17 day old plants need help, yellow bottom leaves.

Questions provided by CannaGod from PLanetGanja and 10K from ICMAG

*NOTE: Please Cut And Paste only the section that applies and add your response. The more information you can give the better and faster people can help you out.Pictures should be added to every thread to ensure a proper diagnosis, when using pictures please ensure your HPS if using one is not turned on while taking pictures, as the lighting hides the plants problems. Fill out

ARE YOU USING?

SOIL:

How long has this problem been going on? 2 Days
What STRAIN are you growing? Nirvana Bubblelicious & White Widow
What was the establishing technique? (seed or clone?) Seed into Jiffy peat pellet
What is the age of your plants? 17 days from first sprout
How long have they been in the soil mixture they are in now? 14 days
How Tall are the plants? tallest white widow is 5 inches, all others are 4 inches except for the shortest at 2 1/2 inches.
What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in? seedling
What Technique are you using? (SOG, SCROG etc) Im a newb so not sure, soil?
What size pots are you using? (Include how many subjects to pot) 16oz party cups
What substrate/medium are you using? What brand of soil mixture are you using?(percentage of perlite, vermiculite...etc?) FoxFarm Ocean Forest
What Nutrient's are you using? none yet, will use FoxFarm Big Bloom, Big Bud, & Tiger Bloom
How much of each nutrient are you using with how much water? *Knowing the brand is very helpful* no nutes just yet but using 50ml of filtered water
How often are you feeding? every 2 or 3 days
If flowering, when did you switch over to using Bloom nutrients? n/a
What order are you mixing your nutrients? (example: veg nutes 1st, bloom 2nd ect) haven't got there yet.
What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used? ehm, good question? Fox Farm
What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"? dont have pH meter yet.
What method of pH test was administered? Using Strips? pH pen? looking to get pH pen.
How often are you watering? every 2 or 3 days
When was your last feeding and how often are you feeding? haven't feed yet, now sure how much to use..
What size bulb are you using? 2 68 watt CFL, 2700k / Equivalent to 300 watt
What is the distance to the canopy? inside of spare bedroom, will move to 6.5 GrowLab once completely hooked up.
What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity) roughly around 40%, seen it drop to lowest 20%
What is the canopy temperature? mid 70's
What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include fluctuation range) day temp up to 80% highest, night 69.1% lowest.
What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.) room fan on high with door closed.
Tell us about your ventilation, intake exhaust and when its running and not running ? running room fan all day everyday, no intake or exhaust yet till tent hooked up.
Is the fan blowing directly at plants? kind of, they are right under them but the lamp fixture is blocking the heavy winds.
Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist? no, only when watered.
Is your water HARD or SOFT? no idea, filtered water from fridge.
What water are you using? Reverse Osmosis (RO)? Tap? Bottled? Well water? Distilled? Mineral Water? filtered tap water i guess.
Are you using water from a water softener? nope, not even sure what that is exactly..
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched? have not put a blade to them yet.
Have any pest chemicals been used? If so what and when? nope, no bugs have been seen inside of my home or grow room.
Are plant's infected with pest's? nope





Above I listed a group of questions that would most likely be asked to help diagnose what exactly is wrong if anything with my plants, I would like to thank CannaGod & 10k from ICMAG for supplying me with these handy questions. I admit I may be a little paranoid about something going wrong with my first grow so if these problems are natural please let me know. The cotyledons turned yellow just a day before the bottom leaves started to turn yellow on a few of my White Widow plants, this is perfectly normal for the cotyledons to turn yellow and fall off. What I am not sure about is if the bottom leaves also can turn yellow, I only notice this on my white widow plants as of right now but it appears that the bubblelicious may start doing it as well. I've been looking for a solution to fix this but I don't want to make the mistake of misjudgment and mess my plants up so I decided to post here first before I take any action. I added a few pictures below for you guys to take a look to help determine if my plants are sick or not, notice the yellow tips on a few of them & the biggest white widow has a few brown spots on tip of leaf. Also being this is my first grow I am not really sure how fast my plants should be growing, I am kinda starting to think that they are not growing as fast as they were about a week ago. Look at the questions above for measurements of my plants to get an idea of how tall they are & if they should be taller or not, both strains are suppose to be medium size plants.


