Dui checkpoints: How to proceed when the gistapo ask for your paperz

[UncleBuck]

When taken out of context anything can be made to look foolish. Tricks of the dishonest.

i'll be happy to put the full statement in my sig and parade it around as an example of blatant idiocy.

You have not 1 single shred of evidence to back up your claim, not a one. Prove to me that those people were going to kill someone or injure someone, PROVE IT!!! You have made the claim, now you must PROVE IT.

nonsense, i have lots of evidence. i have logs and logs and logs of people being arrested at dui checkpoints. i have piles and mounds of statistics about the increased likelihood of drunk drivers to cause a deadly accident. i could easily use actuarial science to calculate many different forms of "proof" (in the statistical sense). i can come up with numbers about how many estimated miles of road drunk drivers have been kept from driving by DUI checkpoints and how many people are killed per mile of drunken driving and the like.

only someone who lives in a fantasy libertarian utopia would not concede that it is beyond statistical inevitability that lives have been saved because of DUI checkpoints.

the rest is mere deflection and tangents that have nothing to do with the legality or constitutionality of DUI checkpoints and will be ignored thusly. i will only comment on the fact that they prove your desperation to move the subject away from the constitutionality of DUI checkpoints.

 

[NoDrama]

i'll be happy to put the full statement in my sig and parade it around as an example of blatant idiocy.



nonsense, i have lots of evidence. i have logs and logs and logs of people being arrested at dui checkpoints. i have piles and mounds of statistics about the increased likelihood of drunk drivers to cause a deadly accident. i could easily use actuarial science to calculate many different forms of "proof" (in the statistical sense). i can come up with numbers about how many estimated miles of road drunk drivers have been kept from driving by DUI checkpoints and how many people are killed per mile of drunken driving and the like.

only someone who lives in a fantasy libertarian utopia would not concede that it is beyond statistical inevitability that lives have been saved because of DUI checkpoints.

the rest is mere deflection and tangents that have nothing to do with the legality or constitutionality of DUI checkpoints and will be ignored thusly. i will only comment on the fact that they prove your desperation to move the subject away from the constitutionality of DUI checkpoints.

Well with the "mounds and Mounds"of data, you shouldn't have any problem proving your statement then.

Statistics would bear out that arresting all people with cleaning chemicals will indeed save childrens lives, Must be a good thing then.

 

[sync0s]

Nothing unconstitutional about wrongful detention. You can sue.

 

[UncleBuck]

Well with the "mounds and Mounds"of data, you shouldn't have any problem proving your statement then.

yeah, i'm not going to bother running the numbers for hours on end to prove to you that your libertarian utopia fantasy world does not exist.

Statistics would bear out that arresting all people with cleaning chemicals will indeed save childrens lives, Must be a good thing then.

tangent, once again. you really suck at this whole staying on topic thing.

desperation is a stinky cologne.

 

[NoDrama]

yeah, i'm not going to bother running the numbers for hours on end to prove to you that your libertarian utopia fantasy world does not exist.

In other words you can't prove anything.

Stopping people in the middle of the road to check their sobriety is no different than stopping people coming out of the Wal-Mart parking lot and checking their groceries for cleaning chemicals. Both are justified by "Saving lives".

 

[Canna Sylvan]

i'll be happy to put the full statement in my sig and parade it around as an example of blatant idiocy.



nonsense, i have lots of evidence. i have logs and logs and logs of people being arrested at dui checkpoints. i have piles and mounds of statistics about the increased likelihood of drunk drivers to cause a deadly accident. i could easily use actuarial science to calculate many different forms of "proof" (in the statistical sense). i can come up with numbers about how many estimated miles of road drunk drivers have been kept from driving by DUI checkpoints and how many people are killed per mile of drunken driving and the like.

only someone who lives in a fantasy libertarian utopia would not concede that it is beyond statistical inevitability that lives have been saved because of DUI checkpoints.

the rest is mere deflection and tangents that have nothing to do with the legality or constitutionality of DUI checkpoints and will be ignored thusly. i will only comment on the fact that they prove your desperation to move the subject away from the constitutionality of DUI checkpoints.

