Healthcare reform-Do we really want the government screwing this up too?

[Haul me to Heaven]

The government is the worst person to have running anything. Put it back in private hands free market will decide the prices. The insurance companies are as much to blame as the government. It costs me 2 dollars for 50 bandaids but it costs INS 652 dollars for 1. WTF I'm a libertarian voter I feel we have the best plans. Check out our issues you'll feel the same.

I was a key note speaker in o4 for the Colorado State Libertarian Party at their State meeting in Montrose Colorado. Micheal Bandneric was a hoot ! (He ran for Pres for those that may not recgognize the name.)
Cheers !
Good points.
j

 

[doc111]

The government is the worst person to have running anything. Put it back in private hands free market will decide the prices. The insurance companies are as much to blame as the government. It costs me 2 dollars for 50 bandaids but it costs INS 652 dollars for 1. WTF I'm a libertarian voter I feel we have the best plans. Check out our issues you'll feel the same.

I couldn't agree more. Why do some see the government as the answer to all of our problems? If they had more successful programs I could see it but what the hell? I think everyone agrees that something needs to be done. Why isn't controlling cost being discussed? Or tightening the reigns on the insurance industry? Could it be because the insurance industry has the government in their pockets? I think we could figure out some different ways to fix the problem without spending ourselves into oblivion and getting the government involved in my healthcare.

 

[Green Cross]

I couldn't agree more. Why do some see the government as the answer to all of our problems? If they had more successful programs I could see it but what the hell? I think everyone agrees that something needs to be done. Why isn't controlling cost being discussed? Or tightening the reigns on the insurance industry? Could it be because the insurance industry has the government in their pockets? I think we could figure out some different ways to fix the problem without spending ourselves into oblivion and getting the government involved in my healthcare.

Medicare will be bankrupt, unless healthy people can be forced to buy higher prived health insurance, or the government has the power to limit care.

That's what this is all about.

It's not about the 17 - 40 million who are uninsured, because most of them won't be covered... there's nothing "universal" about this healthcare bill.

Here's a good example of what happens when you rely on government to help you, rather than helping yourself, and relying on each other.

Here's how the government took care of Katrina victims

Here's how government took care of welfare recipients - who believed housing was a right.

And here's how the govenment takes care of it's war heros

 

[Haul me to Heaven]

Medicare will be bankrupt, unless healthy people can be forced to buy higher prived health insurance, or the government has the power to limit care.

That's what this is all about.

It's not about the 17 - 40 million who are uninsured, because most of them won't be covered... there's nothing "universal" about this healthcare bill.

Here's a good example of what happens when you rely on government to help you, rather than helping yourself, and relying on each other.

Here's how the government took care of Katrina victims
/QUOTE]

Actually- I was in Florida then and it really was the fault of Louisiana public servant then as well as years before.
What the media has not really said was that in the late 60's LA was given all the monet they needed to fix the leivies. None were fixed.
Welcome to Bobby Jindal was overwhelmingly elected.
Back door- good ol'e boy corruption.
So... the State of Loisiana didn't do sqwat so the media - hateing Bush- placed the Blame on Bush; like it was HIS fault!

What about the responsibility of the States FIRST.

You are not wrong for stating what you know to be true. Just go one step deeper and see how the media controls the sentiments of people. They place blame where they want it and not where it's needed.
j

 

[medicineman]

Just the threat of a public option had the insurance moguls pulling their hair out. Without a government health care plan, the insurance industry will continue to rape the American public to the tune of 300+ Billion a year, Denying coverage at their leisure, denying procedures at their leisure, and upping premiums and co-pays as they please. We must take the profit out of health care, set rules and conditions, and make health care about health.

 

[doc111]

Medicare will be bankrupt, unless healthy people can be forced to buy higher prived health insurance, or the government has the power to limit care.

That's what this is all about.

It's not about the 17 - 40 million who are uninsured, because most of them won't be covered... there's nothing "universal" about this healthcare bill.

Here's a good example of what happens when you rely on government to help you, rather than helping yourself, and relying on each other.

Here's how the government took care of Katrina victims

Here's how government took care of welfare recipients - who believed housing was a right.

And here's how the govenment takes care of it's war heros

That's an excellent example Green Cross. I agree that the state of LA should've done more and seemed completely inept. I also understand that a lot of unfair blame was placed on Busch and FEMA, but it shows how people expect so much of the federal government and they simply are not and cannot be the answer to healthcare.

