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Is the NRA right?

The_Herban_Legend

The_Herban_Legend

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
That's the point, right? I'm sure there are much less people with mental health issues who are trying to legally purchase a gun than there are insane people intent on committing mass murder who can legitimately pass a mental health evaluation..

This argument says those that aren't violent but are labeled legally insane (because of things like anxiety) aren't allowed to buy a gun while those that are violent but are labeled legally insane are, and that's wrong fundamentally.

I disagree with it being fundamentally wrong. If I suspect someone of even maybe being insane, I don't want them holding a gun around me. That applies to anyone who fails a background check because of anxiety.

The only people I want to be legally allowed to hold a gun are people who know how to use it, when to use it, why to use it, and when NOT to use it, how to hold it, how to teach people how/when/why to use it, etc... People who understand all the safety features, people who understand trigger safety, etc.
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100%
 
bearkat42

bearkat42

Well-Known Member
Why does the NRA oppose 'smart' guns? And I ask this question admittingly having no desire to ever own a gun (not really my thing).
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
bearkat42 said:
Why does the NRA oppose 'smart' guns? And I ask this question admittingly having no desire to ever own a gun (not really my thing).
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I suspect they oppose any gun legislation because it would decrease the influence of their lobby over congress

This is one of those issues the media has sort of taken the reins on. They present the narrative of "ALL GUNS, FREEDOM!" over mainstream media to incite talk. More talk gives them more coverage..

Fact is, most Americans want common-sense gun control legislation, including NRA members.
 
The_Herban_Legend

The_Herban_Legend

Well-Known Member
bearkat42 said:
Yes sir, I think completely differently. Just because the numbers are down from the 80's and 90's (I'll take you at your word for this), doesn't mean that there isn't still a problem. That is utterly ridiculous.
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If you are concerned with deaths associated with guns you are leaving out far more cupable causes of death. People are far more likely to die by vehicle than bullet.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
The_Herban_Legend said:
If you are concerned with deaths associated with guns you are leaving out far more cupable causes of death. People are far more likely to die by vehicle than bullet.
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Bad example, bro. Post #17



Also, bad argument. People ARE very much concerned with auto deaths. We spend billions per year trying to prevent that shit because we know it's deadly

People aren't at fuckin' ALL concerned with bullet deaths, they're portrayed as heroic in our media for fucks sake

Don't go with the analogy
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
budlover13 said:
Self defense/justifiable homicide, accidental death, suicide, police shootings, etc. ALL of them gun deaths, none of them crimes (except suicide in most jurisdictions which is just ludicrous if you ask me).

Gun deaths do not equal gun crimes.

Edit : POLICE SHOOTINGS
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Each of those, as far as I'm aware, aren't already counted in the 'gun deaths per year' statistic. Suicides, as much you oppose it, should be counted in the statistic as it's still a gun death (the criminal aspect of it being up for debate among - probably conservatives - definitely not me)..

The fact is more people die in America because of guns (be it accident, suicide or homicide) than any other nation on Earth because every other modern country on Earth has enacted common sense gun legislation.
 
budlover13

budlover13

King Tut
Padawanbater2 said:
Each of those, as far as I'm aware, aren't already counted in the 'gun deaths per year' statistic. Suicides, as much you oppose it, should be counted in the statistic as it's still a gun death (the criminal aspect of it being up for debate among - probably conservatives - definitely not me)..

The fact is more people die in America because of guns (be it accident, suicide or homicide) than any other nation on Earth because every other modern country on Earth has enacted common sense gun legislation.
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Guess I look at it as a numbers thing. Of course, with the highest per capita gun ownership the number of gun deaths will be higher. But if nobody is counting those gun deaths, then someone is fucking up. Last report I read on gun deaths did the same thing you did originally. Include all gun deaths as gun crimes.

'Gun deaths per year' infers all deaths caused by a gun. Homicide is homicide, justifiable or not.

'Gun deaths per year ' does not equate to crime.
 
Harrekin

Harrekin

Well-Known Member
If you subtract suicides from the gun deaths and then compare it to overall violent crime of other countries, the US with the exception of certain outlier locations has a lower overall rate of violent crime than the likes of the UK or France.
 
ricky1lung

ricky1lung

Well-Known Member
I was watching a show the other day that had a family of survivalists on it.
The dad was teaching his little kids about guns.

So in one of the scenes the kid is holding what appeared to be an Ak, the image of that kid instantly resembled pics of child soldiers that are used in the media to show the shock and horror of whatever fighters are being targeted at the time.

Get this though. On one side of the coin, people want to kill people with the arsenals they've accumulated, flip the coin and it's the other guys who want to do it.

Take a look at some pics of American kids with guns and do a side by side of child soldiers. It's actually pretty scary to see how little the pics differ.

This may be slightly off topic, but maybe it will make some people realize that they bitch about the other guys with guns but seem to be very willing to train their own "child soldiers" at home.
NRA supports and encourages kids to have guns, to me, that's wrong.


image.jpeg


 
Flaming Pie

Flaming Pie

Well-Known Member
sunni said:
i just wanna state that anyone can pass a mental illness test its very easy for people who have the more psychotic mental health problems that often murder people they can pass an evaul with flying colors
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I was just thinking that. The truly homicidal mental illnesses don't always get diagnosed.
 
Flaming Pie

Flaming Pie

Well-Known Member
sunni said:
youre not likely to be violent if you have just acute anxiety problems.
but it is considered mental health since its from a chemical imbalance in the brain

why should they be scrutinized for having their flight or fight instincts tick off when they are in the grocery store or a concert?


it is probable the mental health evaluation is unlikely to do much good if you base who owns a gun solely on that evaluation alone.
youll be denying people who are unlikey to do harm and allowing people like sociopaths to pass with flying colors
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I owned a firearm for 4 years. I sold it when times got rough and we needed the money.

It was always locked up except for when I went to the gun range and when I was cleaning it.

I have anxiety and depression. I was also being emotionally abused at the time. I never once thought to go get my gun and never once used it as a threat.

There are plenty of people with mental illness that do not seek treatment and sociopaths can act completely normal until they decide to kill.

Look at russia, they have super strict gun laws but they still get mass shootings. They have twice as many homicides with half the population of the US. Even with only a 25% gun homicide rate.

People who want to kill will find a way.
 
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