Lucas Formula/FloraNova

[profgerbik]

i know this is kind of a stupid question, but i have been checking all around on the net and cannot find a direct answer.

lucas states use 8ml per gallon when using flora nova bloom. his directions are just not direct enough for me the regular flora series is direct enough but this one kinda leaves me guessing.

does he mean literally use flora nova bloom from start to finish? and that is all? it says 1 part so im assuming so but its just not really direct enough. i want to know for sure though before i end up doing it. ive never used lucas formula before and have had great results but i really want to make sure what he means exactly and am eager to try this out and see what its all about.

everyone else seems to be wondering the same. some people have said they use 4ml of nova gro and bloom, then up it to 8ml during flowering but it says nothing about that in the lucas formula site.

then some say use 5ml for veg of nova bloom and 8ml for flowering and thats it using a little additives of your choice, again its not really stated in lucas site what amount you should use for veg or if you just use the 8ml he suggest all throughout.

there is also a very huge debate about lucas never stating using 0-5-10 ratio for veg, he just mentions it for low lighting situations which makes this all the more confusing.

im just going to get more confused i can see it already. any help appreciated in exactly understanding how lucas means to use flora nova bloom. thanks.

 

[dadio161]

Lucas says to use Florabloom , not Flora Novabloom.

 

[Japanfreak]

im just going to get more confused i can see it already.

Well you've come to the right place to ask.

Doesn't really matter what lucas says, matters what your plants say. The nutrient balance in the floranova and the balance in the lucas formula (M+B) are the same. So just mix it to the E.C./ppm which is right for your plants. Using the micro/bloom maxes out at [email protected] in bloom so that should give you a target if you want to get the same.

It's super easy to get your head around.

 

[Japanfreak]

Lucas says to use Florabloom , not Flora Novabloom.

Yeah but that fuck want's his name mentioned as much as can be so he talks about the Novabloom as well.

 

[TaoWolf]

i know this is kind of a stupid question, but i have been checking all around on the net and cannot find a direct answer.

lucas states use 8ml per gallon when using flora nova bloom. his directions are just not direct enough for me the regular flora series is direct enough but this one kinda leaves me guessing.

does he mean literally use flora nova bloom from start to finish? and that is all? it says 1 part so im assuming so but its just not really direct enough. i want to know for sure though before i end up doing it. ive never used lucas formula before and have had great results but i really want to make sure what he means exactly and am eager to try this out and see what its all about.

Yes, you can use FloraNova Bloom @ 8mL/gallon throughout veg and flower (once a plant is mature at least - use a reduced percentage w/ young plants).

everyone else seems to be wondering the same. some people have said they use 4ml of nova gro and bloom, then up it to 8ml during flowering but it says nothing about that in the lucas formula site.

FloraNova Bloom and Flora Bloom are two different product lines. If using Flora Bloom, you will also need to add in Flora Micro (8ml Flora Micro + 16mL Flora Bloom/gallon). With FloraNova Bloom, you will not need to use any other products (no Flora Micro).

then some say use 5ml for veg of nova bloom and 8ml for flowering and thats it using a little additives of your choice, again its not really stated in lucas site what amount you should use for veg or if you just use the 8ml he suggest all throughout.

If using FloraNova Bloom, it is 8ml/gallon alone throughout veg and flower. However, you can/should start seedlings and younger plants at a lesser amount and work them up to the 8mL/gallon once mature. Lucas does not recommend using additives.

there is also a very huge debate about lucas never stating using 0-5-10 ratio for veg, he just mentions it for low lighting situations which makes this all the more confusing.

From his website: "Lucas Formula should be used in the same ratio throughout the grow. There is a misconception that one should use 5ml of Micro and 10ml of Bloom, when in veg, and switch to 8ml of Micro, and 16ml of Bloom, when flowering."

"This was never stated by Lucas himself. He originally stated that the 0-5-10 ratio was for LOW LIGHT situations (fluorescent lighting like PL/L and CFLs, or HID lamps less than 400W), whereas 0-8-16 is for medium to high light (400W+)."

im just going to get more confused i can see it already. any help appreciated in exactly understanding how lucas means to use flora nova bloom. thanks.

Again just make sure you understand that FloraNova Bloom and Flora Bloom are two different product lines. Using Flora Bloom will require you to mix in Flora Micro (ratio: 8mL FM/gallon + 16mL FB/gallon). Using FloraNova Bloom (ratio: 8mL/gallon), you will not need to add in anything else.

