Lake County 'right to grow plants' proposed ballot measure should be state wide...

DNAprotection

Well-Known Member
I love how you keep just saying plants as if there is no distinctions to be made about different types of plants. Like the government is going to kick in the door and make sure you don't have a fern growing. Like growing opium is the same as growing carrots. And as if there is some serious threat out there who's maliciously trying to ban all plant life.

What's particularly insane is the idea of regulations on any sort of plant somehow turns into banning plant life in general.

I'm going to leave you alone for now out of fear that someone might think I'm insane just for talking to you.

thats simply because you apparently have no basic understanding of law...law applies equally across the board, in other words once you allow for the jurisdictional authority to outlaw/regulate any particular plant species, then you have crossed a precedent setting line which implies authority to outlaw/regulate any plant species etc..thats just how it is whether you like it or not...
further, either humans are born with the right to interact/use plants to live or not, you have the personal choice of what plants to use, but not a choice to not use plants...thats just how it is...
now if you are stupid enough to allow the corpsgov (=monsanto et al) to maintain such jurisdiction and in effect completely disparaging your human right to access and grow the plants of the earth in effort to live, then i guess you deserve all you got coming DK.
 

DNAprotection

Well-Known Member
Thats called 'symbiosis'
......hard to digest the whole concept

-plants are smarter than us
...we need them as much as they need us....balance-

-we need plants/oxygen
-plants need us carbon dioxide (co2)

the best nutrient for a plant is the gardeners shadow-


-plants dictate everything 'man' does
-man has fought wars over plants.....
-killed
-lied ...cheated....stolen
-pillaged
-murdered

...plants dictate everything we do
we need them for food ...shelter....clothing....

we have been chasing the benefits of plants for millennium.....

spices
sugar
tobacco
medicine
coca
opium

and now the magic plant itself.......Reefer!:weed:


And they are still waging war on us over it
.....even among the ones that hold the plant


perfect logic-

divide and conquer

hegillian dialectic

same way they did the other plants

peace-----:joint:

I use cannabis to live a 'normal' life--whatever that is nowadays .....
good post! thanks :)
 

DNAprotection

Well-Known Member
added section 1.(b) and changed section 3., we are hoping to file this today :)

"(Section)1.(b)
That any law, to the extent that it would specifically deny or disparage the human rights as described in Section 1. herein is unconstitutional by both the Federal Constitutions 9th Amendment and also by the State Constitutions Article 1 Declaration of Rights, Section 21, and by the fact that such self evident human rights are held in perpetuity by the People."



County of Lake, State of California
'The Freedom to Grow Plants, Human Rights Restoration Act of 2014'

An Ordinance to restore the self evident Human Right to grow and use plants for the basic necessities of life


Whereas in the State of California, the People of the County of Lake do hereby Find, Declare and Ordain as follows:

When in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for people to reaffirm and reestablish the fundamental human rights with which they are naturally endowed, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature's origins entitle them, and to recognize a decent respect for the opinions of humankind, requires that they should declare the causes which compel them to come forward toward the reestablishment of those rights.

We hold these truths to be self-evident:
That all humans beings are created equal. That human beings are naturally endowed with certain rights, and that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, and that to secure these rights, governments are instituted, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, and that whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to re-declare and reestablish the inherent human rights that would intrinsically correct such governmental negligence, and to reconstitute such in a form as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness.

Therefore, in accordance with the 9th Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America,

Amendment IX:
"The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.",
and also in accordance with the California State Constitution, Article 1 Declaration of Rights, Section 21.: ..."This declaration of rights may not be construed to impair or deny others retained by the people.",
and, also as consistent with County of Lake Ordinance No. 2267 in relation to private property rights, and,
whereas disregard and contempt for certain human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of humankind, and, whereas in a world which human beings endeavor to enjoy freedom of speech and belief, and where freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of peoples everywhere, be it here proclaimed that it has become necessary to reaffirm and specifically re-constitute the self evident inherent freedom to grow and use plants as described herein:


(Section) 1. Findings:



That human beings are naturally endowed with the fundamental right to have and grow the natural plants of this earth, and the naturally occurring seeds thereof, to be used for their own needs as individuals in pursuit of life and in effort to live, and that such basic human rights have been recognized and acknowledged to exist and that these rights are held in perpetuity outside of the constitutional responsibility of a government to protect an individual's right to engage in commerce.


