Using (a lot of) 4-Foot T8's as side/supplemental lighting (so cheap!) thoughts?

I already have 8 fixtures (16 48" tubes total) and they're all T8, I have done some test layouts and I can effectively create a 'Wall of Light' using 8 tubes per side which should be relatively close to surrounding a fully matured 4-5 foot plant while the 600W HPS is above. I'll get roughly 5000 Lumens per fixture (which are only $9.99 each, like I said CHEAP) so basically I am paying 64 Watts for 5,000 Lumens which is not great or efficient but also not much of a heat generator either and placement is easy / no burn risks, etc)

Basically lets say I have 24 Tubes surrounding my most mature bank of plants, that's about 62,400 Lumens surrounding the plant(s) at the expense of 768 Watts and the fixtures only totaled $120 plus lamps. In the end it's about the price of a 600W HPS, 25,000 less lumens and 168 more watts but I am feeling like the trade off in efficiency is going to be made up for considering there's a damn wall of light penetrating everywhere even if it's low intensity.

Curious what you all think of this idea? I'm doing it regardless since I already have 16 of the tubes so what's another $60 to finish it off?

Think this will help with lower/mid level budsites? It's almost going to look like a tanning booth in the way I have the lights all run (vertically) they will start where my bucket lids are and end at the highest point my HPS can go to my relatively short ceilings. I'll take some pics later as an example maybe, going to start a new grow journal soon.

The cost of this is why I am thinking of doing it though, I would totally opt for T5s if they were insanely cheap like the T8 setup, it's only supplemental anyway... I'll have dual 600W HPS's in open hoods, possibly 3 of them... I am using one w/ MH for Veg now I used to run 3 in there.

DrGribble said:

The cost of this is why I am thinking of doing it though, I would totally opt for T5s if they were insanely cheap like the T8 setup, it's only supplemental anyway... I'll have dual 600W HPS's in open hoods, possibly 3 of them... I am using one w/ MH for Veg now I used to run 3 in there.

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Great as supplemental side walls, of course T5 HO are more efficient and would pay for the cost of the T5 fixtures over time.
More importantly T5 HOs will pack the light density incrementally better.

I would look into putting some Blues... UVBs, UVAs, actinics into the T8s to round out the spectrum which are notoriously short in hps.
Get some Coral Waves from wavepoint it will boost 420nm,a little 660nm and a bunch of far red 730nm. Along with some 450 blue bulbs a perfect match for hps.

PurpleBuz said:

Great as supplemental side walls, of course T5 HO are more efficient and would pay for the cost of the T5 fixtures over time.
More importantly T5 HOs will pack the light density incrementally better.

I would look into putting some Blues... UVBs, UVAs, actinics into the T8s to round out the spectrum which are notoriously short in hps.
Get some Coral Waves from wavepoint it will boost 420nm,a little 660nm and a bunch of far red 730nm. Along with some 450 blue bulbs a perfect match for hps.

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Hey thanks for the solid response right there, I was thinking about using varying types of lights all the ones I have now are 6500K daylight I was using for veg but think I might mix that, some warmer colors and some UV like you said for a good combination. I have 6 of the fixtures setup as a test and it's definitely bright they're all side by side so 12 tubes without any space between them. I think alternating and mixing up the spectrum would be great, I guess I could just get a few T5 fixtures for now and mix them in with the T8 fixtures eventually (maybe) transitioning over.

It's hard not to buy dual 4 foot fixtures when they're only $9.99 though.

DrGribble said:

Hey thanks for the solid response right there, I was thinking about using varying types of lights all the ones I have now are 6500K daylight I was using for veg but think I might mix that, some warmer colors and some UV like you said for a good combination. I have 6 of the fixtures setup as a test and it's definitely bright they're all side by side so 12 tubes without any space between them. I think alternating and mixing up the spectrum would be great, I guess I could just get a few T5 fixtures for now and mix them in with the T8 fixtures eventually (maybe) transitioning over.

