Help, bottom sets of leaves turning yellow.

[MichiganMedGrower]

Oh, organic section, didn't notice. Okay, he's screwed then.

I hate to lol here as a grower is having trouble but damn that made me LOL.

 

[BobCajun]

I hate to lol here as a grower is having trouble but damn that made me LOL.

I also just edited it and said he could cheat. The organic police won't get him.

 

[MichiganMedGrower]

re-read my post man, never did I say those were needed, I said that's how hydro growers typically grow, you being in an organic soil mix using chemical nutrients is a hybrid of the two.
not sure how you understood that as being applicable to a soil grow, I was making a point n the differences between them.
and my comment towards him adding things to correct an unknown issue is a classic hydro grower move, and granted organic soil growers tend to do that too, but it's extremely common for a hydroponic grower to do that.
in fact that was his advice, to which I made the point that doing that can fuck shit up worst.
I didn't say ALL anything at all.
and you don't add cal mag because you are in a peat based mix that's already fortified with micros.
it's 100% apples to oranges.
not to mention it's not pertinent to the OP's problem
you don't grow like the OP, nor the guy I was quoting, sooo... yea..
think you got it a lil misunderstood man.

You kind of re made my point with you re blanket stating differences between organic and other methods.

There are none. There are growers that get it and those who don't. I would add a little organic fertilizer to the pots to fix the problem in this thread.

Unless I found it to be environmental or drainage or.........

What label would you put on me now? I only use what I use for convenience and local availability. I don't think full organics is a good idea inside my spare bedroom in the main part of my house either. I like my worms and poop to stay outside for the most part.

And my results are the same as promix and a 3 part nute system. It did have seaweed added to it. But the plants don't care where they get their nutrients. Being able to water only though veg helps me with my perpetual Grow with plants at all different stages.

Just as much myth and mis-conception here in organics as every other section.

 

[MichiganMedGrower]

I also just edited it and said he could cheat. The organic police won't get him.

I had to rant a bit myself.

 

[DonTesla]

@Sidvicious1

Whats the soil recipe, man?

 

[greasemonkeymann]

You kind of re made my point with you re blanket stating differences between organic and other methods.

There are none. There are growers that get it and those who don't. I would add a little organic fertilizer to the pots to fix the problem in this thread.

Unless I found it to be environmental or drainage or.........

What label would you put on me now? I only use what I use for convenience and local availability. I don't think full organics is a good idea inside my spare bedroom in the main part of my house either. I like my worms and poop to stay outside for the most part.

And my results are the same as promix and a 3 part nute system. It did have seaweed added to it. But the plants don't care where they get their nutrients. Being able to water only though veg helps me with my perpetual Grow with plants at all different stages.

Just as much myth and mis-conception here in organics as every other section.

damn dude, you're killin me here
seems to be a misunderstanding again.
please read what I said and don't infer anything to it, take what I said as exactly what the words mean.
face value.


seems to be a "black and white" type thing with you.
I didn't say a blanket statement, at all.
when did I say "all"
the word typically was used, was it not?
that isn't a blanket used adverb at all.

when did I "label" you as anything?
I said you grow with a hybrid of the two, is that not true??

what I said was that is a difference between the typical hydro grower and the organic grower.
and we've all heard the argument. plants don't care where or how they get their nutrients.
well...
so why does essentially every smoker prefer organic?
if in fact that's true, then why do you bother with soil at all, why use the kelp?
I guran-fuckin-tee I have ZERO myths goin on in relation to organics my man
zero.

you said (as a blanket statement, no less) that organics and "other methods" have no differences.
that would be categorically incorrect, wouldn't you agree?

if, for any reason at all, you believe I "don't get it" feel free to enlighten me on my ignorance.
anything at all. i'll be back here on Monday.

you're a regular around here, you should know that, 100% of what I say is factual, unless prefaced by me saying it's otherwise. i'm extremely astute when it comes to that
maybe even a bit neurotic.

I said grow with whatever-the-fuck-you-want.
he was asking specific organic information regarding his problem.
how is this hard for you two to understand.
never do I give a shit if people grow with chemicals, its your plants, I couldn't care any less about that at all.

 

[Johnei]

If he feeds the N need and doesn't get his overwatering /or not well draining soil under control, feeding won't do shit, so feeding is secondary imo. Nothing can be uptaked when roots are rotting.

 

[greasemonkeymann]

Oh, organic section, didn't notice. Okay, he's screwed then. Wait I have an idea, cheat.

