Dyna-Gro vs Advanced Nutrients Connoisseur (AK47 Grow)

homebrewer

Well-Known Member
It's only one girl, the space i have is pretty small - going for quality over quantity, that's why i came to the pro.
I've been using the walmart ro water (out of the machine, usually somewhere between 50-120 ppm .5 scale), or i tried nestle purelife which comes in at 66 ppm.
I understand what you're saying about the volume and strength of water/feed based on the size. This is in a 2 gallon fabric pot, like i said, and if i give 16 ounces spread around the outer part of the container i have no runoff and i'm pretty sure most of the feed doesn't reach the bottom of the pot.
I'll try to raise the ppm again to 250 and maybe water it at about 10-12oz. Wait a week or so and see if it takes off, then lower my ppm a little bit and start giving her more water. Sound about right?
Look for distilled water if you can.

Also, to my tastes, you moved those plants to large pots too early, IMO. I like to have a nice, green, healthy, well established plant in a 16oz beer cup before they move to 1 gallon pots.

But as it stands, I'd increase your feed levels and water around the base of your plants in sort of a star pattern. Don't worry about run-off, worry about feeding your roots and keeping them healthy.
 

chuck estevez

Well-Known Member
well, I know HB is the pro here, But I have seen this a million times. when you use r/o or distilled water and don't replaced the lost cal/mag, you get that look to your plant. Upping your feed should up your cal/mag too, Just not sure if it will be enough to fix your issue.
 

homebrewer

Well-Known Member
well, I know HB is the pro here, But I have seen this a million times. when you use r/o or distilled water and don't replaced the lost cal/mag, you get that look to your plant. Upping your feed should up your cal/mag too, Just not sure if it will be enough to fix your issue.
The calcium in tap water is calcium carbonate and is not readily available to our plants like say calcium nitrate.
 

SamsonsRiddle

Well-Known Member
The calcium in tap water is calcium carbonate and is not readily available to our plants like say calcium nitrate.
It's funny because i did awesome (for a beginner) the first two grows: one was seed starter soil on the top 2" then FFOF below in 2 gallon fabric pots, the second was a transplant from seed starter soil to coco brick (the cheapest one you can get at menards....was like $2) in a 1.5 liter hempy with perlite in the res.

I had measured both of them in ml/gal instead of ppm. I am very precise and very detail oriented so i switched to ppm. Long story short, look at the pictures. Maybe i just wanted to go a little too low, trying not to overfeed or overwater or overanything.

However, HB did help me before by telling me to drop calmag and it worked wonders in coco. I can't believe that calmag is going to help when this looks like more of a n/mag/p deficiency to me. Calmag may be necessary for some nutrient lines, but if i didn't need it in coco, i can't believe that dyna gro doesn't supply enough cal/mag. Oh yeah, I used distilled water until this grow ;)
 

chuck estevez

Well-Known Member
The calcium in tap water is calcium carbonate and is not readily available to our plants like say calcium nitrate.
I read a post from someone that knew the chemistry of it and it made sense to me. something about how r/o or distilled not having certain minerals in it will strip it from the soil to get it back or something like that. All I know is, when i see spots or purple stems, it usually gets fixed with a dose of cal/mag. I use r/o and FP. but you knew that.lol and I have seen many people with the same look after using distilled.Just throwing it out there
 

homebrewer

Well-Known Member
I read a post from someone that knew the chemistry of it and it made sense to me. something about how r/o or distilled not having certain minerals in it will strip it from the soil to get it back or something like that. All I know is, when i see spots or purple stems, it usually gets fixed with a dose of cal/mag. I use r/o and FP. but you knew that.lol and I have seen many people with the same look after using distilled.Just throwing it out there
That may be the case but I would never water my plants with straight RO water. RO is simply a blank slate where the added plant food brings things back into an ideal balance (hopefully). The minerals in my tap water absolutely conflict with the elements in my plant food rendering some elements unavailable to my plants.