 

[profgerbik]

yea i understand the 2 different methods, i have all the GH products pretty much so i really wanted to know if it was even worth using nova at all.

i just wanted to make sure that i should use a lesser amount from other users with flora nova bloom if using the 1 part, because on lucas site it doesnt really state what to be used for younger plants or really go into detail about the flora nova
1 part method.

yea what i have been doing before ill admit is really complicated compared to this and it just cost a lot using so many different products, so im eager to see the results.

i was checking out the Ask Lucas thread, he says you can use at least 1m of floralicious plus with both methods and because it has sea kelp which i love, im going to just try it, i guess 5ml of nova bloom and 1ml of floralicious plus, then up the nova bloom to 8m at flowering. wish me luck, based on the back of the bottles it should work quite well, its quite similar to the combination of the regular bloom and micro. been looking around as nova is supposed to provide better results and because it PH stabilized its easier to use.

let me know how that sounds, i think they should be able to handle it. if you think 5ml of nova is too much for week and a half old plants let me know i think it should be alright though, they are pretty big now.

thanks guys, changing out my res as i type, hopefully it proves good results. i got my meter ready.

worse comes to worse i can always just switch to the micro and bloom. nice to get reassurance because there is so many people doing different weird things, it works but i want to try and stick to his formula as close a possible with this grow and see how it goes. im sure most of you seen rumples grow and i was very impressed with that just using micro and bloom so why not give it a try. cant hurt.

thanks again, glad i wasnt confused like the rest of things ive been reading from others you guys nailed it. just in time.

 

[Japanfreak]

I still say that nobody can tell you how strong or weak your E.C. can be, only safe ball-parks so unless you see tip burn test the limits.

 

[TaoWolf]

yea i understand the 2 different methods, i have all the GH products pretty much so i really wanted to know if it was even worth using nova at all.

i just wanted to make sure that i should use a lesser amount from other users with flora nova bloom if using the 1 part, because on lucas site it doesnt really state what to be used for younger plants or really go into detail about the flora nova
1 part method.

yea what i have been doing before ill admit is really complicated compared to this and it just cost a lot using so many different products, so im eager to see the results.

i was checking out the Ask Lucas thread, he says you can use at least 1m of floralicious plus with both methods and because it has sea kelp which i love, im going to just try it, i guess 5ml of nova bloom and 1ml of floralicious plus, then up the nova bloom to 8m at flowering. wish me luck, based on the back of the bottles it should work quite well, its quite similar to the combination of the regular bloom and micro. been looking around as nova is supposed to provide better results and because it PH stabilized its easier to use.

let me know how that sounds, i think they should be able to handle it. if you think 5ml of nova is too much for week and a half old plants let me know i think it should be alright though, they are pretty big now.

thanks guys, changing out my res as i type, hopefully it proves good results. i got my meter ready.

worse comes to worse i can always just switch to the micro and bloom. nice to get reassurance because there is so many people doing different weird things, it works but i want to try and stick to his formula as close a possible with this grow and see how it goes. im sure most of you seen rumples grow and i was very impressed with that just using micro and bloom so why not give it a try. cant hurt.

thanks again, glad i wasnt confused like the rest of things ive been reading from others you guys nailed it. just in time.

Yeah definitely start young plants out @ a lower percentage of the ratio (everyone does this differently but it all comes down to not going overboard on seedlings and burning them up). And I haven't messed with them personally, but if you dig into that "Ask Lucas" thread you can find links to online calculators that will easily let you mix and match different nutrients/additives to add up to the same ratio of NPK+micros Lucas recommends (same ratio). Might be worth the time of looking into if going that route.

@Japanfreak - If the formula and theory is correctly applied, everything required should be there in a correct ratio while providing a workable pH range for the plant that rises within range as the nutrients in solution are consumed - sort of a balanced sweet-spot if you will. As long as one is changing the reservoir out frequently (every 2 weeks or so), or as long as one is adding-back nutrients in the same ratio... the EC/ppm doesn't need to be constantly maxed out to the verge of causing harm to a plant (or it can be, but you will simply be providing excess over what the plant could use at any one time). Not saying I disagree with you as far as the EC coming out to be a ballpark that can be fine-tuned and maxed out if one wishes... one can fine-tune later using a meter if familiar with the strain/plant and what EC/ppm levels will harm it. Just have to be prepared to start adjusting/chasing pH around in addition to chasing EC/ppm levels as the plant feeds and alters both values outside of optimum in between reservoir changes/add-backs. It's just a different philosophy to feeding that isn't centered around just maxing the ppm levels of whatever nutrient and additive lines a nutrient company happens to be pushing.

