AronRa: Refuting The Irrefutable Proof of God

GreenLogician

Well-Known Member
This was absolute domination!
Anyone who is passingly familiar with science can see the falsehoods in everything that guy says, but AronRa sure can describe and expose those falsehoods clearly.
Awesome. Maybe the best thing he's done since The Foundational Falsehoods of Creationism
 

Dalek Supreme

Well-Known Member
This was absolute domination!
Anyone who is passingly familiar with science can see the falsehoods in everything that guy says, but AronRa sure can describe and expose those falsehoods clearly.
Awesome. Maybe the best thing he's done since The Foundational Falsehoods of Creationism
He's also producing short science videos for teachers to use in the classroom.
 

Drowning-Man

Well-Known Member
This was absolute domination!
Anyone who is passingly familiar with science can see the falsehoods in everything that guy says, but AronRa sure can describe and expose those falsehoods clearly.
Awesome. Maybe the best thing he's done since The Foundational Falsehoods of Creationism
What about the falsehoods that we came from an organic soup? Or Darwinism. Completely unprovable.
 

Drowning-Man

Well-Known Member
I believe God allows for Adaptation not Evolution. A penguin can lose its ability to fly and learn to swim under water but a bacterium can't become a penguin. Get my drift?
 

drcucumber

Well-Known Member
yes, it was the same drift i heard from the creationists 20 years ago. Still very much the cutting edge of creation science.
 

GreenLogician

Well-Known Member
"What about the falsehoods that we came from an organic soup?"
--- How would you demonstrate a falsehood there?
Have you kept up to date with the science, or just been fed apologetics that focus on the earliest experiments sixty years ago, Urey & Miller's first foray into the field :P
We now know how simple, evolving cells could form naturally from non-living components, through only known and observed chemistry and physics.
The only hypothetical part is suggesting this is how life on Earth did in fact form.
Head over to Szostak lab's website to read more. They have published many peer reviewed papers establishing their model, which you can read in the 'publications' tab.

"Or Darwinism. Completely unprovable."
--- Darwin's proposed mechanisms of natural and sexual selection have been utterly proved, time and time again.
The idea of common ancestry goes back further than him, but he realized how it could happen, through adaptation. He lived when there weren't many fossils. He predicted we'd find transitional fossils, between the known major groups of life. The first great specimen was discovered just two years after he published that prediction - he lived to be verified. Since then we have found many thousands, especially for things which leave good fossils (like vertebrates). Common ancestry is massively supported. The theory of evolution is on firmer footing than the current theory of gravity, Einstein's General Relativity.

"I believe God allows for Adaptation not Evolution."
--- Evolution IS adaptation; biological adaptation. Life adapts via evolution; reproduction with heredity and variation in an environment with selection pressures (where some variations do better than others).

There's no pokemon morphing, there's no man giving birth to a monkey, there's no change of kinds, there's nothing in evolution creationist preachers tell you.
It's all adaptation, gradual changes. Far enough back, and those tiny, gradual changes have added up to big changes.
Everything newly evolved is always a variation and type of its ancestral family.

"a bacterium can't become a penguin"
--- Penguins didn't evolve from bacteria, they evolved from Eukaryotes. And they are still Eukaryotes. The whole family tree is like this, all family names are always inherited, no matter how much the descendants change.
 
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Drowning-Man

Well-Known Member
"What about the falsehoods that we came from an organic soup?"
--- How would you demonstrate a falsehood there?
Have you kept up to date with the science, or just been fed apologetics that focus on the earliest experiments sixty years ago, Urey & Miller's first foray into the field :P
We now know how simple, evolving cells could form naturally from non-living components, through only known and observed chemistry and physics.
The only hypothetical part is suggesting this is how life on Earth did in fact form.
Head over to Szostak lab's website to read more. They have published many peer reviewed papers establishing their model, which you can read in the 'publications' tab.