I think that's what you guys are misinterpreting from me, there is no right or wrong, it's a matter of preference, are you going to try and tell me that I don't like tiny petite blonde girls too?
or tell me I don't like sushi or carne asada?
its a matter of preference, and there are no rules to it.
anyone that's been around here for a bit knows that I don't bust balls if you don't grow like me, why would I give a shit at all?
grow ANY way you like, but advising someone to feed chemical nutrients with the instructions of "put enough through it" without ascertaining the actual problem is seriously flawed advice man.
you follow me?

and that's totally disregarding whatever "section" it's in.

 

[greasemonkeymann]

If he feeds the N need and doesn't get his overwatering /or not well draining soil under control, feeding won't do shit, so feeding is secondary imo. Nothing can be uptaked when roots are rotting.

precisely.
that's one of my primary points.
80% of the plant problems I see aren't related to a lack of nutrients at all.
maybe even more than 80%

 

[MichiganMedGrower]

damn dude, you're killin me here
seems to be a misunderstanding again.
please read what I said and don't infer anything to it, take what I said as exactly what the words mean.
face value.


seems to be a "black and white" type thing with you.
I didn't say a blanket statement, at all.
when did I say "all"
the word typically was used, was it not?
that isn't a blanket used adverb at all.

when did I "label" you as anything?
I said you grow with a hybrid of the two, is that not true??

what I said was that is a difference between the typical hydro grower and the organic grower.
and we've all heard the argument. plants don't care where or how they get their nutrients.
well...
so why does essentially every smoker prefer organic?
if in fact that's true, then why do you bother with soil at all, why use the kelp?
I guran-fuckin-tee I have ZERO myths goin on in relation to organics my man
zero.

you're a regular around here, you should know that, 100% of what I say is factual, unless prefaced by me saying it's otherwise. i'm extremely astute when it comes to that
maybe even a bit neurotic.

I said grow with whatever-the-fuck-you-want.
he was asking specific organic information regarding his problem.
how is this hard for you two to understand.
never do I give a shit if people grow with chemicals, its your plants, I couldn't care any less about that at all.

"Essentially every smoker prefer organic" you said. That is a blanket statement.

I have read many times a breeder recommending hydro to bring out the best qualities of a strain. Look at the Big Book Of Buds. Many famous breeders and strains with different comments about growing them.

And I still have not seen a blind test that proves this either.

It's a myth from the forums.

In my patient testing they could not pick natural over pro mix and chemicals.

And I like the seaweed for the base of micronutrients it offers that are already available to the plants. Seaweed extract to be specific.

I feel that the available diverse array of trace elements helps with flavor and cannabanoids production. Or at least helps them grow healthier to do it.

I like to have multiple forms of NPK available too.

 

[Sidvicious1]

No not screwed at all actually. Thanks for the info guys. I def don't need any hydro nutes. Ur info on this topic is useless bobcajun. If u want to give bad advice do it on another forum. The organic nutes were put in there when I cooked it, tested it and seems fine. i just had the light a little to close ,they just seemed to be drying out to fast in the smaller pots also over watering to try n keep them from drying out. A beginner error . Thanks for the advice greasemonkey, tesla, ur infos always solid. I transplanted into 1gal pots with my cooked mix and there doing alot better. Mix seems to be fine, I don't know what was up with the phosphorous test that came with the ph kit.. just crappy product I guess. I'll put son some pics up later.

 

[Sidvicious1]

Living organic mix

Base
1.5 cf. Organic potting mix
1.5cf ewc, cow chicken rabbit manure.
1cf perlite
1cf peat moss
3 shovel scoops of topsoil and leaf compost.

Amendments
1cup fish bone meal
1cup blood meal
1cup alfalfa meal
1cup kelp meal
1cup organic plant tone fert 3-4-4.
2cup hydrated lime (tho I know now I should have used dolomite)
1cup (pellet size) crushed oyster shells and half cup ground oyster shells.
1cup organic rice.
2cup greensand.

@Sidvicious1

Whats the soil recipe, man?

 

[Sidvicious1]

Living organic mix

Base
1.5 cf. Organic potting mix
1.5cf ewc, cow chicken rabbit manure.
1cf perlite
1cf peat moss
3 shovel scoops of topsoil and leaf compost.

Amendments
1cup fish bone meal
1cup blood meal
1cup alfalfa meal
1cup kelp meal
1cup organic plant tone fert 3-4-4.
2cup hydrated lime (tho I know now I should have used dolomite)
1cup (pellet size) crushed oyster shells and half cup ground oyster shells.
1cup organic rice.
2cup greensand.

Also 1.5 cup neem seed meal

 

[greasemonkeymann]

"Essentially every smoker prefer organic" you said. That is a blanket statement.