picture 1: upper view of all 3 white widow / 3 bubblelicious plants.
picture 2: bubblelicious #2 looking a little droopy, just watered yesterday.
picture 3: bubblelicious #3, my shortest plant standing 2 1/2 inches tall.
picture 4: my main white widow, tallest with yellow leaves, also notice brown spot. that spot has been there before leaves turned yellow.
picture 5: same plant as picture 4, different picture.
picture 6: and again, same plant...
picture 7: different white widow plant, this is my second worst yellow leaf ww plant.

I would say that from being in those small containers so long, that they have depleted the soil of nutrients,(particularly, nitrogen) and need to be transplanted. They are also getting rootbound by now, so transplant ASAP.

jawbrodt said:

I would say that from being in those small containers so long, that they have depleted the soil of nutrients,(particularly, nitrogen) and need to be transplanted. They are also getting rootbound by now, so transplant ASAP.

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nah the soil has plenty..... of nutes for another 15 days or so i agree with the rooting tho

get them to bigger cups and you really need to get a PH meter that filtered tap water from the fridge... might not be the best...


and do you water them with cold water? make sure its room temp get some holes in the cups too for air and drainage

same thing happened to mine i think it was due to under watering or humidity being to low but im not a hundred % sure also if you gave them any nutes it was to early

I manged to save one i transplated into new soil and into a bigger pot
(frog beeps when soil is to dry)

Thanks to jawbrodt, Uk.Cobra, & PINN3R for replying to my post so quickly, I really appreciate all the help from you guys.

jawbrodt said:

I would say that from being in those small containers so long, that they have depleted the soil of nutrients,(particularly, nitrogen) and need to be transplanted. They are also getting rootbound by now, so transplant ASAP.

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I wanted to transplant the seedlings into FoxFarm Light Warrior but my local hydroponic store didn't have it on hand at the time & I needed to transplant into 16oz cups so I used the Ocean Forest, I also agree with Uk.Cobra when he says the soil still has nutrients in it. I do agree with you with the size of the cup, I've been wondering if I should transplant them into my 5 gallon pots the last few days. I took a trip to home depot today and picked up some miracle gro perlite so that I can fill the bottom of my pots over the drainage holes before I place my 75% Ocean Forest / 25% Light Warrior soil mix into them. I will be doing this in just a few minutes but I need to figure out how I'm going to configure my CFL lights to light up those big pots for a few days till I get my inline fan & carbon filter.


To Uk.Cobra, I plan on going try to pickup a pH meter tomorrow hopefully. When I water my plants I use water directly from the fridge, I don't let it sit but I probably should just start using room temp bottled water. I drilled 4 holes along the bottom rim of every 16oz cup so there was good drainage.

To PINN3R, sorry to hear you had to take a lose over those yellow leaves. Hopefully mine make it, I would hate to have my first grow go bad but you learn from your mistakes right. Where on earth did you get that frog from, I want one?!

^It sounds like you said that you are using cold water directly from the fridge? If it's at fridgerator temp, that cold will shock them quite a bit. I'd suggest letting it warm up to room temp, or using warm tap water if you're in a hurry(assuming that it's of proper quality).