That being said, if calmag is your fix, keep doing it.
 

supdro

Well-Known Member
I would luv to use tap instead of RO. It comes out of my faucet at 700ppm tho! I don't think that's good :cry:
 

GuyLeDuche

Well-Known Member
I have the opposite situation, my tap water comes out 35ppm (and about 8.4ph). Admittedly my meters are the cheapest, but brand new.. Does this seem possible and if so, what should I be doing ( and what causes the high PH)? I use DG Foliage and Bloom, and have ProTekt on order. Sounds like I may need CalMag as well? I do see some rust spots on fan leaves from time to time....
 

homebrewer

Well-Known Member
I have the opposite situation, my tap water comes out 35ppm (and about 8.4ph). Admittedly my meters are the cheapest, but brand new.. Does this seem possible and if so, what should I be doing ( and what causes the high PH)? I use DG Foliage and Bloom, and have ProTekt on order. Sounds like I may need CalMag as well? I do see some rust spots on fan leaves from time to time....
Your pH isn't an issue and neither is your ppm.
 

GuyLeDuche

Well-Known Member
Your pH isn't an issue and neither is your ppm.
8.4 is kind of an issue, ph down isn't the healthiest thing to drown your plants in... But really my question was re: the rust spots and if that was a sign of needing calmag because of the low ppm water?
 

chuck estevez

Well-Known Member
8.4 is kind of an issue, ph down isn't the healthiest thing to drown your plants in... But really my question was re: the rust spots and if that was a sign of needing calmag because of the low ppm water?
if you added DGFP, it should bring your ph down. Adding more should bring your cal and mag up. I do find when I see those spots that a watering with cal/mag will fix it. But I could just need to do the same and up my feeding amount. But it's rare I see it and I have been seeing great success going the way i have, so if it ain't broke.............
 

homebrewer

Well-Known Member
8.4 is kind of an issue, ph down isn't the healthiest thing to drown your plants in... But really my question was re: the rust spots and if that was a sign of needing calmag because of the low ppm water?
At 35ppm, your bicarbonate levels are going to be very low which is why I said your pH is not an issue.

My water is near zero ppm and I don't supplement calcium or magnesium, ever. I don't see why you'd need to either but do whatever makes you happy.
 

SamsonsRiddle

Well-Known Member
Just an update:
Everything is starting to green back up and the top is now pointing straight up at the light. I think she's going to make it through. Thanks so much for the help.


I was just wondering, this guy was telling me about these nutes called "Advanced Nutrients". I was thinking about getting the whole box, he said I'll need them all to grow massive colas.

32piece set.png
 

SamsonsRiddle

Well-Known Member
OK back to problems.
I have been following your suggestions as far as feeding (I think) and have a log of everything.

From Dec 2 - December 6 I was watering every other day with 10 oz of water @ .5ec (250 ppm on .5scale)
12-8 12 oz @ 200ppm
12-10 14oz @ 150ppm
12-13 12oz @ 164ppm
12-15 12oz @ 178ppm
12-17 12oz @ 134 ppm
12-19 12 oz @ 138 ppm
12-21 12oz @ 140 ppm

I'm not quite sure what's going on. Recap: Using Promix BX Myco w/ a little extra Vermi and Peli - always ph nutrient mix to 5.8. Using equal amount of protekt and foliage pro in distilled water since 12-8.

Looks like the top leaves and major fan leaves off the main stem only get a small size and have a dark green vein thing going on with lighter green edges.

I slowed down on nutes because they looked burned, and water every other day because the fabric pot feels light after that time. Pictures are a 5 hours before lights out on watering day (watered 1/2 -1 hour after lights on every time).
 

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chuck estevez

Well-Known Member
OK back to problems.
I have been following your suggestions as far as feeding (I think) and have a log of everything.

From Dec 2 - December 6 I was watering every other day with 10 oz of water @ .5ec (250 ppm on .5scale)
12-8 12 oz @ 200ppm
12-10 14oz @ 150ppm
12-13 12oz @ 164ppm
12-15 12oz @ 178ppm
12-17 12oz @ 134 ppm
12-19 12 oz @ 138 ppm
12-21 12oz @ 140 ppm

I'm not quite sure what's going on. Recap: Using Promix BX Myco w/ a little extra Vermi and Peli - always ph nutrient mix to 5.8. Using equal amount of protekt and foliage pro in distilled water since 12-8.