I have read many times a breeder recommending hydro to bring out the best qualities of a strain. Look at the Big Book Of Buds. Many famous breeders and strains with different comments about growing them.

And I still have not seen a blind test that proves this either.

It's a myth from the forums.

In my patient testing they could not pick natural over pro mix and chemicals.

And I like the seaweed for the base of micronutrients it offers that are already available to the plants. Seaweed extract to be specific.

I feel that the available diverse array of trace elements helps with flavor and cannabanoids production. Or at least helps them grow healthier to do it.

I like to have multiple forms of NPK available too.

hope you had a good weekend man.
so that "myth from the forums"
the whole "organics tastes better" thing
it um, was LONG before the world even knew the wonderful oddity that is the internet man
and it was ALL from a simple "hey why does this one taste better, whats in it?" type of thing.

not to mention in my experience (right at 29yrs this yr) a fully organic grow will even visually look different than a hydroponic grow as well, I've had multiple friends accuse me of switching the strain that we grew together because mine was so much different.
santa cruz bluedream, jack herer, J1, and the sensi star in specific

in fact the sane exact phenotype will turn out differently merely by changing up the technique and nutrients involved in organics.
taste, appearance, density etc, all those are influenced a pretty good amount by simply the techniques and nutrients utilized.
seen it personally multiple times Neem meal, insect meal, fish meal, batguano and steer manure tend to make the most noticeable differences

that "blanket" statement had nothing to do with your argument about hydroponics, sooo i'm not sure the relevancy here... considering that's what you initially quoted me as saying.
in regards to the checking tds, ph, and the like.
sooo...

and I have yet to meet a smoker that prefers chemical grown herb, and if you are doing a blind taste test, and nobody can tell the differences all I can say is that there must be skill discrepancy involved on the organic side...
and on that base of micronutrients..
so your chem salt mix lacks in chelated micros?
No?
hmm...
cuz those chelated nutrients you use have all the micros ya need man, unless of course there is in fact a difference between organics and chem salt nutrients after all...

can't say it's common to use one's own statement as an argument against there own view.

I mean I cannot fathom or even begin to imagine that it could maybe the umm, i don't know the natural plant growth stimulators and over 70 minerals and trace elements, growth hormones, vitamins, enzymes, and proteins in that organic nutrient that you are giving it, but according to you there isn't a difference between them so I just wonder why you'd go through the effort and spend the money...
hmmmm

(sorry man, that's a lil bit of a tongue-in-cheek ball-bustin)
that all being said I do give you credit for picking a good non-organic nutrient lineup, if I had to choose a bottle-fed non organic grow i'd probably go with that one too.

 

[MichiganMedGrower]

hope you had a good weekend man.
so that "myth from the forums"
the whole "organics tastes better" thing
it um, was LONG before the world even knew the wonderful oddity that is the internet man
and it was ALL from a simple "hey why does this one taste better, whats in it?" type of thing.

not to mention in my experience (right at 29yrs this yr) a fully organic grow will even visually look different than a hydroponic grow as well, I've had multiple friends accuse me of switching the strain that we grew together because mine was so much different.
santa cruz bluedream, jack herer, J1, and the sensi star in specific

in fact the sane exact phenotype will turn out differently merely by changing up the technique and nutrients involved in organics.
taste, appearance, density etc, all those are influenced a pretty good amount by simply the techniques and nutrients utilized.
seen it personally multiple times Neem meal, insect meal, fish meal, batguano and steer manure tend to make the most noticeable differences

that "blanket" statement had nothing to do with your argument about hydroponics, sooo i'm not sure the relevancy here... considering that's what you initially quoted me as saying.
in regards to the checking tds, ph, and the like.
sooo...

and I have yet to meet a smoker that prefers chemical grown herb, and if you are doing a blind taste test, and nobody can tell the differences all I can say is that there must be skill discrepancy involved on the organic side...
and on that base of micronutrients..
so your chem salt mix lacks in chelated micros?
No?
hmm...
cuz those chelated nutrients you use have all the micros ya need man, unless of course there is in fact a difference between organics and chem salt nutrients after all...

can't say it's common to use one's own statement as an argument against there own view.

I mean I cannot fathom or even begin to imagine that it could maybe the umm, i don't know the natural plant growth stimulators and over 70 minerals and trace elements, growth hormones, vitamins, enzymes, and proteins in that organic nutrient that you are giving it, but according to you there isn't a difference between them so I just wonder why you'd go through the effort and spend the money...
hmmmm

(sorry man, that's a lil bit of a tongue-in-cheek ball-bustin)

Had a good weekend thanks. Hope you did too.

