First Time! pls help

G

GrowBeyond

Member
Hi everyone! First time using this site, and first time growing. I have so many questions! To start off with, what should I buy? I have a 13*10 room with an eight foot ceiling that I'd like to deck out. It has two windows and a large closet. I also have a lot of 18 gallon bins from walmart, a bestVA 1000w led from amazon,and the fox farms nutrient trio. I'm looking for maximum yield in the shortest amount of time, on a budget of $1000 max. It gets hot here in the summer (third floor) and cold in the winter, which lasts a good long while. I don't pay for heat, but I do for AC. I've tried growing a couple plants recently, but have found that an unventilated closet during a heat wave is far from ideal. I have 3 plants (High Density Auto by Heavyweight) that are super tiny growing in 18 gallon bins (2 in 1) with a layer of perlite at the bottom, then 50/50 peat moss and perlite, then a layer of peat moss on top.

So basically, what do I need to do to take my disaster of a closet grow and switch it to a full sized grow room?
 
hotrodharley

hotrodharley

Well-Known Member
GrowBeyond said:
Hi everyone! First time using this site, and first time growing. I have so many questions! To start off with, what should I buy? I have a 13*10 room with an eight foot ceiling that I'd like to deck out. It has two windows and a large closet. I also have a lot of 18 gallon bins from walmart, a bestVA 1000w led from amazon,and the fox farms nutrient trio. I'm looking for maximum yield in the shortest amount of time, on a budget of $1000 max. It gets hot here in the summer (third floor) and cold in the winter, which lasts a good long while. I don't pay for heat, but I do for AC. I've tried growing a couple plants recently, but have found that an unventilated closet during a heat wave is far from ideal. I have 3 plants (High Density Auto by Heavyweight) that are super tiny growing in 18 gallon bins (2 in 1) with a layer of perlite at the bottom, then 50/50 peat moss and perlite, then a layer of peat moss on top.

So basically, what do I need to do to take my disaster of a closet grow and switch it to a full sized grow room?
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Your first consideration has to be power. What kind of load can the circuit take. Check your breaker box.

Next is providing air intake , exhaust and air movement inside the room. Exhaust really must go outside. If odor is an issue plan on carbon filters.

Lights in that area I would go with 315CMH with 4 in your case because of production , cost going in and power consumption.
 
G

GrowBeyond

Member
I'll grab a picture of what's in the electrical box, but I have no clue how to read it.
What kind of lights are those?? I've never heard of them. I'm looking at craigslist for air conditioners, so with 1134 sq feet in my room, and 4 HID lights, I guess I'd need 6000 CFM? I'm finding those for around $50, 14,000 CFM for about $250. There's also a 10k portable one, but it's missing a hose, whatever that means. Those are probably pretty big overkill. Normally I'd say heat isn't much of an issue in the summer, but hey, climate change. I also realized that I don't know I'm going to ventilate the room during the winter. I was interested in using yeast to supplement C02 but apparently that barely does anything.
Apparently just putting a box fan in each window should be plenty to cover air flow, but not enough to remove excess heat from weather or lights. But they're not as wide as the window, so I'd have light leakage both ways. Could cover that in cardboard. Plus I'd be worried about running those when it's cold. So I guess the answer is lots of lights to produce enough heat to warm the cold air coming from the fans, or a c02 generator and dehumidifier? I read something about lung rooms, no idea what they are.
I just saw stinkbud's tutorial on aeroponic systems, and that looks great but I'm worried I'd kill my plants. I figure I'll also need a PVC frame to hold each of the lights. Am I off base with the "soil" mediums I'm using? I found that pure peat moss takes at least a week to dry out.
If ran a room full of autos, (which appeal to me because I want to stop paying for herb ASAP) could I just provide 20 hours of light to the entire room and create shade for the younger plants? OTOH, if I can grow the same amount with fewer plants, that's definitely better. And I have a fondness for jack herer, (sannie's seeds) but I'm scared I'll kill them all all

I'm now planning on using air pots (7 gallon) with promix. I plan to start them in my germination tray, then move to dixie cups, then milk jugs, then 7 gallon air pots. The autos I would start in the air pots. I'd soak for 24 hours, then plant directly in the soil, tip up, with a pinch of soil on top to cover it.