The police could check every house with over 400w usage on a circuit and an HID signal, which the electrical company can easily monitor. I bet the illegal grow ops they'd catch would be a way higher proportion than dui checkpoints. Let's get it on, huh Buck?

 

[sync0s]

In other words you can't prove anything.

Stopping people in the middle of the road to check their sobriety is no different than stopping people coming out of the Wal-Mart parking lot and checking their groceries for cleaning chemicals. Both are justified by "Saving lives".

Not exactly, Walmart would be private property. Roads are public property that are justified under the Constitution.

Although, the Walmart argument ends with the liberal justification of "serving the public." Bullshit..

 

[NoDrama]

Not exactly, Walmart would be private property. Roads are public property that are justified under the Constitution.

Although, the Walmart argument ends with the liberal justification of "serving the public." Bullshit..

Coming OUT OF the parking lot.

 

[sync0s]

Coming OUT OF the parking lot.

I guess I should pay better attention to your words lol..

You have the ability to sue for police harassment, unlawful detention, as well as police profiling. You have total recourse on these actions and the police know this. They also know you won't do anything about it.

 

[UncleBuck]

In other words you can't prove anything.

false.

i can prove it, but it is not worth the time to explain to someone living in a libertarian fantasy world.

 

[UncleBuck]

congratulations, nodrama.

your wish to make this about anything but the actual topic at hand, the constitutionality of DUI checkpoints, has been made a reality.

we are now chasing walmart ponies and cleaning supply unicorns because you are too chickenshit to discuss the subject at hand.

 

[sync0s]

State	Checkpoints Conducted?	Frequency	Legality
Alabama	Yes	Throughout the year	Upheld under federal Constitution
Alaska	No		No state authority
Arizona	Yes	At least once per month	Upheld under federal Constitution
Arkansas	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
California	Yes	2,500+ annually	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Colorado	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Connecticut	Yes		Upheld under state Constitution
Delaware	Yes	Monthly January to June; weekly July through December	Upheld under state law and federal Constitution
D.C.	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under federal Constitution
Florida	Yes	Between 15-20 per month	Upheld under federal Constitution
Georgia	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Hawaii	Yes	Weekly	Authorized by statute
Idaho	No		Illiegal under state law
Illinois	Yes	Several hundred per year	Upheld under federal Constitution
Indiana	Yes		Upheld under state Constitution
Iowa	No		Not permitted - statute authorizing roadblock controls does not authorize sobriety checkpoints
Kansas	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under state law and federal Constitution
Kentucky	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under federal Constitution
Louisiana	Yes		Upheld under state Constitution
Maine	Yes		Upheld under federal Constitution
Maryland	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Massachusetts	Yes	Year round	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Michigan	No		Illegal under state Constitution
Minnesota	No		Illegal under state Constitution
Mississippi	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under federal Constitution
Missouri	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Montana	No		Statute permits only safety spotchecks
Nebraska	Yes	6 - 10 per month	Upheld under state law
Nevada	Yes	Once or twice a month	Authorized by statute
New Hampshire	Yes	Weekly, weather permitting	Authorized by statute (must be judicially approved)
New Jersey	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
New Mexico	Yes		Upheld under state and federal Constitution (law enforcement must follow guidelines)
New York	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under federal Constitution
North Carolina	Yes	Weekly	Authorized by statute
North Dakota	Yes		Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Northern Mariana Islands	Yes	Twice a month
Ohio	Yes	Year round	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Oklahoma	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Oregon	No		Illegal under state Constitution
Pennsylvania	Yes	Several hundred per year	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Rhode Island	No		Illegal under state Constitution
South Carolina	Yes		No state authority
South Dakota	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Tennessee	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Texas	No		Illegal under Texas' interpretation of federal Constitution
Utah	Yes	About every other month	Authorized by statute
Vermont	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Virgin Islands	Yes	Monthly and during national mobilizations and local festivals and carnivals
Virginia	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Washington	No		Illegal under state Constitution
West Virginia	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Wisconsin	No		Prohibited by statute
Wyoming	No		Prohibited by interpretation of roadblock statute

http://www.ghsa.org/html/stateinfo/laws/checkpoint_laws.html

 

[Canna Sylvan]

congratulations, nodrama.

your wish to make this about anything but the actual topic at hand, the constitutionality of DUI checkpoints, has been made a reality.

we are now chasing walmart ponies and cleaning supply unicorns because you are too chickenshit to discuss the subject at hand.