Okay so I went ahead and took everyones advice on transplanting them, this will be there 2nd transplant because the first transplant was peat pellel to 16oz cup. First of it is a pretty bad idea to cut the plastic cups when transplanting with a razor blade, I cut the piss out of my pinky finger. I'll be alright, I should have used my precision scissors in the first place but then I got high. When I cut the cups open I notice roots on a few plants except for the 2 1/2 inch plant, I hope my buddies make it. Being that I transplanted into 5 gallon pots my CFL setup won't be able to light up all 6 pots so I decided to go ahead & Jerry rig my GrowLab up. I have my 6 inch reflector hooked up with a 400w MH light bulb beeming down on my babies inside of my 4x4x6.5 feet tent with the doors open. I have my room fan on high and I also have a 6 inch online booster blowing on my plants real lite so that they wiggle a little. I have a 420cfm exhaust fan with carbon filer on order at the moment, will have my GrowLab compelte once it arrives. As for the tent tempatures the are staying at 81 degrees at the top of the soil, it's a little high I know but that's all I can do for the next few days. I have filtered water sitting out to get it room temp, I'm a little confused to how much water I should give it. I was thinking about using a Crown boxset glass for each 5 gallon bucket directly in the middle of pot, how much water do you guys think?

edit: I forgot to mention that I put perlite at the bottom of each pot to help the drainage.


picture 1: temp sitting at 81% on top of plant surface.
picture 2: babies sitting under the light freshly transplanted
picture 3: close of photo of the babies.
picture 4: my reflector is 21 inches away from my plants, also notice the fan in the left of the picture. i rigged it up to blow some of the heat off the plants, it will have to do for the next few days.

FOAM said:

Okay so I went ahead and took everyones advice on transplanting them, this will be there 2nd transplant because the first transplant was peat pellel to 16oz cup. First of it is a pretty bad idea to cut the plastic cups when transplanting with a razor blade, I cut the piss out of my pinky finger. I'll be alright, I should have used my precision scissors in the first place but then I got high. When I cut the cups open I notice roots on a few plants except for the 2 1/2 inch plant, I hope my buddies make it. Being that I transplanted into 5 gallon pots my CFL setup won't be able to light up all 6 pots so I decided to go ahead & Jerry rig my GrowLab up. I have my 6 inch reflector hooked up with a 400w MH light bulb beeming down on my babies inside of my 4x4x6.5 feet tent with the doors open. I have my room fan on high and I also have a 6 inch online booster blowing on my plants real lite so that they wiggle a little. I have a 420cfm exhaust fan with carbon filer on order at the moment, will have my GrowLab compelte once it arrives. As for the tent tempatures the are staying at 81 degrees at the top of the soil, it's a little high I know but that's all I can do for the next few days. I have filtered water sitting out to get it room temp, I'm a little confused to how much water I should give it. I was thinking about using a Crown boxset glass for each 5 gallon bucket directly in the middle of pot, how much water do you guys think?

edit: I forgot to mention that I put perlite at the bottom of each pot to help the drainage.


picture 1: temp sitting at 81% on top of plant surface.
picture 2: babies sitting under the light freshly transplanted
picture 3: close of photo of the babies.
picture 4: my reflector is 21 inches away from my plants, also notice the fan in the left of the picture. i rigged it up to blow some of the heat off the plants, it will have to do for the next few days.

Click to expand...

looking good now i would wait a little bit for that soil from the cup you transplanted from to dry out then water like normal

remember underwatering hurts but not as much as overwatering can

and get a PH tester looks like the leaves are starting to claw do you even know what your PH is right now?

ditch the filtered water from the fridge k go to water mart or your local water place and get some filtered water ask what the PH is they test it everytime they filter my water place has the perfect PH 6.0-6.5 all ways

Uk.Cobra said:

looking good now i would wait a little bit for that soil from the cup you transplanted from to dry out then water like normal

remember underwatering hurts but not as much as overwatering can

and get a PH tester looks like the leaves are starting to claw do you even know what your PH is right now?

ditch the filtered water from the fridge k go to water mart or your local water place and get some filtered water ask what the PH is they test it everytime they filter my water place has the perfect PH 6.0-6.5 all ways