I'm trying to follow the nutrient schedule for soil with the fox farms liquid nutrient trio. Is that all I need? I started getting what looked like a calmag deficiency early on. That could also be because I was using distilled water, which I basically have to have shipped to me. Is tap alright?

Are any of my plans less than ideal? Please correct the heck out of me
 
G

GrowBeyond

Member
hotrodharley said:
Your first consideration has to be power. What kind of load can the circuit take. Check your breaker box.

Next is providing air intake , exhaust and air movement inside the room. Exhaust really must go outside. If odor is an issue plan on carbon filters.

Lights in that area I would go with 315CMH with 4 in your case because of production , cost going in and power consumption.
Click to expand...

Okay so I looked into CMHs and they're super cool! Would the $150 vivospectra ones on amazon work?

My breaker box seems to say 150A in a couple of places, but that sounds absurdly high. I forgot to mention that I also have a 4ft t8 with 3/4 bulbs running as well.
 

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hotrodharley

hotrodharley

Well-Known Member
T8 is virtually useless except for starting seedlings and young plants. The lights will work fine.

Each switch in the breaker box should have a number. If there's only one or two you probably have GFCI outlets. Use surge suppresors on each outlet. Real surge suppressors not just multiplug strips with a cheap breaker.

Those 315CMH produce. Might take a wee bit longer to finish flower but you'll have a lot more. Until LED improves and becomes more affordable CMH and HPS rock.
 
G

GrowBeyond

Member
hotrodharley said:
T8 is virtually useless except for starting seedlings and young plants. The lights will work fine.

Each switch in the breaker box should have a number. If there's only one or two you probably have GFCI outlets. Use surge suppresors on each outlet. Real surge suppressors not just multiplug strips with a cheap breaker.

Those 315CMH produce. Might take a wee bit longer to finish flower but you'll have a lot more. Until LED improves and becomes more affordable CMH and HPS rock.
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I'm HYPE!
I kept getting signs of burning even at 24 inches from my LED, with the t8 close and vertical. But that could be because of a myriad of things, like overfertilizing even based on the soil schedule when I'm technically doing hydro if I'm using peat. What are the rules for avoiding light burn but still maximizing par? I'm assuming I'd start seeds with the t8, veg under the LED, then flower under the CMH.

I have 12 switches in my box which says 150A on it. One of those controls the outlets in the bedroom, where I want to grow. My LED uses 185 watts, I'm not sure how much the t8 uses. I'm including a picture of the individual switch (full box pics up above). I don't really know where to go from here, but I heard most circuits are 15A, which wouldn't be enough for the 1260 watts used by 4 CMHs if I read that right.

So suppressors not protectors? Any recommendations on those? I'm assuming the hydrofarm $20 surge suppressor with a timer and 8 outlets wouldn't cut it.

Thanks so much for the help!
 
hotrodharley

hotrodharley

Well-Known Member
Your light plan sounds good. In fact my entire light system has 3 years on it. Metal halide and high pressure sodium. Good results with predictable decrease in production noted this time. I was flashing back 5 years ago to when I vegged under a T5 HO. Excellent growth. Good roots. Dense foliage and you could keep them short. A month under it. Then a month with MH using the prevailing wisdom at the time.

I'm going to build a T5 to start seeds and seedlings and clones. I'm going to buy a couple of Meizhi LEDs to veg under and 2 315CMH for my flower tent. Powerwise it makes sense.

We're on the same page here.
 
hotrodharley

hotrodharley

Well-Known Member
The Hydrofarm unit is probably fine. They're a huge corporation. They own Fox Farms and more. They usually provide serviceable equipment .
 
G

GrowBeyond

Member
Awesome! I'd love to build lights someday, but I'm already trying to dive headfirst as it is haha. Thanks so much for the help. Here's my current revised plan.

4x8 PVC Grow tent. I probably won't cover it in panda film for a while, but the frame will hold the light. It's going to be right next to a window with an air conditioner in it. If that's not enough, I'll get an inline fan to pump the air from the tent out the window. I'm going to have those two CMH lights. In there I'll grow 10-20 plants in 7 gallon air pots with cheap all purpose pro mix and 20% perlite. I'll soak that mixture in blackstrap molasses to help the rooty bois and lower the ph. If it's not down to 6 by that point, I'll add 1 cup dolomite per 2 cubic ft of soil. Should I use sulfur instead? I'll use blue planet calmag, fox farms liquid trio using the hydro schedule, and root magic. Then it comes down to strain choice. I want something that grows quickly, is hard to kill, and yields a lot. I have 5 High Density seeds from Heavyweight left. The other slots were going to go to sannie's jack, but I'd like to find something less adventurous and easier to work with.

