NEW LED TECH, what should I get??

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jpaq666

Member
My Scrog would be max 2'x3' in an unventillated tent so. I am looking for the most efficient LED for low heat production and highest possible yields and quality.

After endless hours of research... I found at the latest techs were basically:
-lighthouse hydro blackstar chrome style
-lighthouse hydro newer blackstar v2.0 style
-newest of all technologies, chips on board leds (cob leds)

For the latest tech I found www.cobgrowlights.com as probably the only well establisihed company hoping to produce these in the future. But this is so new that if I get that I'll litterally be in the first wave of testers, not a lot of data is there and the technology means it's hard to compare things like lumens PARs or watts per sq feet. Plus they don't have area of coverage info in the specs so this is really hard for me.

I am a strong beleiver in not investing in outdated tech, even if outdated by one year. So I am curious.

What do you think is the best light for me?
1. http://www.cobgrowlights.com/products/mr-2-mcob-grow-light
2. http://www.lighthousehydro.com/led-grow-lights/blackstar-240-watt-led-grow-light-uv-539.html
3. http://growlightcentral.com/collections/led-grow-lights/products/lighthouse-hydro-blackstar-chrome-270-watt-led-grow-light-fsf

Thanks for your help
 
A

az2000

Well-Known Member
jpaq666 said:
I am looking for the most efficient LED for low heat production and highest possible yields and quality.
Click to expand...
The LED grow-light market is full of flim-flam. You don't know what diodes most of them use. There's no objective way to compare those lights. Typically they sell through word of mouth. But, when you get into the watts per sq. ft used for a particularly good grow, you find that it's usually worse than T5HO (for short grows) and CMH (for tall). You need about 40w/sq ft and 35w/sq ft from those, respectively. Yet, it's common for users of epi-whatever lights (unknown diodes, no datasheets) to run at 50-55w/sq ft. I was looking at one grow last night which was presented as a testimonial of MarsHydro. It was 90w/sq ft.

I like Area-51. The brands @verticalgrow mentioned are reported to be reputable too. Anything that can withstand the scrutiny of the indoor>led forum is decent. Otherwise, T5HO or CMH are your best choices.

I like to use Cree lightbulbs for smaller grows and sidelighting. And, Cree PAR38 spots/floods. I had good results using those at only 21w/sq ft. (I'm in a hot climate so I'm sensitive to heat too.).
 
J

jpaq666

Member
http://www.cobgrowlights.com/products/spider-4x
That's probably my baby right there...
COB is probably going to replace MCOB though, that's my only concern. But on the phone they explained MCOB allows to replace HPS with 60% output while COB will aim at doing it at 50% output (it's not a major difference). If you read the material on their site and speak with them on the phone it starts becoming clear that the main benefit to COB vs MCOB is going to be the price. Allowing to build and sell the lights for less an the. MCOB ones. As for the grow tests, there is no reason to see MCOB as inferior, just a more costly technology and slightly less energy efficient.
 
A

az2000

Well-Known Member
jpaq666 said:
Not sure what the answer is but I'm sure it's somewhere in their faq on http://www.cobgrowlights.com/blogs/news (all diodes are specified).
Free shipping in canada, dam, nice
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TL;DR. All I saw was marketing rubbish. Can you summarize the specifics about the diodes they use?

It would be interesting to get the experts advice in the Indoor-LED thread. (Any reason you're not seeking it?).

EDIT: I started a thread in the LED forum to see if it has any rep. Without specifics about the quality of materials, I wouldn't drop money on that when there are lights available with reputation, and are open about the diodes they use, etc. (I'm not saying CobGrowLights doesn't. But, I haven't seen any specifics yet. I wouldn't spend that kind of money just because of "damn nice" free shipping.).
 
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J

jpaq666

Member
From the faq
  1. What is the brand of LED diodes?
The brand of LED is Epistar and EpiLEDs, both of them are from Taiwan manufacturer.

Epistar LED
ES-CADBV45P Venus-series blue 450 45mil 700mA
ES-CABLV45P Venus-series blue 460nm 45mil 700mA
ES-SMSOPX42 UHB-PX orange 615nm 42mil 700 mA
ES-SMHRPX42 UHB-PX red 624nm 42mil 700 mA
ES-SMBRPN42C UHB-PN red 660nm 42mil 700 mA
ES-SMHFPN42B UHB-PN red 730nm 42mil 700 mA

UV and White from Epiled
Epiled
EP-U4545K-A3 45mil UV
EP-B4545V-A3 45mil White

...........
TBH I'm just tired, took me nearly 100 hours of research to get to this point and I am drained out. Spoke with the boss on the phone, my human instincts told memhis company was worth trusting much much more than any others I've been watching recently. I guess I'm trying to go with a gut feeling. After 100 hours of research you start building a sort of sixth sense for BS...

I didn't know there was a section for experts on LEDs...
It's probably filled with folks building custom lights similar to the one I want...

Let me know what you think if ever you understand all this info, to me a lot of this is jibberish.
 