 

[Japanfreak]

@Japanfreak - If the formula and theory is correctly applied, everything required should be there in a correct ratio while providing a workable pH range for the plant that rises within range as the nutrients in solution are consumed - sort of a balanced sweet-spot if you will. As long as one is changing the reservoir out frequently (every 2 weeks or so), or as long as one is adding-back nutrients in the same ratio... the EC/ppm doesn't need to be constantly maxed out to the verge of causing harm to a plant (or it can be, but you will simply be providing excess over what the plant could use at any one time). Not saying I disagree with you as far as the EC coming out to be a ballpark that can be fine-tuned and maxed out if one wishes... one can fine-tune later using a meter if familiar with the strain/plant and what EC/ppm levels will harm it. Just have to be prepared to start adjusting/chasing pH around in addition to chasing EC/ppm levels as the plant feeds and alters both values outside of optimum in between reservoir changes/add-backs. It's just a different philosophy to feeding that isn't centered around just maxing the ppm levels of whatever nutrient and additive lines a nutrient company happens to be pushing.

Theory? Which theory would that be? Dude the numbers are based on Mel Franks recommended feedings. Nothing hard or mysterious about it. Mix them and dump them in your water. Why do people need to overthink and over explain everything.

 

[TaoWolf]

Theory? Which theory would that be? Dude the numbers are based on Mel Franks recommended feedings. Nothing hard or mysterious about it. Mix them and dump them in your water. Why do people need to overthink and over explain everything.

I'm sorry, thought the topic was well stated and understood; but yes, I was referring to Lucas formula in attaining elemental feed values. And no, nothing hard or mysterious about it. Yes, you mix and dump nutrients in water. And don't know about the last question.

 

[profgerbik]

so far its loving it, the new leaves are even more crystalline than the last and perfectly healthy with no signs of burn anywhere on the plant, im loving the nova results. my meters ppm was around 986, tad bit higher than stated but it seems to be working great.

i change my res every time ive topped it off with a gallon of ph balanced water which is about every week, sometimes ill get lazy and let it go 2 weeks. my res is only 2 gallons. is it necessary to top it off with the same solution that i add? topping with just ph balanced water has always worked fine for me since i change it pretty frequently, again another question because i see some do like me and others will do like you have said? what has worked best for all of you or what do you think?

so far proving to be very good, nova for the win!

 

[TaoWolf]

my res is only 2 gallons. is it necessary to top it off with the same solution that i add? topping with just ph balanced water has always worked fine for me since i change it pretty frequently, again another question because i see some do like me and others will do like you have said? what has worked best for all of you or what do you think?

so far proving to be very good, nova for the win!

Not necessary and personally I'd just stick w/ topping off using pH adjusted water (up to a total of 2 gallons topped-off between complete reservoir changes) since you are getting good results.

If you want to save a little money in the future, you could try GH MaxiBloom (dry). It's pretty much the same thing as the FloraNova Bloom... but in a powder form so it's easier to work with and store in addition to costing less (IMO).

 

[Japanfreak]

so far its loving it, the new leaves are even more crystalline than the last and perfectly healthy with no signs of burn anywhere on the plant, im loving the nova results. my meters ppm was around 986, tad bit higher than stated but it seems to be working great.

i change my res every time ive topped it off with a gallon of ph balanced water which is about every week, sometimes ill get lazy and let it go 2 weeks. my res is only 2 gallons. is it necessary to top it off with the same solution that i add? topping with just ph balanced water has always worked fine for me since i change it pretty frequently, again another question because i see some do like me and others will do like you have said? what has worked best for all of you or what do you think?

so far proving to be very good, nova for the win!

I've never had them come out the ppm that is stated on my calculators and I adjust my pens, not hugely off but never quit on either.

There are growers out there who never dump their rez during the grow, they use the same formula all the way through. I used to do that in my aero setups even with tap water (under 200 ppm) and didn't really notice a difference compared with dumping and remixing about once a week.

 

[profgerbik]

cool ill just stick to that, of course for seedlings i would probably want to lower it even more.

seeing the ingredients in maxi bloom, that is all you would probably want to use, if using that method based on lucas formula. it is the same nutrient wise but not really in the sense as its really upping everything nova has by a pretty big percentage.
knowing that will leave you with less room to experiment in my case.

i just love anything kelp or seaweed related.
so ill just keep using nova for now with a little bit of floralicious plus, leaves me room to play around without getting dangerous or getting far off the lucas formula.

ill just keep topping off with ph'ed water then. thanks again.

 

[blizzard420]

Best way i've seen it explained.great job taowolf.keep on helping.