So in closing. Should I use dolomite or sulfur to lower ph when prepping soil?
What are the best genetics for durable, fast growing, high yielding strains?
Do I need one surge protector per light?
How can I calculate my power usage, in case I decide to get something more power intensive like an HPS?
I already have a bag of vermiculite, but making sure my pots actually dry out is my top priority, thus the premade mix. However, the ingredients themselves are cheaper. Should I go with my promix/perlite plan or switch it up?
What if I got a 630 CMH instead of 2 315s? They seem to be a bit cheaper, and just have two bulbs,
Should I get 4200 bulbs instead of 3100?
 
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Rollinituptoo

Rollinituptoo

Well-Known Member
Jesus christ. Relax grow a couple plants. Dont fill a ducking haha ducking room. Buy yourself a gòod tent first. Learn how to mix a soil properly and for god sake plant those babies in separate appropriately sized pots.
 
Rollinituptoo

Rollinituptoo

Well-Known Member
Also i happen to be a contractor. Your electrical breakers are rated to 15 to 20 amps. 20 usually reserved for stove and dryer and are bigger breakers. The rest control switches and plugs. Find your grow room breaker and kill it. Now walk around and see what doesn't work. This will tell you which plugs are on the same line. How many lights run off it? This can help you calculate a base load on the line. Using a wattage calculator.
 
G

GrowBeyond

Member
Thanks guys! Would there be anything wrong with running more devices off the breaker in my living room? I've been able to ID what goes to what pretty easily. I ask because I did a bunch of load calculating (lol) and my veg equipment plus the four CMH lights and a single box/inline fan leave it 9 watts under the max of 1650 watts on a 15a circuit (assuming only the lit bulbs in my t8 draw power). Is that okay? I'd also like to be able to tweak things a little bit to get a single 600W HPS. Would that be silly? I've heard the extra red is good, but for double the wattage idk.


I'm definitely scaling back (thanks, I can get a bit ahead of myself). That being said, I do want to have a final plan in mind so I don't buy more crap I don't need. I'm thinking a 10kbtu AC, 2 standing fans, 2 box fans. I can't find *any* cheap soil online, so I think I'm gonna grow in Happy Frog/Ocean Forest with 40% added perlite, from a local store. If any of that stupid, please slap me
 
Rollinituptoo

Rollinituptoo

Well-Known Member
Well i dont know how handy you are but provided theres room in the breaker panel you could always go down to the hardware storre buy a breaker or two run line and install the breakers. Its actually fairly easy assuming you have some knowledge on the subject. IF NOT I RECOMMEND YOU DONT DO THIS SHIT. You will be running close to the max load which could trip the breaker being disastrous for ventilation /lights during a grow. Running electrical cords work but they are more prone to failure and overheating and are documented to have issues with grows. I still use one personally. Most stuff you buy fans led light ect dont draw as mucch power as they say most of the time but the can peak to more load than a line can handle. Be safe happy grow. AGAIN DONT MESS WIH YOUR BREAKER BOX IF YOU DONT KNOW WHAT YOU DOING
 
G

GrowBeyond

Member
Haha okay, so in 10 years when I'm building my house, I'll work on the breakers. How close to the max load can I get without tripping the breaker? Ooh, what kind of documentation against those? That's good to know, I *really* wanna avoid a fire.
 
Rollinituptoo

Rollinituptoo

Well-Known Member
Usually people rigging up stupid shit like 10 things on one cord. I also wouldnt put anything light related on one if i was running a heavier rated hid/mh blub or some shit. Different cords have differnt rating and can handle more load. Like i said i use them and so do the majority of growers but there have been issues. As for the line you can pretty well run it at the max. Its made for it but this gives you no room for peaks. Like if you had your lights on then kicked on the ac. The load from the ac and the lights may be under the max but could peak above when something is drawing load all of a sudden. More commonly people usuàlly have experienced this when they plug a vacuum into an already loaded line and trip the breaker
 
G

GrowBeyond

Member
Huh, that's interesting. It's almost like floodgates opening, and having extra pressure in that initial moment. I appreciate the explanations.
 
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