"Or Darwinism. Completely unprovable."
--- Darwin's proposed mechanisms of natural and sexual selection have been utterly proved, time and time again.
The idea of common ancestry goes back further than him, but he realized how it could happen, through adaptation. He lived when there weren't many fossils. He predicted we'd find transitional fossils, between the known major groups of life. The first great specimen was discovered just two years after he published that prediction - he lived to be verified. Since then we have found many thousands, especially for things which leave good fossils (like vertebrates). Common ancestry is massively supported. The theory of evolution is on firmer footing than the current theory of gravity, Einstein's General Relativity.

"I believe God allows for Adaptation not Evolution."
--- Evolution IS adaptation; biological adaptation. Life adapts via evolution; reproduction with heredity and variation in an environment with selection pressures (where some variations do better than others).

There's no pokemon morphing, there's no man giving birth to a monkey, there's no change of kinds, there's nothing in evolution creationist preachers tell you.
It's all adaptation, gradual changes. Far enough back, and those tiny, gradual changes have added up to big changes.
Everything newly evolved is always a variation and type of its ancestral family.

"a bacterium can't become a penguin"
--- Penguins didn't evolve from bacteria, they evolved from Eukaryotes. And they are still Eukaryotes. The whole family tree is like this, all family names are always inherited, no matter how much the descendants change.
I have come to realize that you are correct on alot of this from a biblical perspective. I read this article just five minutes before reading yer post. Explains how all the animals could fit on Noas ark. God created thousands of species of animals not millions. http://creation.mobi/naming-the-animals-all-in-a-day-s-work-for-adam
 

GreenLogician

Well-Known Member
That would help make the ark story more possible, but there are still things in it which contradict scientific discoveries, like the absence of a genetic bottleneck in most species - a low genetic diversity across a species that always occurs if it has almost gone extinct recently. We can see the cheetah almost went extinct about ten thousand years ago, but most species have genetic diversity showing their populations have had far larger numbers for far longer.

Another issue is that you aren't just accepting the evolution of a family as science has discovered --- but you are accepting it happened way faster than scientists think.
Scientists think (and fossil and genetic evidence shows) that all the types of dogs have been diversifying from a common ancestor about 43 million year ago.
This global flood apologetic has the common ancestor just 4500 years ago. That would take super duper hyper evolution!

By the way, that's not a good website.
They, like AnswersInGenesis and others, are simply there to try and make you believe what they believe, whatever it takes. They will not tell you if there's any evidence counter to their particular interpretation of the bible, and they will lie to you about science and anything to hide any such evidence.

Every such website proclaims this proudly on a 'statement of faith' page, professing that *no matter what the evidence shows*, they will always keep saying that everything in the bible is literally true.
http://creation.com/what-we-believe

If you study science and get more familiar with these topics from secular education, then go back to these websites, you'll be able to pick out the falsehoods and important omissions, in everything they say about science. It's a con scheme to build and maintain the numbers in their fundamentalist denomination, by misinformation.
 
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Drowning-Man

Well-Known Member
That would help make the ark story more possible, but there are still things in it which contradict scientific discoveries, like the absence of a genetic bottleneck in most species - a low genetic diversity across a species that always occurs if it has almost gone extinct recently. We can see the cheetah almost went extinct about ten thousand years ago, but most species have genetic diversity showing their populations have had far larger numbers for far longer.

Another issue is that you aren't just accepting the evolution of a family as science has discovered --- but you are accepting it happened way faster than scientists think.
Scientists think (and fossil and genetic evidence shows) that all the types of dogs have been diversifying from a common ancestor about 43 million year ago.
This global flood apologetic has the common ancestor just 4500 years ago. That would take super duper hyper evolution!

By the way, that's not a good website.
They, like AnswersInGenesis and others, are simply there to try and make you believe what they believe, whatever it takes. They will not tell you if there's any evidence counter to their particular interpretation of the bible, and they will lie to you about science and anything to hide any such evidence.

Every such website proclaims this proudly on a 'statement of faith' page, professing that *no matter what the evidence shows*, they will always keep saying that everything in the bible is literally true.
http://creation.com/what-we-believe

If you study science and get more familiar with these topics from secular education, then go back to these websites, you'll be able to pick out the falsehoods and important omissions, in everything they say about science. It's a con scheme to build and maintain the numbers in their fundamentalist denomination, by misinformation.
Check out gotquestions.org its much more biblicly correct in there explanations
 
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