Californias legalization initiative: My thoughts

kendothegreenwizard

kendothegreenwizard

Active Member
I will start of by saying that most of you here at rollitup do not know me. I joined years ago when rollitup first started but had them purge me for personal reasons. I am well known on many boards and was a prolific poster at Overgrow and Cannabis world. I now reside primarily at and am one of the founding fathers of Thecannacabana. I have rejoined rollitup because I wish to spead the word about the new legalization initiative and why IMHO persons should vote no on this bill. Well I also joned because I am a feirce politicao and My buddy Viredd told me the political forum was pretty good.

The measure is misleading. It only allows possesion of 1 OZ or less. That is already a misdemeanor punishable by a $100 ticket and no jail time in Cali so the representation that it will free up $$$ not incarcerating cannabis users is very misleading.
The possession of over an ounce is still going to be a felony under this bill, this does nothing to free non-violent offenders from incarceration. If it were leaglization it would adress the incareceration issue much more aggresively than the sales angle.
It gives control to the Politicians of how to regulate and tax Cannabis, is that what we want.
It says it provides easier access to medical patients. Med patients already have easy access to meds, this law does nothing to prop215 so this aspect is also misleading!
It denies cannabis to persons 18 years old, they can go to war and die but they cannot use cannabis?!?
I am with Dale Gieringer, " director of the California chapter of the National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws "on this and feel that this is not the right approach.
When we were sitting around talking about 215 and what it would bring about I related my feelings that Cannabusiness was going to blossom and that Taxation was going to be the only legitimate avenue for full legalization of cannabis. I am not against taxation within limits, I am against the way that this bill taxes and regulates without setting limits. Counties and cities will set taxation in addition to the states taxes and thus the price will become out of reach for Medical patients. The manner it is written in is a play to reap more profits into the hands of cannamillionaire Richard Lee and those like him.
All one need do is notice that the portion that pertains to sales is the largest and most legalese portion of the bill. This should be a telltale sign. If it were really about legalizing cannabis for individuals the penalties portion that allows for possesion of cannabis would have been the largest and most legalese not the sales portion. It provides more leeway for sales outlets than it does for consumers or less incarceration. . Go figure!!
If we are looking for a bill that just lets people smoke and sets up dispensaries to reap profits then this bill is OK. If we are interested in stopping the incarceration of innocent, non-violent potheads then this bill is unnacceptable.
I say vote no on this bill and lets work on a bill that really legalizes cannabis for the people and does not play further into the pockets of cannabis dispesaries and those who wish to profit hugely from cannabis sales.
Further it imposes phantom felony charges as a caveat to the initiative. I find this to be an unnacceptable addition as well as redundant since such laws are already on the books to incarcerate californians for something we know should be legal anyway.
My $.02
TY for your time. And have an Irie day.
Kendo
 
I have been an activist for decades. i walked the line and gathered 1,000s of siganatures for prop215 and sat face to face with LEO, and eleced officials to implement the prop215 standards. I have worked with and broken bread with the authors of 215, including Dennis Peron, longtime activist, and Dale Gieringer, director of California's Norml chapter neither one of which support the 2010 initiative either. Dale says "I do think it will take a few more years for us to develop a proposal that voters will be comfortable with." California NORML supports the initiative, with reservations as do I, serious reservations.

THere is a reason why Dennis Peron was fired from the position he held at Oaksterdam U. Because he opposed the taxation angle put forth by the owner of O U cannamillionaire Richard Lee.
WHo BTW is the main backer and source of cash for this initiative. Dennis Peron if you don't know is one of the fiercest canna-activist you can imagine and one hell of a person. I have had opportunity to sit with him and talk on several occaisions.

Jack Herer also opposed this sort of bill before he passed away. He called the taxation angle "cannabusiness", and I quote "I don't want to fucking give the United States government one fucking dollar of taxes. I think that they should go to fucking jail for getting you and me and 20 million people getting arrested for pot. It is the safest thing you can do in the universe. And that is what we are going to do in California."

I have also personally sat and spoke with Richard Lee and Jeff Jones who support this bill. Both are good people and fierce activists as well. HOWEVER... They are both in the CAnnabusiness.. And will prosper greatly with passage of this bill. Jeff Jones is one of the partners in The former Oakland Cannabis Buyers Cooperative now the Patient ID center. Richard Lee is the finacial backer of this bill to the tune of $800,000 and Owner of Oaksterdam U and a cannabis dispenary in Downtown Oaklands Oaksterdam district.
 