 

[Haul me to Heaven]

"Ask not what your country can do for you but what you can do for your country" JFK.... and then they shot him.
(They meaning the Banksters)
Screw their worthless (and less) currency.

Remember JFK
j

 

[doc111]

I'm not real sure what JFK has to do with healthcare reform but I think I see your point. I think government wants to control every aspect of our lives. Some people seem to like this idea as well. Before long maybe we can get them to wipe our asses for us after we take a shit too. Larger government is not going to fix healthcare! I almost want government to take it over so people will see how bad it will be. It won't take long for people to yearn for the old system that was jacked up, but still better than government control, back.

 

[Iron Lion Zion]

I don't understand why this is whole fiasco is titled "Health Care Reform." They aren't reforming health care, they are reforming health insurance... big difference in my mind.
Also, there is not a problem with the health care industry, there is a problem with the judicial system - specifically Malpractice Law. You fix that problem you fix health care.
Our country practices defensive medicine - The doctors will run every test fathomable for the disorder/disease, along with some others that are not necessary, but rather are used to cover themselves in the courtroom. Basically instead of performing say 5 diagnostic tests, they are performing 15 (just putting numbers out there, the following is more important...). They are forced to do this because of how easy it is for people to sue them if they "didn't do everything possible" or whatever other excuse a family might find. Why would doctors risk getting sued for millions of dollar when they can easily cover their asses with every test imaginable and have insurance cover all the costs/tests?
Now lets see, what does this do to health care costs? They go ski-high.
You fix medical malpractice, you fix health care.

 

[Haul me to Heaven]

I don't understand why this is whole fiasco is titled "Health Care Reform." They are reforming health care, they are reforming health insurance... big difference in my mind.
Also, there is not a problem with the health care industry, there is a problem with the judicial system - specifically Malpractice Law. You fix that problem you fix health care.
Our country practices defensive medicine - The doctors will run every fathomable for the disorder/disease, along with some others that are not necessary, but are rather used to cover themselves in the courtroom. Basically instead of performing say 5 diagnostic tests, they are performing 15 (just putting numbers out there, the following is more important...). They are forced to do this because of how easily it is for people to sue them if they "didn't do everything possible" or whatever other excuse a family might find. Why would doctors risk getting sued for millions of dollar when they could easily cover their asses with every test imaginable and have insurance cover all the tests?
Now lets see, what does this do to health care costs? They go ski-high.
You fix medical malpractice, you fix health care.

That's about it.

 

[doc111]

I don't understand why this is whole fiasco is titled "Health Care Reform." They are reforming health care, they are reforming health insurance... big difference in my mind.
Also, there is not a problem with the health care industry, there is a problem with the judicial system - specifically Malpractice Law. You fix that problem you fix health care.
Our country practices defensive medicine - The doctors will run every fathomable for the disorder/disease, along with some others that are not necessary, but are rather used to cover themselves in the courtroom. Basically instead of performing say 5 diagnostic tests, they are performing 15 (just putting numbers out there, the following is more important...). They are forced to do this because of how easily it is for people to sue them if they "didn't do everything possible" or whatever other excuse a family might find. Why would doctors risk getting sued for millions of dollar when they could easily cover their asses with every test imaginable and have insurance cover all the tests?
Now lets see, what does this do to health care costs? They go ski-high.
You fix medical malpractice, you fix health care.

Agreed. Tort reform is vital to fixing the "healthcare problem". Why is this not being talked about? Maybe the lawyers would lose a little piece of the pie.

 

[Iron Lion Zion]

Agreed. Tort reform is vital to fixing the "healthcare problem". Why is this not being talked about? Maybe the lawyers would lose a little piece of the pie.

It's not being talked about because then they have to deal with Trial Lawyers and nobody wants do that...

 

[doc111]

It's not being talked about because then they have to deal with Trial Lawyers and nobody wants do that...

A lot of politicians started out as lawyers.....hmmmm? Wouldn't want to kill the golden goose would they?

 

[ink the world]

So true, so true. Why then are so many people convinced that the government is gonna come to the rescue and everything with healthcare will be fixed? I just don't understand it.

I dont look at it that way at all.

I think we ALL can agree on one thing: Private insurance sucks. Period.

Isnt the Govt. option more about providing a way for people to attain health insurance at a reasonable cost?

Ive had Aetna, Cigna, and Blue Cross.. They all SUCKED!!!

Through Blue Cross I got denied EVERY time I used the insurance including:
1. Kidney Stones (preexisting condition), eventually got dropped because of those kidney stones.

