arsenicrain
New Member
well i would, mister sarcasm, if i knew where to begin. though if i knew where to begin, i wouldnt be needing someones help figuring it out now would i?Guess it's time to hit the books!
Growmau5's BML Spydr clone: a diy led build
- Thread starter Growmau5
- Start date
Growmau5
Well-Known Member
@arsenicrain It would be pretty tough and incomplete to type a DIY led primer course here. But here are some basics
1) Choose the grow space, lets use the example 3ft by 3ft.
2) Choose the LED driver that will run an even numbered amount of COBs so that they can be arranged in a square pattern for this example, the manufacturer Meanwell makes one of the most popular drivers on these forums. part # HLG185h-c1400b. where the (c) means constant current which is what you want. The 1400 is the current in milliamperes, thats how hard you drive the LEDs. and the (b) means it has an external lead for a dimming function. (a) model drivers have a set screw integrated for dimming.
here: http://www.meanwell.com/webapp/product/search.aspx?prod=hlg-185h-C is the data sheet to the driver.
Pay attention to the current (1400mA) and the forward voltage (fV), this tells you how many LEDs you can run on a given driver. In our example, the HLG185h-c1400b has a fV of 143v. This means that this driver can run four COBs that each have a fV of 35.75 or 36V.
3) Choose a COB that fits this blueprint, the CREE cxb3070 has a fV of 36v and 4 of them fits this driver nicely.
Hope that clears things up a bit. There is no substitute for doing some reading and research on here, there is a lot to dig through, but it is ultimately rewarding when you can build your own fixtures to your exact specifications and grow spaces.
Reggae1017
Active Member
Hey now that you have had this light a while im looking at the post where you are scaling the light to just 4 cree per driver, no mention of the other colored COBs. Is this because you just used crees as an example or you just no longer find merit in the colored cobs instead of just adding more cree?
Growmau5
Well-Known Member
@Reggae1017 the light that is the topic of this thread was my first time to build an LED. i was compiling dozens of hours of research and other peoples ideas into one project that I thought would fit my needs very well. And it did! for a 4x4 tent, 285w and using house A/C, it was and is a great solution.
Now, my needs have changed. Im scaling into a larger area trying to cover 80 to 100 sqft with leds. the addition of the colored leds is just too much of a hassle for me to deal with on my newer designs. And, I have had more trouble than I would like with the phillips luxeon deep red 3w stars from Steves leds. their reflowing is very shallow and requires very delicate handling. Due to my user error, or possible rough handling, I have had several red leds go out recently. Whether it is indeed my fault or theirs, i cant use a product that isnt robust and reliable.
im keeping it simple on all of my newer builds. just cobs, mixing 3k and 4k is adequate enough in my estimation to reach all of the spectral peaks that my plants need.
-cheers
Now, my needs have changed. Im scaling into a larger area trying to cover 80 to 100 sqft with leds. the addition of the colored leds is just too much of a hassle for me to deal with on my newer designs. And, I have had more trouble than I would like with the phillips luxeon deep red 3w stars from Steves leds. their reflowing is very shallow and requires very delicate handling. Due to my user error, or possible rough handling, I have had several red leds go out recently. Whether it is indeed my fault or theirs, i cant use a product that isnt robust and reliable.
im keeping it simple on all of my newer builds. just cobs, mixing 3k and 4k is adequate enough in my estimation to reach all of the spectral peaks that my plants need.
-cheers
Reggae1017
Active Member
ok cool could you help me out? I have been reading on this stuff but I am still pretty boggled. I am in a 2x4x5t space. what lights and drivers should i use, there are so many variations on everything I am afraid to get the wrong thing and blow out my LEDs or something....I cant find the exact driver you have in your above example. Could you link it somewhere good to buy it with the LED? Sorry for the hassle im just kinda lost.
what makes you think the deep red stars from steves led aren't robust enough ?
Didn't you have issues with the driver for the monos blowing out on you?
Growmau5
Well-Known Member
i tried to be as fair as possible in my statement to Steves led. it maybe be rough handling on my part. I have soldered only about 100 - 120 leds total in my diy career. I have had a total 5 leds burn out that were not driver related issues. 1 was an xml2 from Fasttech, the other 4 were luxeon deep reds from Steves led. take that for what its worth, even though it is purely anecdotal.
Growmau5
Well-Known Member
@Reggae1017 sure man, i dont mind helping and telling you exactly what to buy. If you are budget conscious and like you mention in your thread, you have some other "name brand" leds to supplement, heres what I would go with for myself.