It's hard not to buy dual 4 foot fixtures when they're only $9.99 though.

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Since you already have a bunch of lighting I would refrain from getting more T8s. A decent T5 HO fixture will last a long time (depends mostly on the ballast).
It just does not have the intensity that you need. T5 HO is becoming the industry standard for an efficient flouro light source in both the aquarium industry and the commercial industry. Perfectly reasonable and reliable T5 HO units are available on ebay at great prices.

There is a reason that dual T8s are only 9.99.

btw I am running Coral Waves + 450 nm blues against 620\660 nm leds.

Thanks again, I will probably hold off on buying T8's any longer then and anything I get from now (unless I feel like grabbing a few more for now) will probably be T5's I gotta see where I can find the cheapest possible T5 fixtures (I don't feel like I need anything fancy like Grow branded products, industrial/residential shop lights are fine by me) I'll start poking around and see if I can find anything nice and inexpensive I think I found an 8 lamp fixture once for around $150 but can't remember for sure.

Those tubes are relatively expensive themselves anyway (the specialty ones for reefs and such) but if they last a while I will totally throw one in every 4th tube or something.

I think the main thing that keeps me from buying T5s is that I can get another 600W HPS/MH digital kit w/ ballast, bulbs, wing style reflector and hangers for $20 less than the T5 fixture and it gives me 50,000 more lumens. That's why T5 are such a hard sell for me price wise but they do have that versatility in mixing lamps and lower heat.

Oh yeah, I snapped a pic too... this is basically what I'd have going on but surrounded by every side with something like this. These are just 6500K Daylight lamps that I already had, I'd probably use 3 different colors and do a pattern all the way around the plants. I think doing this with T5 fixtures would cost an insane amount and be a lot of extra wattage but damn that would probably work quite well. Only my most matured plants will be in this area the others will just have a 600W HPS above them when they are less developed I can't justify the electricity to do the whole area like this.

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Thinking of switching to horizontal orientation though as it will be a better use since thee HPS will handle the top half.

Before CFLs I used to grow using four foot fluorescent tubes. The center of the tube is much stronger than the ends. I'm pretty sure the ballast is not very efficient after a grow or two, meaning more junk for the landfill.

DrGribble said:

Thanks again, I will probably hold off on buying T8's any longer then and anything I get from now (unless I feel like grabbing a few more for now) will probably be T5's I gotta see where I can find the cheapest possible T5 fixtures (I don't feel like I need anything fancy like Grow branded products, industrial/residential shop lights are fine by me) I'll start poking around and see if I can find anything nice and inexpensive I think I found an 8 lamp fixture once for around $150 but can't remember for sure.

Those tubes are relatively expensive themselves anyway (the specialty ones for reefs and such) but if they last a while I will totally throw one in every 4th tube or something.

I think the main thing that keeps me from buying T5s is that I can get another 600W HPS/MH digital kit w/ ballast, bulbs, wing style reflector and hangers for $20 less than the T5 fixture and it gives me 50,000 more lumens. That's why T5 are such a hard sell for me price wise but they do have that versatility in mixing lamps and lower heat.

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If you shop around carefully you can get 4' t5 actinics for 10 to 15 a piece. You do have to hunt around and find cheaper brands, a lot of the places are priced high. I still use the cheaper 65Ks and 3Ks with the actinics, just because the tubes are cheaper and a wider overall spectrum is still better. So far I have been happy with wave points, not happy with coral life, and although I prefer UVL they are just too pricey.

You seem to want to save $$, you should consider actual lumens delivered to the canopy/watt and PAR efectiveness when evaluating different lighting options. EIA has produced some good papers that compare efficiencies.

StellerKeller said:

Before CFLs I used to grow using four foot fluorescent tubes. The center of the tube is much stronger than the ends. I'm pretty sure the ballast is not very efficient after a grow or two, meaning more junk for the landfill.