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A

az2000

Well-Known Member
I completely understand your frustration. The LED market is literally filled with scammy people selling junk. And, Epistar is typically found in the junk. (And a lot of people have had "gut instincts" about Mars Hydro, only to find that they have to run at 70-90w/sq ft.).

CobGrowLights is getting negative responses on the LED forum. I wouldn't spend that kind of money on epi-whatever when you can buy Cree/Vero for the similar price. Get longer warranty, etc.

It's nothing about gut instincts, just lumens per watt, lumens per dollar.
 
GroErr

GroErr

Well-Known Member
jpaq666 said:
From the faq
  1. What is the brand of LED diodes?
The brand of LED is Epistar and EpiLEDs, both of them are from Taiwan manufacturer.

Epistar LED
ES-CADBV45P Venus-series blue 450 45mil 700mA
ES-CABLV45P Venus-series blue 460nm 45mil 700mA
ES-SMSOPX42 UHB-PX orange 615nm 42mil 700 mA
ES-SMHRPX42 UHB-PX red 624nm 42mil 700 mA
ES-SMBRPN42C UHB-PN red 660nm 42mil 700 mA
ES-SMHFPN42B UHB-PN red 730nm 42mil 700 mA

UV and White from Epiled
Epiled
EP-U4545K-A3 45mil UV
EP-B4545V-A3 45mil White

...........
TBH I'm just tired, took me nearly 100 hours of research to get to this point and I am drained out. Spoke with the boss on the phone, my human instincts told memhis company was worth trusting much much more than any others I've been watching recently. I guess I'm trying to go with a gut feeling. After 100 hours of research you start building a sort of sixth sense for BS...

I didn't know there was a section for experts on LEDs...
It's probably filled with folks building custom lights similar to the one I want...
Click to expand...
These are diode based lights, not COB lights as the site claims. These are typical Chinese diode based knock off's and you can buy similar garbage for half the price of the lights on that site. If you want to grow buds with LED's take the advise offered multiple times here already. Buy or build a light using real COBs like Cree CX or Bridgelux Vero''s, not a bunch of 5w diodes made to look like a COB.

BTW: Members on this site are not stupid. You look and sound exactly like many that have been turfed off this site for trying to peddle crap. This is an informed community when it comes to LED's so if that's what you're trying to do here (and it sure smells that way) be on your way before you get kicked out by an admin.
 
hyroot

hyroot

Well-Known Member
For led it's cobs. Diy cob, Pacific lighting concepts, area 51 led, amare technologies, go green led. Imo the best would be to build your own or go with pacific lighting concepts. They use top bin BB cobs.
 
S

Smokenpassout

Well-Known Member
I use Kessil LED, very pleased with the quality. Models H350 and H380 get the job done nicely. Each comparable to 350+ watt HID. No assembly required ;-) Someone suggested these to me as a first venture into LED and I thought they were a little pricey. So I got a ufo type light instead. It was big, clunky, but smoked my cfl's at the time. Then I forked over the dough for a Kessil. Night and day difference in output, size, weight, build, and flexibility of positioning. Got rid of the spaceship since then.
 
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jpaq666

Member
Thanks I'll go check 'em out
I still dont understand the thing about diodes in a cob though, I spoke with rob at cobgrowlight (he's been designing leds for 6 years and is the owner of ledcanada.com) and he tells me that cree diodes are used a lot in the commercial lighting industry but that for what he needs in his panels he cant even order that from cree because they are prepackage at cree and he needs custome made diodes or something. Also, he says the whole thing about cree is mostly their reputation, for the most part, people use them because of the reputable name, but keep in mind he's just trying to help me understand like you guys are doing, he's answering my questions, not really forcing the info onto me.
 
J

jpaq666

Member
Smokenpassout said:
I use Kessil LED, very pleased with the quality. Models H350 and H380 get the job done nicely. Each comparable to 350+ watt HID. No assembly required ;-) Someone suggested these to me as a first venture into LED and I thought they were a little pricey. So I got a ufo type light instead. It was big, clunky, but smoked my cfl's at the time. Then I forked over the dough for a Kessil. Night and day difference in output, size, weight, build, and flexibility of positioning. Got rid of the spaceship since then.
Click to expand...
Do you flower with that? I'll go check 'em out
 
SamsonsRiddle

SamsonsRiddle

Well-Known Member
jpaq666 said:
Thanks I'll go check 'em out
I still dont understand the thing about diodes in a cob though, I spoke with rob at cobgrowlight (he's been designing leds for 6 years and is the owner of ledcanada.com) and he tells me that cree diodes are used a lot in the commercial lighting industry but that for what he needs in his panels he cant even order that from cree because they are prepackage at cree and he needs custome made diodes or something. Also, he says the whole thing about cree is mostly their reputation, for the most part, people use them because of the reputable name, but keep in mind he's just trying to help me understand like you guys are doing, he's answering my questions, not really forcing the info onto me.
Click to expand...
of course he's going to tell you that, or is it of course you're going to tell us that...........
 
J

jpaq666

Member
Seriously you guys have to put your paranoia to rest or I'm gona have a hard time taking anything anyone says seriously.
 
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