I would go for (4) cxB 3070 , i would go all 4000k personally, since you only have 5ft height. I have noticed much more stretch with 3ks. Mouser carries the AB bin ( one bin from the top top) for $40 each. so thats $160
driver: hlg185h-c1400b. $70 anywhere (mouser, bravo, sager etc)
heatsink: def go for the 5.886" profile minimum. this width is sufficient, but more importantly the based plate of the aluminum heatsink is a bit thicker than some of their other profiles. 36" long will run $64
fan: Cooler Master Sleeve Bearing 140mm Silent Fan $11. cheap price, great fan, i use several of these personally, you only need one for this build.
fan power supply, anything from 5v to 12v will work. i use the meanwell APV12-12 $7.
Total: $312.
that set up plus your other lighting will be affordable, easy to build, and give you great results. if you like it, you can scrap the older lights you have and double the setup i suggested.
I would go for (4) cxB 3070 , i would go all 4000k personally, since you only have 5ft height. I have noticed much more stretch with 3ks. Mouser carries the AB bin ( one bin from the top top) for $40 each. so thats $160
driver: hlg185h-c1400b. $70 anywhere (mouser, bravo, sager etc)
heatsink: def go for the 5.886" profile minimum. this width is sufficient, but more importantly the based plate of the aluminum heatsink is a bit thicker than some of their other profiles. 36" long will run $64
fan: Cooler Master Sleeve Bearing 140mm Silent Fan $11. cheap price, great fan, i use several of these personally, you only need one for this build.
fan power supply, anything from 5v to 12v will work. i use the meanwell APV12-12 $7.
Total: $312.
that set up plus your other lighting will be affordable, easy to build, and give you great results. if you like it, you can scrap the older lights you have and double the setup i suggested.
thanks, understand.
salmonetin
Well-Known Member
...
...i like your new lamp Gromau...
...inspirative......im centered on your first pic... ...in my mind... ....go with on mini "reflectors" way...
...buff dificult to my explain with words... im search pics to explain my pov better...
...aluminium not deformed... but separated with spaciators from heatsink... the separation can go on diferent sizes ...im talk on medium or small sizes for the simulated reflectors...separators go on the same way ...
....mmm... seems to me ... i have other pics... to help me...
...the next pic its the most aproximative to my point...
...its plastic preformed (but maybe a good base to help deforming the aliminum sheet too
)... but on aluminiun you can deform presing the area ....area near the cob hole to simulate a small reflector ...of course lot of small reflectors......maybe using wood preformed for the base helps with the deformations works...
...its hard to me explain in english ...sorry...
...maybe i search other pics for help my point...
...i know on these pic they using reflectors... but in my mind i see a sheet of aluminium deformed.. o preformed... dont know the correct word... and a posteriory you can make the holes for the LES of cobs...
...not great size reflectors ...only medium or small size... and you can play with angles too.. to adapt specials zones too...
...and more... in the pics... the piece aliminium or plastic ends on the extremes... in my mind the aliminium sheet are curved following the heatsink extremes and its good to send same air movement from the fans on the LES of cobs zone too... i hope you see my point... ...and i know my ideas are a bit crazy ideas.... but heyyy are free...
...my pics are only for examples or ideas....
...sorry my bad english...
...Wilson.... nos llaman a comer.... ...parrr chozo arrr papeo...
Saludos
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Reggae1017
Active Member
great man, thanks for all the help. I do have a couple more questions tho. Firstly is there another place to order 3070 cxb 4000k by single LED? Mouser seems to carry the 3000k only in single stock, 4000k are special order 100 count, there is also a 3500k single order but 6 week lead time, unless I am just not seeing them. Hopefully you know where to find them, otherwise I suppose I can do 3000k and try to deal with the stretch ( only problem is I am not even sure this is feasible in my space), or maybe an alternative would be to use some 3000k and some 5000k cree, or another option I have seen (now that im shopping) is the Vero29 series bridgelux COBs. From my limited understanding it seems to be in the ballpark on draw and lumens/watt, so from a noobs perspective they look like they could fit the same purpose only they are stocked and sold individually on digikey in 2700k,3000k,3500k,4000k? They only run about 28 each on digikey im not sure if thats due to less brand name inflation, lack of quality, or if these are essentially a lower bin equivalent of the cree?
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Growmau5
Well-Known Member
@salmonetin I really like your idea of adding some "mini reflectors" The holes in my face panel are 35mm. Currently, I have the chassis of the light mounted directly to face panel you see pictured. I do have an additional 1.5 inches of clearance inside the fixture so that i can have room to add a reflector. I thought about trying to get someone with a "Maker Bot" to fabricate what I need, but i fear just about any kind of plastic will deform or melt, like in the picture about. Im currently browsing Kingbrite for a reflector solution. Ill keep ya posted.