2. I broke 3 ribs in a football game and had a real hard time breathing...worse than when i broke my ribs before. I started coughing up blood at 2 AM and went to the ER because I was afraid of a collapsed lung.
DENIED: the possibility of a collapsed lung is NOT an emergency. MY PCP didnt return my 5 phone calls, evidently I was supposed to wait until he called or I stopped breathing altogether.

3. Infants being denied coverage because they fall under the 10% or over the 90% level for either height oe weight.

Did you know that you can be denied for :
Being pregnant
Having a pregnant wife
Being too tall
Being too short
Being a victim of spousal abuse




Yeah the current system is real goodkiss-ass

 

[Haul me to Heaven]

Let government get their hands on it and it will cost way more than you think.
The public servants just need to make tort reform happen.
But the Bar ASSociation has been and will always be lobbying against it!
There is your problem with Insurence.

Look at all the things we, as a people have said no to. And the end result?
Look at what we wanted (marijuana to be reclassified) and the same thing.
They have their system rigged.
So don't think 'Government will do you any favors.
No.
You are here to make them and their buddies RICH.
You can stay poor
And uneducated is their hope and mission.
Cheers
Welcome to Amerika !

 

[medicineman]

Medicare for all with oversight. That's the ticket. If you don't like it, don't use it, simple is as simple does.

 

[doc111]

I dont look at it that way at all.

I think we ALL can agree on one thing: Private insurance sucks. Period.

Isnt the Govt. option more about providing a way for people to attain health insurance at a reasonable cost?

Ive had Aetna, Cigna, and Blue Cross.. They all SUCKED!!!

Through Blue Cross I got denied EVERY time I used the insurance including:
1. Kidney Stones (preexisting condition), eventually got dropped because of those kidney stones.

2. I broke 3 ribs in a football game and had a real hard time breathing...worse than when i broke my ribs before. I started coughing up blood at 2 AM and went to the ER because I was afraid of a collapsed lung.
DENIED: the possibility of a collapsed lung is NOT an emergency. MY PCP didnt return my 5 phone calls, evidently I was supposed to wait until he called or I stopped breathing altogether.

3. Infants being denied coverage because they fall under the 10% or over the 90% level for either height oe weight.

Did you know that you can be denied for :
Being pregnant
Having a pregnant wife
Being too tall
Being too short
Being a victim of spousal abuse




Yeah the current system is real goodkiss-ass

I agree we have a huge problem with things the way they are. I just think that we should be trying more prudent steps like doing some regulating of the insurance industry. People seem to think that healthcare will be free when the government takes it over. Doctors and nurses aren't going to work for free. Someone will have to pay the light bill at the hospitals. Who pays for the bandages, who pays for the medications? Government takeover of healthcare creates a whole host of other issues that most people aren't realizing. They can't even run an organization that delivers envelopes and boxes efficiently. Why do people think they will do a better job with something as complex as healthcare? I understand that people want answers and the only answers being offered have to do with government running the show. We have to look at the negative consequences this will have as well as the positive.

 

[doc111]

Medicare for all with oversight. That's the ticket. If you don't like it, don't use it, simple is as simple does.

If only it were that simple my friend.

 

[andyk187]

The government providing ANY type of service is like playing monopoly against the banker, how hard is this to understand to these crazy politicians?? you have control over our tax dollars and you want to compete against private companies who can't just print more money or raise taxes when their insurance company isn't making a profit! Tort reform is a must!! and allowing insurance companies to compete across state lines would drastically drop prices, there's only 5 or 6 health insurance companies in my state, WHY can't they compete with other states?? the GOV talks about increasing competition by providing a gov. option but they wont let private insurers compete across state lines?

 

[doc111]

The government providing ANY type of service is like playing monopoly against the banker, how hard is this to understand to these crazy politicians?? you have control over our tax dollars and you want to compete against private companies who can't just print more money or raise taxes when their insurance company isn't making a profit! Tort reform is a must!! and allowing insurance companies to compete across state lines would drastically drop prices, there's only 5 or 6 health insurance companies in my state, WHY can't they compete with other states?? the GOV talks about increasing competition by providing a gov. option but they wont let private insurers compete across state lines?

This is a great point. People are complaining how we are losing our liberties while they are busy handing them over by the truckload. Government control of healthcare is a recipe for disaster. I think it's going to happen. When the federal government controls healthcare you can kiss medicinial marijuana goodbye.