Looks like the top leaves and major fan leaves off the main stem only get a small size and have a dark green vein thing going on with lighter green edges.

I slowed down on nutes because they looked burned, and water every other day because the fabric pot feels light after that time. Pictures are a 5 hours before lights out on watering day (watered 1/2 -1 hour after lights on every time).
it's the distilled water, I guarantee it. I said before, I see the same thing and fix it with cal/mag
 

homebrewer

Well-Known Member
OK back to problems.
I have been following your suggestions as far as feeding (I think) and have a log of everything.

From Dec 2 - December 6 I was watering every other day with 10 oz of water @ .5ec (250 ppm on .5scale)
12-8 12 oz @ 200ppm
12-10 14oz @ 150ppm
12-13 12oz @ 164ppm
12-15 12oz @ 178ppm
12-17 12oz @ 134 ppm
12-19 12 oz @ 138 ppm
12-21 12oz @ 140 ppm

I'm not quite sure what's going on. Recap: Using Promix BX Myco w/ a little extra Vermi and Peli - always ph nutrient mix to 5.8. Using equal amount of protekt and foliage pro in distilled water since 12-8.

Looks like the top leaves and major fan leaves off the main stem only get a small size and have a dark green vein thing going on with lighter green edges.

I slowed down on nutes because they looked burned, and water every other day because the fabric pot feels light after that time. Pictures are a 5 hours before lights out on watering day (watered 1/2 -1 hour after lights on every time).
It's not a calcium or magnesium issue in the sense that you need to add more than what DG supplies (I use RO water, Promix, and DG w/no calmag. Why would that only work for me in both hydro and promix?), I think you're under-watering your plants and therefore under-feeding them too. I think your nutrient dose is fine but you need to do a better job of getting those plants established in those pots. You said you took those pictures on a watering day? Then why isn't your medium moist? You have a decent amount of root/moisture stress going on and you need to rehydrate your medium with a better watering technique. If you need training wheels, go buy a watering can from a garden store, the kind that poor out through a shower head and water with 16 ounces of water as needed. I promise that if you yanked that plant out of that pot, you'd see a highly under-developed root system.
 

chuck estevez

Well-Known Member
What I am saying is the distilled water is causing the issue. AGAIN, I have seen it over and over, I am not just talking out of my ass.
perfect example, Had the same problem with this girl.
1222150528.jpg
you can see the lowers, the top looked like that a few days ago. I gave her a big dose of cal/mag and within 2 days she is green and red veins are gone
 
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hotrodharley

Well-Known Member
I would luv to use tap instead of RO. It comes out of my faucet at 700ppm tho! I don't think that's good :cry:
Mine is harder.Mine is EC1.6 or 800PPM. I use RO for feeds but NOT to water in between. In fact I mix RO with my tap even for feeds after the first feeding to avoid calcium and other deficits. chuckestevez is telling you. Listen. Don't use RO or distilled water exclusively.
 

homebrewer

Well-Known Member
What I am saying is the distilled water is causing the issue. AGAIN, I have seen it over and over, I am not just talking out of my ass.
perfect example, Had the same problem with this girl.
View attachment 3569914
you can see the lowers, the top looked like that a few days ago. I gave her a big dose of cal/mag and within 2 days she is green and red veins are gone
Chuck, those lower leaves are not deficient in calcium. Also, calmag bottles are often derived from calcium and magnesium nitrate. If something greened up that's from nitrogen. Do you have a better picture of a 'calcium deficiency'?

The hydro plants below were only fed DG bases and Protekt with RO water near zero ppm. I've sent multiple samples to labs for analysis, DG's formulas supply plenty of calcium and magnesium even after a week of floods.

You need to do what works for you in your garden but I am telling you that DG bases do not need extra calcium and magnesium.





Here is another in promix at harvest. Foliage pro, protekt, RO water, no additional calmag supplementation. Why don't I need calmag?

 
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