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I agree. The PH is likely off, or those plants would have a sizeable rootball by now. That 2 1/2" plant must be stunted if you saw no roots at all, when you cut the cup open. It might not make it. It could've been overwatering too, so hopefully the transplanting takes care of that. It's hard to say how much water you should give them, because we don't know how moist the soil is already. You'll have to rely on the good ol' 'finger test', sticking your finger down into the soil, feeling for moistness/dampness. I usually let the top 1"- 1 1/2" get really dry, then water, and I've never had a problem with under/overwatering yet. Those small plants won't use much water, so you shouldn't need more than a litre/quart of water at a time. The heat shouldn't be a problem. I started from seed this summer, and on the hottest days the temp was 95*, with 85* on the normal days, and they did great.(even the indicas) I'd also recommend keeping the light at least 20" from them until they recover from the stress of transplanting, and they should start looking better within a week.

Alright, no one is going to like my answer because somehow no one that grows cannabis realizes that there are hundreds of fungi, bacteria, and viruses that attack the plant, but to me it looks like Leaf Blight. Its a leaf attacking fungus and it is very very common among all types of farmers gardeners and growers. I have no idea why its overlooked so much around here, but it is. Thankfully it is easily identifiable by its necrotic spots with yellow halos.
Any stress to the plant when the fungus is present WILL cause an infection. In the right conditions u wont even notice the shit, other than a few bottom leaves with a scorched look or rusty spots.
Because ur plants were in such small pots they were probably under strress and the fungus attacked. Once u get them healthy and in bigger pots u will not even notice the shit because the plant will out grow it and start to over power it, but it will always be a part of that plant no matter what..
U should wait til u harvest and disinfect everything before adding new plants. If u must add new plants, get a fungicide like Serenade and/or Daconil and apply it as a drench spray every 4-7 days on all the [plants, in fact, applying a fungicide once a week is not a bad habit to get into. It is best to use one fungicide for control and prevention and a different one for outbreak prevention (i.e. if u see new damage) because the fungus builds resistance to any fungicide that is used repeatedly.
Anyways, I have been dealing with this shit for a couple different grows without any luck getting rid of it, Im doing a perpetual harvest and I already started completely over once, tossing everything and disinfecting everything, but it came right back so now I just deal with it, and to tell u the truth its a pain in the ass but certain plants have a resistance to it so find them and clone clone clone.
Im working on a thread that will describe plant fungi with pictures, but if u google leaf blight u will see what im saying.

After another look, I can guarantee u have blight, probably anthracnose, but to prove that we would need a small lab.
P.S. I agree with what everyone else says also. U need to get the ph and everything in check or u will never beat this shit, if u follow what we say here u will be fine. Be prepared, u may lose these plants so order more seeds.
Also, u should probably get the temps around 75 and water a lil less, if the plant is droopy and stems are firm its probably short on oxygen in the root zone, if its droopy and stems are not firm it likely needs water. Good luck.

Uk.Cobra said:

remember underwatering hurts but not as much as overwatering can

and get a PH tester looks like the leaves are starting to claw do you even know what your PH is right now?

ditch the filtered water from the fridge k go to water mart or your local water place and get some filtered water ask what the PH is they test it everytime they filter my water place has the perfect PH 6.0-6.5 all ways

Click to expand...

I would have to disagree and say under watering is the worst thing u can do to a plant. The roots dry up and it has to start over producing roots if it lives thru it, over watering can cause disease, etc... but rarely will ever cause death alone
Also, not to sound like Im attacking ur post, but after the water hits the nutes in the soil, the Ph changes, so just because u have a starting ph in range that doesnt mean that the root zone ph is accurate. The only PH that matters to the plant is root zone PH, and to get that u need a ph tester. Before a grower gets a light they should have a ph tester. If u buy bottled ro or distilled water, it will have a ph very close to 7.

i got the frog from the dollar store belive it or not (my cheap ass loves dollar rama)
but if your not cheap like me i think (dont qoute me on this)\they have similair ones at rona or home depot