How do I compost my soil if I choose to re-use it?

[kamut]

I have a soil mix that is based on coir, FFOF, FF Happy Frog, Perlite, EWC, guanos, etc. Seems like a good mix, I haven't poured any fertilizer on it yet, just tea and water.

If I want to reuse this stuff, what should I, in general, do to it?

Age it in a container? Keep it wet? Keep it dry? Put it outside in the heat?

I know it need to amend it with more of the above to reuse it. I just can't quite get a handle on "composting it", and I've never re-used before. I feel DIRTY just thinking about it!

 

[KushDog]

damp and warm for 30-60 days, turn and stir it every few days or so, you dont want it Soaked but you dont want it to dry out ether.

 

[snew]

Here is a good link by 3 little birds on reusing soil.

https://www.greenpassion.org/index.php?/topic/20291-endless-soil-remixing-with-the-3lbs/

 

[Rrog]

Your soil has increased its ability to grow plants by having grown plants once already. You add compost, you don't "compost the soil." Heating the soil will kill off all the microlife we've tried so hard to grow and maintain.

I wouldn't stir it, cook it or otherwise disturb it. I'd plant the next plant immediately and top dress with compost, EWC, etc

 

[wyteboi]

Your soil has increased its ability to grow plants by having grown plants once already. You add compost, you don't "compost the soil." Heating the soil will kill off all the microlife we've tried so hard to grow and maintain.

I wouldn't stir it, cook it or otherwise disturb it. I'd plant the next plant immediately and top dress with compost, EWC, etc

This is a good point however the reason we "cook" it is to get any pathogens out of it. once a bad microbes gets ahold of some molasses it will breed an take over the good bacteria we work so hard to get.

You add all your goodies back to it. (a lot of ewc or compost) then moisten it with some molasses water or any carb you got layin around , then like kush said , keep turning it every week or so , dont let it get wet , just nice an moist. then after about a month , the microbes have broken down some of the new goodies an we expect that all the non beneficial microbes are eatin an gone.

the dirt will let off a lil heat after the first week or so , that is letting you know the microbes are in there breakin shit down. when there is no more heat the soil is "ready".






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[Rrog]

Disagree strongly. Pathogens do not have the upper hand in a healthy soil. Here's a rough rule of thumb. Beneficial microbes tend to be stronger but slower. Pathogens are faster but weaker. So in a sterile environment, the upper hand lies with the pathogen. In a normal environment with a healthy herd, there is no foothold for pathogns, as they are beaten back my the beneficial microbes.

The best soil is from a no-till container. No turning, cooking or otherwise interrupting the fragile network

 

[Rrog]

The book "Teaming With Microbes" is a great read and discusses in great detail the biology of the soil itself. I really recommend it.

At the heart of the last few posts on this thread is the notion that it takes time and energy to develop a highly efficient network of bacteria and fungi. Assuming the soil hasn't been doped up with commercial (organic or not) ferts, the soil will have not only improved texture and air-holding capacity from the fungi, but will have a superhighway shuttling nutrients directly into the roots themselves. When we disturb the soil, we destroy all that network. Like a tornado hit town, and you ask the locals to re-build their town all over again.

If the soil is left alone, it will begin to take on aspects like you'd see in old growth forests. The soil is fed with compost and EWC primarily. Top dressed and water brings it down to where it's needed. If the new plant is planted basically the same day you harvest, the town is already built and the micro-life will rush to establish relations with the new roots. If the soil were mixed, and then the plant thrown in, there's no EM Fungi ready for the new. The endomycorrhizal fungi which are specific to canna are Glomus Mosseae and Glomus Intraradices. They won't even start growing until there are root exudates available. So a new plant in freshly turned over oil has to largely start over again. A seedling planted in undisturbed soil takes off running.[FONT=&quot]

Soil left undisturbed in this fashion just gets better with age. Soil texture will get more and more efficient as the fungi adds it's own texture and exudates.
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[Forte Blunt]

I have been re using my soil for several years and It just keeps getting better. I harvest, remove the root balls and large roots and replant within about a week. I go straight into 5 gallon buckets with freshly rooted cuttings and it stays there for the duration of the grow. After about 3 runs I will remove 25% of the soil and add back worm castings and some fresh Ocean Forest soil. I never turn or cook or anything else and I get fat stick nuggs that smell and taste superb.

 

[Rrog]

I bet they DO taste superb! Thanks for sharing that. Very cool.

I guarantee if you simply cut that stalk off at the base and leave the rootball intact, the microbes will stay in place and totally digest it. The Endo Myco Fungi will still be in tact and alive. And if you planted a clone or seedling in the soil right next to the old one, the fungi will plug in and immediately start pumping nutes into the new root system. You should try just one and see

 

[Sunbiz1]

I bet they DO taste superb! Thanks for sharing that. Very cool.

I guarantee if you simply cut that stalk off at the base and leave the rootball intact, the microbes will stay in place and totally digest it. The Endo Myco Fungi will still be in tact and alive. And if you planted a clone or seedling in the soil right next to the old one, the fungi will plug in and immediately start pumping nutes into the new root system. You should try just one and see

This is an amazing thread, that link on the 3 little birds is now on my desktop. I had very good success on one of my last indoor grows using my outdoor garden soil(amended over the years), only I dumped it back outdoors b/c I get these annoying gnats...no big deal but would rather not have them in the house. If I were to start with a different base medium, is there one in particular you would recommend?. I would have to either order FF soil or take a very long drive but noticed the OF being used quite a bit.