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I dunno about more junk for the landfill, more light in my garage and other areas I work in is where they'd go when they get retired I think. I have the same 4 foot T12's lighting up my basement that were here when I moved in 5 years ago, never changed a single lamp yet so they're good for something at least!

Best bang for the buck would be to buy some more 600W digital ballasts, I have 3 now but I don't use air cooled hoods and my little Window A/C just can't handle any more BTUs... I might buy a larger one soon and just add more 600's if it comes down to it though. I was mixing Vertical bare ones with horizontal in wing style hoods last time but 3 of them blazing together in my 8x8x7 space was hard to keep below 81 degrees.

a wall of light! and for a bargain, nice! there are also t8 bulbs called plant&aqurium that plants really love, better than 3000k or 5000k

look into getting cooltubes maybe a bit pricey but could really help your setup with being able to add more hid lights.
just a thought tho a bunch of t8 are def better than nothing and are cheap so that maybe the way to go?
all of this was grown under t12 4100k and 3000k in 2 months i know should have more blue but used what i had. i know its not mj but still plants.

Yeah we will see, I have done a lot of work setting up the room past couple days, I have a couple plants in Veg and an Auto which I'll probably be looking to get into that room and start my first round. (going to throw 2-3 in every month) so I harvest monthly. I figure the T8's won't be ideal but definitely better than no supplemental side lighting, especially if I mix in some of the specialty tubes as I only have 6500K's right now. I will have a minimum of 2 600W HIDs in there though, it's smaller than an 8x8' area slightly. I'm not planning to use the entire floor space either I will only have 6 plants in there at any given time as they are all 60 day strains give or take.

I like the lights going horizontally a lot better, less wasted light. I might just do 3 on the sides like that as the HPS will penetrate everything else with ease, I'd imagine. For the other side I am thinking of just linking 3 fixtures together with a solid 'bracket' on each side kind of how they're mounted to the beams and hang that from the ceiling in about the identical spot the others are.

DrGribble said:

I like the lights going horizontally a lot better, less wasted light. I might just do 3 on the sides like that as the HPS will penetrate everything else with ease, I'd imagine. For the other side I am thinking of just linking 3 fixtures together with a solid 'bracket' on each side kind of how they're mounted to the beams and hang that from the ceiling in about the identical spot the others are.

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Those side lights should work out well.

Check these units out for the other side of the room. You can hang them sideways straight from the ceiling and they are really lightweight.
You will also get a decent reflector as well, which almost doubles the effective lighting since it will also reflect the hps back in as well.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/T5-Grow-Light-4-Ft-4-Lamps-DL844-Fluorescent-Hydroponic-Bloom-Veg-Daisy-Chain-/321104292179?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ac34ea953

PurpleBuz said:

Those side lights should work out well.

Check these units out for the other side of the room. You can hang them sideways straight from the ceiling and they are really lightweight.
You will also get a decent reflector as well, which almost doubles the effective lighting since it will also reflect the hps back in as well.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/T5-Grow-Light-4-Ft-4-Lamps-DL844-Fluorescent-Hydroponic-Bloom-Veg-Daisy-Chain-/321104292179?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ac34ea953

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That fixture looks great, and the price is pretty damn nice as well, I might look into something like that I usually always get everything (that I get online) from Amazon because of the crazy fast shipping but I really should get back on eBay some more.

EDIT: thought that was buy it now price, haha.

are you a real doctor?

haha, nope... would be nice to have that salary though. You're not the first person to ask me that, I have used Dr. in a few screen names on forums for some unknown reason I think I just randomly did it once so my unimaginative ass stuck with it.

the buy it now price is about 85. not much difference

Honestly I would get rid of whats generating the heat. Ditch the ac unit..


Get some t5s and cut my electricity bill in half?

If you do not have to run the ac unit your using less energy meaning lower bills.

If your using less energy the new t5s would pay for themselves. ..