Why don't you show us utopian libertarians how stupid we are? My claim is less than 1% are arrested for a dui and of that only a quarter are actually convicted. Up to almost 900 times the amount of the dui arrests are seizures of things like marijuana possession or other arrests which had nothing to do with dui either. So it seems to this crazy utopian libertarian, the police don't give a fuck about saving us from drunken drivers, but are converned about over time pay and a money making exercise for the state. If this is saving so many lives, why isn't the government releasing statistics about the glories on the department of transportation or local county police websites? I searched and it doesn't exist. Maybe because it's a lie and people would see how many people the police are catching minor violations instead?

https://www.checkpointusa.org/Checkpoints/Sobriety/sobrietyCheckpoints.htm

 

[deprave]

Libertarians simply see the reality....One of the many myths most people don't realize is that police don't protect people, something libertarians see and others don't, You call us crazy but you guys are the ones living in the comic book world where jack bauer and superman are out there on the streets saving lives and good prevails over evil. This is just not the reality of the situation, government does not give a fuck about you, giant mega corporations do not give a fuck about you, they don't even give a fuck about their own employees. I get kind of get sick of repeating these things but I must repeat it until every human being wakes up: The two great evils in this world are government and mega corporations. These entities work not in the interest of the people but in the interest of themselves and for their rooted power and sustainability... which is money and our very monetary system, thus money is indeed the root of all evils.

 

[deprave]

State	Checkpoints Conducted?	Frequency	Legality
Alabama	Yes	Throughout the year	Upheld under federal Constitution
Alaska	No		No state authority
Arizona	Yes	At least once per month	Upheld under federal Constitution
Arkansas	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
California	Yes	2,500+ annually	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Colorado	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Connecticut	Yes		Upheld under state Constitution
Delaware	Yes	Monthly January to June; weekly July through December	Upheld under state law and federal Constitution
D.C.	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under federal Constitution
Florida	Yes	Between 15-20 per month	Upheld under federal Constitution
Georgia	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Hawaii	Yes	Weekly	Authorized by statute
Idaho	No		Illiegal under state law
Illinois	Yes	Several hundred per year	Upheld under federal Constitution
Indiana	Yes		Upheld under state Constitution
Iowa	No		Not permitted - statute authorizing roadblock controls does not authorize sobriety checkpoints
Kansas	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under state law and federal Constitution
Kentucky	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under federal Constitution
Louisiana	Yes		Upheld under state Constitution
Maine	Yes		Upheld under federal Constitution
Maryland	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Massachusetts	Yes	Year round	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Michigan	No		Illegal under state Constitution
Minnesota	No		Illegal under state Constitution
Mississippi	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under federal Constitution
Missouri	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Montana	No		Statute permits only safety spotchecks
Nebraska	Yes	6 - 10 per month	Upheld under state law
Nevada	Yes	Once or twice a month	Authorized by statute
New Hampshire	Yes	Weekly, weather permitting	Authorized by statute (must be judicially approved)
New Jersey	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
New Mexico	Yes		Upheld under state and federal Constitution (law enforcement must follow guidelines)
New York	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under federal Constitution
North Carolina	Yes	Weekly	Authorized by statute
North Dakota	Yes		Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Northern Mariana Islands	Yes	Twice a month
Ohio	Yes	Year round	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Oklahoma	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Oregon	No		Illegal under state Constitution
Pennsylvania	Yes	Several hundred per year	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Rhode Island	No		Illegal under state Constitution
South Carolina	Yes		No state authority
South Dakota	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Tennessee	Yes	Once or twice a month	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Texas	No		Illegal under Texas' interpretation of federal Constitution
Utah	Yes	About every other month	Authorized by statute
Vermont	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Virgin Islands	Yes	Monthly and during national mobilizations and local festivals and carnivals
Virginia	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Washington	No		Illegal under state Constitution
West Virginia	Yes	Weekly	Upheld under state and federal Constitution
Wisconsin	No		Prohibited by statute
Wyoming	No		Prohibited by interpretation of roadblock statute

http://www.ghsa.org/html/stateinfo/laws/checkpoint_laws.html

Ok so based on this and Total drunk driving incidents for 2008 (http://www.alcoholalert.com/drunk-driving-statistics.html) I scripted this out pretty quick for some easy viewing. The results are not shocking