Thanks for the input!

 

[Rrog]

Well, if I were to build a soil from scratch I wouldn't use bagged soil. However I used Roots Organic and thought it was fantastic. I just amended the soil with a few goodies and no gnats at all. Fantastic grow. The real key is the compost and the EWC.

I found adding crab shell meal, neem meal, and DE along with a shot of nematodes, I was pretty well armed. All items are harmless / beneficial to the plant. None remotely harmful to the plant or me.

That Three Little Birds link is fantastic, no question.

 

[Rrog]

Another quick thought about this not only being a superior way to grow IT'S MUCH CHEAPER. I can't believe hundreds of guys are not ranting and raving over this. Super great, super cheap. Grows the best weed possible. Seems too good to be true.

 

[Sunbiz1]

Well, if I were to build a soil from scratch I wouldn't use bagged soil. However I used Roots Organic and thought it was fantastic. I just amended the soil with a few goodies and no gnats at all. Fantastic grow. The real key is the compost and the EWC.

I found adding crab shell meal, neem meal, and DE along with a shot of nematodes, I was pretty well armed. All items are harmless / beneficial to the plant. None remotely harmful to the plant or me.

That Three Little Birds link is fantastic, no question.

Well OK then, I'll take the garden soil(worms and all)and amend with some mushroom compost. That should actually give me a head start on the process.

 

[Rrog]

Please don't forget the EWC. Worms and all, absolutely. Please consider the anti-bug amendments I mentioned. They are cheap and very effective. You can save on the nematode cost by using BTI bacteria (Gnatrol) instead.

 

[kamut]

Wow. That concept of planting right next to an existing root ball is so counter to what I've read. It's interesting to hear about different/more organic methods.

 

[Rrog]

Google the "no-till" method if you're interested to hear more.

 

[Forte Blunt]

I have been wondering if I should do it that way, I usually mix in some dry ferts for veg about 3 inches into the top soil as needed. I will experiment with a couple this next run to see how they do.

I bet they DO taste superb! Thanks for sharing that. Very cool.

I guarantee if you simply cut that stalk off at the base and leave the rootball intact, the microbes will stay in place and totally digest it. The Endo Myco Fungi will still be in tact and alive. And if you planted a clone or seedling in the soil right next to the old one, the fungi will plug in and immediately start pumping nutes into the new root system. You should try just one and see

I get gnats too but they are easy to get rid of so I just kill them off. I'd use Ocean Forest or Happy Frog and cut it 50/50 with pro mix or the one I like most is the Humboldt Mix. Throw a 15lb bag of worm castings in, a little bat guano and some dolomite lime and some Happy Frog Tomato and Veg dry fert and you will be good to go.

This is an amazing thread, that link on the 3 little birds is now on my desktop. I had very good success on one of my last indoor grows using my outdoor garden soil(amended over the years), only I dumped it back outdoors b/c I get these annoying gnats...no big deal but would rather not have them in the house. If I were to start with a different base medium, is there one in particular you would recommend?. I would have to either order FF soil or take a very long drive but noticed the OF being used quite a bit.

Thanks for the input!

 

[wyteboi]

In a normal environment with a healthy herd, there is no foothold for pathogns, as they are beaten back my the beneficial microbes.

The best soil is from a no-till container. No turning, cooking or otherwise interrupting the fragile network

If it was a "normal" environment yes your correct , the good will beat the bad, but in a lot of folks way of reusing soil , the dirt is sitting in a tote or something , nice an moist with no air movement , thats not "normal".
You open whatever it is you store your dirt in an stir it once a week or more to keep plenty of o2 in there for the good bacteria , because the pathogens an bad bacteria will build very very fast in a stale , moist environment.

i agree , you dont wanna disturb the web very much if any , but when storing dirt , you have no choice. (of course there are ways to get air to your dirt without stirring it , but its very unlikely people use that method.)

You have very good info rog , welcome to the real dirt club








soil

 

[shizz]

i like to mix up with some compost and i add a few coffee cups of alpah pellets and put into a garbage can i wet it good and then let it heat up the alpaha heats it up really nice.... and ill add bone and blood to it sometimes and chicken manure. just gotta let it sit longer. and after 5 or grows it go outside in the garden.

 

[wyteboi]

just a lil info about mycorrhizae....

myco is a very good , understudied fungus that lives in the roots of live plants an helps them grow longer to reach more food.

in my opinion its always good to add some spores to your dirt or on your roots.

myco can only help if it comes in contact with the roots. unlike other organisms that can walk around on their own.

the key thing to know is if there is plenty of food in the soil , the myco will not survive. myco only establishes itself with the roots if there is not enough food in the soil.
also high levels of P will kill the fungus too.

The only decent reason i can think of to leave the roots in the pot is so the myco can move to the next root , but in general that is a bad idea. you dont want any "composting" goin on in the same pot your growing in...... all the bacteria is focusing on the dead roots an not feeding your live baby. thats why we cant just throw half composted matter in the pot.







soil