(Section) 1.(a)



That all County of Lake residents who exercise the rights described in section 1., and are compliant with section 2.(a), and are gardening outside (outdoors) or in a greenhouse (and not withstanding any generally applicable urgency ordinance(s) specifically relating to water conservation), are, as accorded in the paragraphs above, necessarily exempt from any County permitting or other County ordinances that would limit an individual's home gardening efforts in conjunction with section 1.


(Section)1.(b)
That any law, to the extent that it would specifically deny or disparage the human rights as described in Section 1. herein is unconstitutional by both the Federal Constitutions 9th Amendment and also by the State Constitutions Article 1 Declaration of Rights, Section 21, and by the fact that such self evident human rights are held in perpetuity by the People.


(Section) 2. Responsibilities:



Should neighbor complaints that are not related to section 2.(a), or that are not related to a specific medically verifiable toxic health risk to the public arise as an official complaint to the County as a result of an individual(s) exercising the rights as described in section 1., (and not withstanding any effected party choosing to seek remedy and or reparations by way of litigation through civil proceedings), all the effected parties shall be directed to mediation provided for by the County of Lake, and if resolution between the effected parties cannot be achieved in a reasonable effort to mediate (to be determined by the appointed mediator), the effected parties shall then continue mediation at their own expense (to be equally divided between the effected parties) until a resolution between the parties can be agreed upon, or until one of the effected parties withdraws from the mediation.

(Section) 2.(a)



All who exercise the rights described in section 1., shall take reasonable care to prevent environmental destruction, and are responsible to mitigate any possible foreseen negative impacts on the natural environments, and all persons who neglect such practices shall be subject to the authority designated under section 2.(b) herein, but such remedies are to be used to help individuals come into compliance with this section and not to unreasonably burden individuals who exercise the rights described in section 1.

(Section) 2.(b)



The County of Lake Environmental Health Department shall administer over individual circumstances that may arise related to section 2. and section 2.(a), herein, but all such administrative authority and compliance inquiries shall be restricted to circumstances where a verifiable neighbor (or resident of the county) complaint in writing and signed by the complainant has been officially registered with the county.

(Section) 3. Special Circumstances:



Any law, to the extent that it would specifically deny or disparage the Human Rights as described in section 1., (and not withstanding an individual in violation of using illegal gardening chemicals, including but not limited to, certain pesticides, herbicides, fungicides and fertilizers), is to be set aside unless it can be determined that the individual circumstance is occurring within the context of 'commerce' related activities as defined herein, or if an individual's violation(s) of Section 2.(a) herein are to the extent of violating a criminal statute.


(Section) 4. Definitions:

(a) For the express purposes of this document the word "commerce" shall be taken to mean:
The buying and selling of goods or services in any form, and in direct reference to the exchange of United States currency (or other such legally recognized tender) for such goods or services.

(b) For the express purposes of this document the words phrased as "compliance inquiries" shall be taken to mean:

A written and delivered inquiry, and an in person inquiry as to responding to (a) specific complaint(s), and to which access to inspect private property shall only be in circumstances where the respondent has voluntarily agreed to and granted such access, or where on an individual basis, a court order has provided for such access.

(c) For the express purposes of Section 1. of this document the words phrased as "to be used for their own needs" shall be taken to mean:
For use as food, medicine, fiber, fuel, building materials, environmental damage mitigation or other environmental concerns, privacy, aesthetics or ambiance, spiritual/religious requirement, (or other) basic necessities of life.

(d) For the express purposes of Section 1. of this document, the word "natural" and the words phrased as "naturally occurring" shall be taken to mean:
Plant species and varieties of such that have evolved in nature through the traditional pollination and cross pollination processes, be that by wind/weather, or animal (including human) assistance.
(e) For the express purposes of Section 1.(a) of this document, the word "greenhouse" shall be taken to mean:
Any structure where the sun's light can penetrate at least 80% of the roof (ceiling or top) surface and that is intended for growing plants in.




(Section) 5. Severability:




If any provision of this Initiative or the application thereof to any person or circumstance is held invalid, such invalidity shall not affect other provisions or applications of the Initiative which can be given effect without the invalid provision or application, and to this end the provisions of this Initiative are severable. The People of the County of Lake hereby declare that we would have adopted this Initiative irrespective of the invalidity of any particular portion thereof.
 

