting sooo excited now, cant help but keep checking my babies every 15mins or so. A watched pot boils faster right? haha.

Thanks guys.

GUYS HELP!

The material I used to line the bottom of the pots has done nothing! Roots are starting to shoot out of the bottom of 5 of the 6 pots I have. Will this cause severe damage/kill my babies? Stressing me out.

Also, I have a humidity meter and it is constantly reading 80-85% I have set the temperature to 22.5-23.5 degrees celsius, but Ive heard that too much humidity can promote rotting and fungus growth. Are there any tips to help reduce this? Or even tips on ideal growing %'s.

Thanks everyone, Ill upload some pics in a day or 2, they are looking amazing.