Plants grow differently even if fed the same nutrients in different amounts. I think the drastic appearance differences are caused by speed of growth and available different forms of nutrients.

I have seen this while dialing in clones.

I also have noticed that this difference in growth and appearance is more noticeable with full spectrum lighting than just nutrient changes.

And I have been smoking and around growers indoor and out since 1984 or so.

I have only grown personally for 4. But I have been in the "industry" the whole time. I have smoked pot grown many different ways and from all over the world.

 

[MichiganMedGrower]

Oh and @greasemonkeymann i like the banter and "ball busting". Maybe we will learn something from it we can use.

 

[Buba Blend]

"Essentially every smoker prefer organic" you said. That is a blanket statement.

I have read many times a breeder recommending hydro to bring out the best qualities of a strain. Look at the Big Book Of Buds. Many famous breeders and strains with different comments about growing them.

And I still have not seen a blind test that proves this either.

It's a myth from the forums.

In my patient testing they could not pick natural over pro mix and chemicals.

And I like the seaweed for the base of micronutrients it offers that are already available to the plants. Seaweed extract to be specific.

I feel that the available diverse array of trace elements helps with flavor and cannabanoids production. Or at least helps them grow healthier to do it.

I like to have multiple forms of NPK available too.

This line: In my patient testing they could not pick natural over pro mix and chemicals.

I believe you but am surprised. Curious about the strain. IDK strains but I'm wondering for the test. Was it a strain that you would say had intense flavors and expressions when grown organic? I would imagine there are strains that would have comparable results between hydro and organic but I can't imagine someone taking my strain and growing comparable weed with hydroponics even if they were given years to perfect it.

 

[MichiganMedGrower]

This line: In my patient testing they could not pick natural over pro mix and chemicals.

I believe you but am surprised. Curious about the strain. IDK strains but I'm wondering for the test. Was it a strain that you would say had intense flavors and expressions when grown organic? I would imagine there are strains that would have comparable results between hydro and organic but I can't imagine someone taking my strain and growing comparable weed with hydroponics even if they were given years to perfect it.

It was 3 different strains with 3 different terpene and cannabanoid profiles.

And my caregiver did it years before I met him with the same results.

If you can't get a hydro or hybrid Grow to taste as good you need to learn to fertilize better.

I have mentioned and still believe that the way a breeder grew the strain may give better results.

The strains I tested were a chitral cross (really lemony) a Blue Lemon Thai (sour pheno) and a chem backcross. (Dinachem)

 

[Buba Blend]

It was 3 different strains with 3 different terpene and cannabanoid profiles.

And my caregiver did it years before I met him with the same results.

If you can't get a hydro or hybrid Grow to taste as good you need to learn to fertilize better.

I have mentioned and still believe that the way a breeder grew the strain may give better results.

The strains I tested were a chitral cross (really lemony) a Blue Lemon Thai (sour pheno) and a chem backcross. (Dinachem)

I've just never been able to find hydroponic weed that I've smoked to ever be in the same league, just me, maybe if I had found the right grower. I was fortunate, in the 80's and 90's I knew a great guy that always had extremely excellent hydro weed. Never disappointed, still not comparable, even though it was great. Vegas dispensary weed need not even enter the conversation. I've been quite disappointed when I tried it, sampled about 40 1 gram purchases but that is irrelevant.

I guess for me if I ever thought I could grow better quality from hydro I'd be shopping tomorrow. As long as the best that can be said is if I grow hydro I can match the quality, I'll pass.

 

[MichiganMedGrower]

I've just never been able to find hydroponic weed that I've smoked to ever be in the same league, just me, maybe if I had found the right grower. I was fortunate, in the 80's and 90's I knew a great guy that always had extremely excellent hydro weed. Never disappointed, still not comparable, even though it was great. Vegas dispensary weed need not even enter the conversation. I've been quite disappointed when I tried it, sampled about 40 1 gram purchases but that is irrelevant.

I guess for me if I ever thought I could grow better quality from hydro I'd be shopping tomorrow. As long as the best that can be said is if I grow hydro I can match the quality, I'll pass.

I think most growers don't make the cut at the level you speak of.

But check this out. I was just posting in another thread. I know the growers and family that grew all the Skunk 6 in Colorado.

Skunk 6 is bred from the original outdoor "roadkill" Skunk everyone talks about and seeks.

it is just like you want it to be. True get you busted for a roach smoked yesterday smelly ass potent shit.

It is grown with powdered nutes in water culture.

And sadly root chemicals and pk booster. Old school as hell.