Total Drunk Driving fatalities in states with Checkpoints 2008:


deprave@freeflint:~$ cat blah|grep Yes^Cwk '{print $1 $2}'|sed "s/Yes//g" > blah2 && for i in `cat blah2`; do grep $i numberof|awk '{print $i " " $2}' >> total;done
deprave@freeflint:~$ cat total|awk '{print $1 " " $2}'
Alabama 848
Arizona 807
Arkansas 585
California 3,081
Colorado 465
Connecticut 223
Delaware 116
Florida 2,558
Georgia 1,284
Hawaii 109
Illinois 911
Indiana 693
Kansas 386
Kentucky 791
Louisiana 821
Maine 159
Maryland 547
Massachusetts 334
Mississippi 700
Missouri 878
Nebraska 223
Nevada 243
Ohio 1,021
Oklahoma 738
Pennsylvania 1,256
Tennessee 989
Utah 244
Vermont 74
Virginia 757
West Virginia



And now for total fatalities in states without checkpoints:
deprave@freeflint:~$ cat blah|grep no|awk '{print $1 $2}'|sed "s/No//g" > blah2 && for i in `cat blah2`; do grep $i numberof|awk '{print $i " " $2}' >> total22;done
deprave@freeflint:~$ cat tota22l|awk '{print $1 " " $2}' > total_no
deprave@freeflint:~$ cat total_no

Iowa 372
Alaska 64
Idaho 226
Iowa 372
Michigan 871
Minnesota 421
Montana 221
Oregon 377
Texas 3,071
Washington 492
Wisconsin 561
Wyoming 134


So looks like a few maybe got lost in the program I wrote somehow chewed it up because the format from my paste wasn't perfect...but as you can see virtually no difference, I think you could probably argue it is less in states without checkpoints but of course there is so much to factor in. If anyone else wants to do some more number crunching be my guest, but it is well within margin of error when you consider it proportionality to population there is virtually no difference. Checkpoints do not protect people I rest my case.

 

[lifegoesonbrah]

Libertarians simply see the reality....One of the many myths most people don't realize is that police don't protect people, something libertarians see and others don't, You call us crazy but you guys are the ones living in the comic book world where jack bauer and superman are out there on the streets saving lives and good prevails over evil. This is just not the reality of the situation, government does not give a fuck about you, giant mega corporations do not give a fuck about you, they don't even give a fuck about their own employees. I get kind of get sick of repeating these things but I must repeat it until every human being wakes up: The two great evils in this world are government and mega corporations. These entities work not in the interest of the people but in the interest of themselves and for their rooted power and sustainability... which is money and our very monetary system, thus money is indeed the root of all evils.

Jack Bauer cares.

 

[redivider]

they may not have DUI checkpoints but I know for a fact texas has no refusal weekends.

they have a judge on hand and if you are suspected of drunk driving they take you to this mobile headquarters where the judge signs the warrant and a nurse draws your blood...

 

[Mindmelted]

Insurance should be changed to IF SHIT HAPPENS!!!!
Well guess what shit has not happened for 25+ years!!!!
The insurance companies are nothing but legalized robbery on the citizens of the united states.

 

[unohu69]

When i was in New Hampshire, they do not require mandatory insurance UNLESS, you have a DUI, or an accident that is your fault. Makes sense to me.

I got T-boned on my way to the mall one day, no real damage just dented my front fender a little. The guy had no insurance. I didnt sue him, he was poor all ready anyway. I just drew a big yellow smiley face over the dent. on a big white Buick it was quite the symbol.

 

[NoDrama]

congratulations, nodrama.

your wish to make this about anything but the actual topic at hand, the constitutionality of DUI checkpoints, has been made a reality.

we are now chasing walmart ponies and cleaning supply unicorns because you are too chickenshit to discuss the subject at hand.

Right now, at this very minute there are THOUSANDS of legally intoxicated people on the road!! At what point did they violate your rights, please be specific, name, date , places and times.