Growmau5
Well-Known Member
@Reggae1017 Sourcing cxA are easy, any color, CRI, or Bin, no problem. When it comes to cxB, the newer version suggested in my earlier post, things get more scarce. Ideally, you would want the cxb3070 AD (top top bin for our purposes) 4000k./ I dont have a link for you unfortunately. You may want to contact Jerry @ kingbrite. I have not done business with them, but I hear and read great customer experiences.
Reggae1017
Active Member
ok great, thanks for all your help. Off to read more...
Hey looking at your material list are you thinking of everything just riding on the heatsink with a fan blowing over the driver, or expecting me to come up with a tube design to house the driver ( which i can certainly do). Just wasn't sure if you were thinking skeletal design/minimal cooling needed or just focusing on the lights. I do have an extra pc power supply and 5 zone fan controller with temp probes that fits a pc 5.25 bay. would be cool to run that. Would give your temps along the heatsink as well as possible expansion to up to 5 fan zones.
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salmonetin
Well-Known Member
...i prefer "fine" aluminium sheet or other metal for not deformate with hot temps ...not plastic...
...and maybe other exterior sheet with more saparation from the reflectors sheet and opened for her extremes for ventilation or cleanning or washing proceses with highly light transmissive polycarbonate material...
...for protect a bit the leds... i know its expensive way... but seems to me better than templed cristal for hot temps (on the cristal or policarbonate sheets ... the officine rectangular lamps cases or other forms are good inspiration for my pov
)...sacrifice some numbers and its expensive way but i like... and maybe better for the vegetative stage with high humdity......my inexpert and crazy ideas....
Saludos
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...i prefer "fine" aluminium sheet or other metal for not deformate with hot temps ...not plastic...
...and maybe other exterior sheet with more saparation from the reflectors sheet and opened for her extremes for ventilation or cleanning or washing proceses with highly light transmissive polycarbonate material...
...for protect a bit the leds... i know its expensive way... but seems to me better than templed cristal for hot temps (on the cristal or policarbonate sheets ... the officine rectangular lamps cases or other forms are good inspiration for my pov
...my inexpert and crazy ideas....
Saludos
how about thin anodized aluminum sheets stamped for the reflector portion which also acts as a supplemental heatsink?
bicit
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure how you would get it to act as much of a supplemental heatsink, but sounds like a good idea.
I wonder how efficient an anodized finish is at reflecting light compared to polished or painted aluminum? I wonder how much the thickness of the oxide layer effects reflectivity? Also the question of finish, matt or polished?
An anodized finish would have a certain 'allure' of quality compared to the other two finished(IMO).
salmonetin
Well-Known Member
...sorry PB... i dont undertand well your question... but i dont see the thin anodized aluminum sheets stamped for the reflectors acting as suplemental heatsink for add more metal... maybe works on this manner too.. but my idea its
1..the sheet acts as multi reflectors sheet...
2..but too helps on conducting or carring ...some air movement from fans to down zone surround LES cob zones or areas...remember on mi idea the sheet on the extremes envolves part of extremes hestsink... fins acts as channels of air ...the extreme of sheet for reflector capture some air and conduct the air down on all the Les cob zones or inferior areas... inside the sheet for reflectors...
...i hope you or others catch better my crazy idea... sorry my short and bad english...
Saludos
1..the sheet acts as multi reflectors sheet...
2..but too helps on conducting or carring ...some air movement from fans to down zone surround LES cob zones or areas...remember on mi idea the sheet on the extremes envolves part of extremes hestsink... fins acts as channels of air ...the extreme of sheet for reflector capture some air and conduct the air down on all the Les cob zones or inferior areas... inside the sheet for reflectors...
...i hope you or others catch better my crazy idea...
sorry my short and bad english...Saludos
OneHitDone
Well-Known Member
So what I am getting in this the best I can understand is your talking about a lense of some sort over the cob led for protection?...i prefer "fine" aluminium sheet or other metal for not deformate with hot temps ...not plastic...
...and maybe other exterior sheet with more saparation from the reflectors sheet and opened for her extremes for ventilation or cleanning or washing proceses with highly light transmissive polycarbonate material...
...for protect a bit the leds... i know its expensive way... but seems to me better than templed cristal for hot temps (on the cristal or policarbonate sheets ... the officine rectangular lamps cases or other forms are good inspiration for my pov
...my inexpert and crazy ideas....
Saludos
That is something I have been wondering, what happens to a cob if someone gets a bit wild wild while foliar feeding or pest spraying and gets moisture droplets on a hot cob?