Right, so it's illegal to possess over an oz...yet it's not illegal to have pounds growing in a 5x5 space. There is NO MAXIMUM weight for the amount you can grow in your 5x5 space.

The issue comes down to this for the VAST majority of us.

being able to grow as much as we want in a 5x5 space without the paranoia of incarceration. Just like selling pot to those who cannot use it (everyone) is a felony now, it will remain a felony to sell it to those who cannot use if the bill is passed (those under 21). NOTHING is different except NOW you can legally sell to those 21+. Better than not being able to sell at ALL, I'd say.

FREE POT (cultivation, although i'm sure they will have a tax on those licensed to grow their own..still cheaper than buying it) coupled with NO paranoia (incarceration).

THAT is why you should vote YES. It's a step in the right direction. The only thing I see wrong with it is it is now treated as criminal GIVING minors weed.


(c) Every person 21 years of age or over who knowingly furnishes, administers, or gives, or offers to furnish, administer or give, any marijuana to a person aged 18 years or older, but younger than 21 years of age, shall be punished by imprisonment in the county jail for a period of up to six months and be fined up to $1,000 for each offense. (d) In addition to the penalties above, any person who is licensed, permitted or authorized to perform any act pursuant to Section 11301, who while so licensed, permitted or authorized, negligently furnishes, administers, gives or sells, or offers to furnish, administer, give or sell, any marijuana to any person younger than 21 years of age shall not be permitted to own, operate, be employed by, assist or enter any licensed premises authorized under Section 11301 for a period of one year.

This is the only part of the legislation that is utter bullshit however it will be EXTREMELY difficult to enforce.

How many times have you had a cop bang on your door while your sharing a joint with your 20 year old friend?? It's not going to happen...especially in CA.

Even if you do get caught doing that (you'd have to be a true dumb ass) it says a MAXIMUM of 6 months...and knowing CALI it wouldn't be anywhere near that.


Again, it comes down to paranoia free cultivation vs ..... extremely high paranoia cultivation? The peace of mind legal cultivation brings ALONE is worth every other negative aspect of this bill.
 
you refuse to identify yourself after claiming so much why should i read what you have to say
 
Just anotherfriday. You are incorrect in your interpretation of the bill. . You cannot possess more than 1OZ grown from a 5x5 space. If you are cught with over 1oz of cannabis you are a felon.
Section 11300: Personal Regulation and Controls
(i) Personally possess, process, share, or transport not more than one ounce of cannabis, solely for that individual’s personal consumption, and not for sale.
(ii) Cultivate, on private property by the owner, lawful occupant, or other lawful resident or guest of the private property owner or lawful occupant, cannabis plants for personal consumption only, in an area of not more than twenty-five square feet per private residence or, in the absence of any residence, the parcel. Cultivation on leased or rented property may be subject to approval from the owner of the property. Provided that, nothing in this section shall permit unlawful or unlicensed cultivation of cannabis on any public lands.
(iii) Possess on the premises where grown the living and harvested plants and results of any harvest and processing of plants lawfully cultivated pursuant to section 11300(a)(ii), for personal consumption.

The stipulation of section (i)Clearly reads Cannot possess, process more than 1OZ. Here is where the lines become very unclear. If one cannot possess more than an OZ under section(i)how is one able to possess pounds as you assert?
 
(iii) Possess on the premises where grown the living and harvested plants and results of any harvest and processing of plants lawfully cultivated pursuant to section 11300(a)(ii), for personal consumption.
Click to expand...

How can that be clearer?
 
Ken go ahead and argue what you want but what you don't seem to understand is that EVEN WITH ONE PLANT it is hard to grow LESS than an oz...that's just not how mj plants grow. They grow much bigger than that as you know.

there is no max weight restriction on the amount you can grow in your 5x5 space.

YOU tell me how people are going to grow less than an OZ in a 5x5 space. Legally, it says you can only possess an oz....your right, that is SHITTY..but its better than the laws we have in place now. Very simple solution. If you are paranoid about getting caught with more than one OZ, bury your harvest outside apart from that one oz... or hide it in a hole in the wall. NO ONE IS GOING TO CARE ITS FOR PERSONAL USE.

Do you think after this law takes effect they will have inspectors come to your residence every week, search THE ENTIRE place (not going to happen) just to see if you are "possessing" more than the legal amount?