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
thats simply because you apparently have no basic understanding of law...law applies equally across the board, in other words once you allow for the jurisdictional authority to outlaw/regulate any particular plant species, then you have crossed a precedent setting line which implies authority to outlaw/regulate any plant species etc..thats just how it is whether you like it or not...
That's definitely not how the law works at all. A law regulating a certain plant does not apply equally to every plant across the board. If that were true all plants would be banned right now, since some plants are banned right now.

We've had regulations on plants since the Roman Senate forced farmers to grow sustenance crops instead of olives and grapes during a famine. That was during the Second Punic War 2200 years ago. It has not lead to banning all plants. The idea that it will lead to that is insane.

The idea that we can't distinguish between plants is nuts. That only exists in your crazy head.

further, either humans are born with the right to interact/use plants to live or not, you have the personal choice of what plants to use, but not a choice to not use plants...
That's also not true. The proof is laws exist banning certain plants.

now if you are stupid enough to allow the corpsgov (=monsanto et al) to maintain such jurisdiction and in effect completely disparaging your human right to access and grow the plants of the earth in effort to live, then i guess you deserve all you got coming DK.
I guess so. Keep that tin foil hat strapped on tight.
 

DNAprotection

Well-Known Member
That's definitely not how the law works at all. A law regulating a certain plant does not apply equally to every plant across the board. If that were true all plants would be banned right now, since some plants are banned right now.

We've had regulations on plants since the Roman Senate forced farmers to grow sustenance crops instead of olives and grapes during a famine. That was during the Second Punic War 2200 years ago. It has not lead to banning all plants. The idea that it will lead to that is insane.

The idea that we can't distinguish between plants is nuts. That only exists in your crazy head.



That's also not true. The proof is laws exist banning certain plants.



I guess so. Keep that tin foil hat strapped on tight.
wtf are you talking about? lol the issue is about jurisdictional authority...you need to remove your dunce cap and understand that if you have the jurisdictional authority to outlaw any species then you have the authority to outlaw/regulate any species etc, but i think you know that and that's what makes you the textbook definition of a prohibitionist...someone who overlooks even ignores any notion of certain rights held by the people and specifically the right to grow plants...
in your world what plants will we be allowed to have and what plants will you ban?
also in your world genetically engineered varieties of plants will be the only protected plants (through patents of intellectual property etc) and all natural occurring varieties will remain vulnerable to the whims and arbitrary opinions of genius heads like you Dan Kone ;)
 

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
wtf are you talking about? lol the issue is about jurisdictional authority...you need to remove your dunce cap and understand that if you have the jurisdictional authority to outlaw any species then you have the authority to outlaw/regulate any species etc,
Correct. But that doesn't mean that's going to happen. No one is going to ban growing carrots. Nor does it mean there is any chance in hell anyone is going to support the complete unregulated legalization of growing any plant you want. Never going to happen.

but i think you know that and that's what makes you the textbook definition of a prohibitionist...
I support regulations. That's different than a prohibitionist.

someone who overlooks even ignores any notion of certain rights held by the people and specifically the right to grow plants...
I'm not ignoring or overlooking that. I just think you're wrong that's all.

in your world what plants will we be allowed to have and what plants will you ban?
I think we REGULATE the farming of all plant species that do environmental damage. I think we should REGULATE plants that can be easily manufactured into drugs. Those regulations should be proportional to the harm potential. I think ALL commercial growing of crops for human construction should be subject to regulations.

I don't believe farmers have the right to plant fields of GMO crops designed to resist toxic substances such as round up. This has an impact beyond the farmer in question so it should be regulated. I do not believe you have the right to grow opium poppies in your yard and start selling heroin out of your house. This has the potential to harm society.

also in your world genetically engineered varieties of plants will be the only protected plants (through patents of intellectual property etc) and all natural occurring varieties will remain vulnerable to the whims and arbitrary opinions of genius heads like you Dan Kone ;)

Also the moon landing was faked, 9/11 was an inside job, the nwo is using fluoride in the drinking water to control your thoughts.

Yeah, I get it. Everything is a conspiracy and the only solution is anarchy.
 