IT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. There are far too many people in CA to have the resources to do that, even if they wanted to.
 
kendothegreenwizard said:
I will start of by saying that most of you here at rollitup do not know me. I joined years ago when rollitup first started but had them purge me for personal reasons. I am well known on many boards and was a prolific poster at Overgrow and Cannabis world. I now reside primarily at and am one of the founding fathers of Thecannacabana. I have rejoined rollitup because I wish to spead the word about the new legalization initiative and why IMHO persons should vote no on this bill. Well I also joned because I am a feirce politicao and My buddy Viredd told me the political forum was pretty good.

The measure is misleading. It only allows possesion of 1 OZ or less. That is already a misdemeanor punishable by a $100 ticket and no jail time in Cali so the representation that it will free up $$$ not incarcerating cannabis users is very misleading.
The possession of over an ounce is still going to be a felony under this bill, this does nothing to free non-violent offenders from incarceration. If it were leaglization it would adress the incareceration issue much more aggresively than the sales angle.
It gives control to the Politicians of how to regulate and tax Cannabis, is that what we want.
It says it provides easier access to medical patients. Med patients already have easy access to meds, this law does nothing to prop215 so this aspect is also misleading!
It denies cannabis to persons 18 years old, they can go to war and die but they cannot use cannabis?!?
I am with Dale Gieringer, " director of the California chapter of the National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws "on this and feel that this is not the right approach.
When we were sitting around talking about 215 and what it would bring about I related my feelings that Cannabusiness was going to blossom and that Taxation was going to be the only legitimate avenue for full legalization of cannabis. I am not against taxation within limits, I am against the way that this bill taxes and regulates without setting limits. Counties and cities will set taxation in addition to the states taxes and thus the price will become out of reach for Medical patients. The manner it is written in is a play to reap more profits into the hands of cannamillionaire Richard Lee and those like him.
All one need do is notice that the portion that pertains to sales is the largest and most legalese portion of the bill. This should be a telltale sign. If it were really about legalizing cannabis for individuals the penalties portion that allows for possesion of cannabis would have been the largest and most legalese not the sales portion. It provides more leeway for sales outlets than it does for consumers or less incarceration. . Go figure!!
If we are looking for a bill that just lets people smoke and sets up dispensaries to reap profits then this bill is OK. If we are interested in stopping the incarceration of innocent, non-violent potheads then this bill is unnacceptable.
I say vote no on this bill and lets work on a bill that really legalizes cannabis for the people and does not play further into the pockets of cannabis dispesaries and those who wish to profit hugely from cannabis sales.
Further it imposes phantom felony charges as a caveat to the initiative. I find this to be an unnacceptable addition as well as redundant since such laws are already on the books to incarcerate californians for something we know should be legal anyway.
My $.02
TY for your time. And have an Irie day.
Kendo
Click to expand...

There is a section in the bill that say's unless otherwise authorized ie a medical card
 
JustAnotherFriedDay said:
Ken go ahead and argue what you want but what you don't seem to understand is that EVEN WITH ONE PLANT it is hard to grow LESS than an oz...that's just not how mj plants grow. They grow much bigger than that as you know.

there is no max weight restriction on the amount you can grow in your 5x5 space.

YOU tell me how people are going to grow less than an OZ in a 5x5 space. Legally, it says you can only possess an oz....your right, that is SHITTY..but its better than the laws we have in place now. Very simple solution. If you are paranoid about getting caught with more than one OZ, bury your harvest outside apart from that one oz... or hide it in a hole in the wall. NO ONE IS GOING TO CARE ITS FOR PERSONAL USE.

Do you think after this law takes effect they will have inspectors come to your residence every week, search THE ENTIRE place (not going to happen) just to see if you are "possessing" more than the legal amount?

IT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. There are far too many people in CA to have the resources to do that, even if they wanted to.
Click to expand...


I tell you what. I am going to call Dale Gerienger Canorml director tomorrow and get further clarification on 11300(ii) and (iii) and how they pertain to(i) that says we can only possess one OZ.

Its my understanding that no matter how much we can grow in a 5x5 we can only possess 1oz at a time. I am sure Dale can clear that up and I will post the info tomorrow. OK Bud.

As fgar as the burying part and th rest. Isn't that a bit off the point. We are talking about the new bill and how it does not stop incarceration for possession over an ounmce and you ae talking stash the herbs that are extra. It's like Gorgonzola and brie, totally different cheese.
 
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