DNAprotection

Well-Known Member
dude, in law you dont just get a little bit of this or that, law applies equally across the board, so it is exactly your opinion of how things should be that has gotten us into this whole cannabis shenanigans and its unbelievable you cant see that?
further, it takes a view point like yours concerning the absence or denial of said human rights, to even reach such hand in hand prohibitionist thinking concerning 'regulation' etc...
and if you had your natural born rights still intact then patents would have never been allowed on life and the commons of the gene pool would have basic protections related to your human rights etc...
it is also your same logic that now currently has case law protecting genetically engineered plant life against completely unprotected naturally occurring varieties...
in other words some day when carrots have been genetically re-sequenced into patent-ability as 'original intellectual property', anyone who has heirloom naturally occurring varieties of carrots will be a genetic threat and of course (as stated) such non GE varieties of carrots have no protections in current law etc...
of course carrots is just an example, any species could at issue...

http://www.monsanto.com/newsviews/pages/percy-schmeiser.aspx

DK you truly need to reexamine your logic on all this...
 

Mithrandir420

Well-Known Member
Dude, why even bother replying to him? It's obvious the guy is just an idealistic hippy. He's not going to listen to reason or facts, Dan Kone. It seems like the best he can do is copy/paste and insult when he gets upset.

Also, cannabis was bound for regulation, no matter the method or time. There is no way that any government is going to let a resource like cannabis go unregulated.
 

DNAprotection

Well-Known Member
Dude, why even bother replying to him? It's obvious the guy is just an idealistic hippy. He's not going to listen to reason or facts, Dan Kone. It seems like the best he can do is copy/paste and insult when he gets upset.

Also, cannabis was bound for regulation, no matter the method or time. There is no way that any government is going to let a resource like cannabis go unregulated.

such would be only true about 'commerce' if you have the human rights as described in the proposal ;)
 

Mithrandir420

Well-Known Member
such would be only true about 'commerce' if you have the human rights as described in the proposal ;)
As I said... Idealistic hippy.

Natural born and god given and all that are fine in theory and wonderful to dream about. But in the real world we have powerful governments to deal with. Courts that can and will strike down laws and regs no matter how many people voted for them.
 

DNAprotection

Well-Known Member
As I said... Idealistic hippy.

Natural born and god given and all that are fine in theory and wonderful to dream about. But in the real world we have powerful governments to deal with. Courts that can and will strike down laws and regs no matter how many people voted for them.
lol anyone who has ever done anything in terms of human rights faces such, but things still get done...
the only time things really dont get done is when folks allow themselves to become dependent on folks who think like you do to do things ;)
 

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
Dude, why even bother replying to him? It's obvious the guy is just an idealistic hippy. He's not going to listen to reason or facts, Dan Kone. It seems like the best he can do is copy/paste and insult when he gets upset.

Also, cannabis was bound for regulation, no matter the method or time. There is no way that any government is going to let a resource like cannabis go unregulated.
I don't know why I feel the need to get sucked into this kind of nonsense...
 

DNAprotection

Well-Known Member
I don't know why I feel the need to get sucked into this kind of nonsense...
actually its exactly your involvement in this discussion that continually brings it to "nonsense" DK, and then like cleaning up after a puppy who just keeps crapping on the kitchen floor, I keep coming back with a mop and water bucket trying to teach you to shit out side lol ;)
 

DNAprotection

Well-Known Member
what do the corpsgov and DK and his minion have in common?
they show us that as with those who came before us knew, there's no easy way to be free...


[video=youtube;a4xjr9v5ehk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4xjr9v5ehk[/video]
 

biglungs

Active Member
DNAprotection sounds like a crazy old lake county hippy. probably up on the mountain with the bubba freejohn cult drinking bubbas pee or whatever they do
 

DNAprotection

Well-Known Member
DNAprotection sounds like a crazy old lake county hippy. probably up on the mountain with the bubba freejohn cult drinking bubbas pee or whatever they do
lol yes you and the other two stooges have made it quite clear (beginning with your first posts here) that this kind of feces hurling is your best and most substantive effort ;)

 

Mithrandir420

Well-Known Member
You started with the insults first.

Here's a tip for you. My last one... You are not as smart as you think you are. Which is not to sat that you're dumb, but you are not as bright as you give yourself credit for.

Good luck regaining your "human rights".
 

DNAprotection

Well-Known Member
You started with the insults first.

Here's a tip for you. My last one... You are not as smart as you think you are. Which is not to sat that you're dumb, but you are not as bright as you give yourself credit for.

Good luck regaining your "human rights".
oh my, your misinformation spreading seems so habitual that even in a thread where proof of your lies are present and available to anyone, you still hold true to your ways...
lol...here is the where, what and who drew first blood ;)

Found a picture of who wrote this initiative.



Doing whatever you want when you want regardless of impact is a human right. Also, someone else should pay for it.
yep lake county harbin bitch
 

DNAprotection

Well-Known Member
We filed today...Now we have 15 days before we get back a title and summary, then we publish and gather signatures.Below is the final wording that was filed.




The People of the County of Lake, in the State of California, do hereby decree:


'The Freedom to Garden Human Rights Restoration Act of 2014'


An Ordinance to restore the natural Human Right to grow and use plants for the basic necessities of life.


Whereas in the State of California, the People of the County of Lake do hereby Find, Declare and Ordain as follows:
When in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for people to reaffirm and reestablish the fundamental human rights with which they are naturally endowed, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature's origins entitle them, and to recognize a decent respect for the opinions of humankind, requires that they should declare the causes which compel them to come forward toward the reestablishment of those rights.
We hold these truths to be self-evident:
That all humans beings are created equal. That human beings are naturally endowed with certain rights, and that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, and that to secure these rights, governments are instituted, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, and that whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to re-declare and reestablish the inherent human rights that would intrinsically correct such governmental negligence, and to reconstitute such in a form as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness.
Therefore, in accordance with the 9th Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America,
Amendment IX:
"The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.",
and also in accordance with the California State Constitution, Article 1 Declaration of Rights, Section 21.: ..."This declaration of rights may not be construed to impair or deny others retained by the people.",
and, also as consistent with County of Lake Ordinance No. 2267 in relation to private property rights, and,
whereas disregard and contempt for certain human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of humankind, and, whereas in a world which human beings endeavor to enjoy freedom of speech and belief, and where freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of peoples everywhere, be it here proclaimed that it has become necessary to reaffirm and specifically re-constitute the self evident inherent freedom to grow and use plants as described herein:

Section 1., Findings:

That human beings are naturally endowed with the fundamental self evident right to have and grow the natural plants of this earth, and the naturally occurring seeds thereof, to be used for their own needs as individuals in pursuit of life and in effort to live, and that such basic human rights have been recognized and acknowledged to exist, and that these rights are held in perpetuity outside of the constitutional responsibility of a government to protect an individual's right to engage in commerce.

Section 1.(a)

That all County of Lake residents residing within the unincorporated areas of the County who exercise the rights described in Section 1. of this Act at their residence within said area, and are compliant with Section 2.(a), and are gardening outside (outdoors) or in a greenhouse (and not withstanding any generally applicable urgency ordinance(s) specifically relating to water conservation), are, as accorded in the paragraphs above, necessarily exempt from any County permitting or other County ordinances that would limit an individual's home gardening efforts or abilities in conjunction with Section 1.

Section 1.(b)

That any law, to the extent that it would specifically deny or disparage the human rights as described in Section 1. of this Act is unconstitutional by both the Federal Constitutions 9th Amendment, and also by the State Constitutions Article 1 Declaration of Rights, Section 21, and by the fact that such self evident human rights are held in perpetuity by the People.

Section 2., Responsibilities:

Should neighbor complaints that are not related to Section 2.(a) herein, or that are not related to a specific medically verifiable toxic health risk to the public arise as an official complaint to the County as a result of an individual(s) exercising the rights as described in Section 1., and Section 1.(a), (and not withstanding any effected party choosing to seek remedy and or reparations by way of litigation through civil proceedings), all the effected parties shall be directed to mediation provided for by the County of Lake, and if resolution between the effected parties cannot be achieved in a reasonable effort to mediate (to be determined by the appointed mediator), the effected parties shall then continue mediation at their own expense (to be equally divided between the effected parties) until a resolution between the parties can be agreed upon, or until one of the effected parties withdraws from the mediation.

Section 2.(a)

All who exercise the rights described in Section 1., and Section 1.(a) of this Act, shall take reasonable care to prevent environmental destruction, and are responsible to mitigate any possible foreseen negative impacts on the natural environments, and all persons who neglect such practices shall be subject to the authority designated under Section 2.(b) herein, but such remedies are to be used to help individuals come into compliance with this section and not to unreasonably burden individuals who exercise the rights described in Section 1.

Section 2.(b)

The County of Lake Environmental Health Department shall administer over individual circumstances that may arise related to Section 2. and Section 2.(a) herein, but all such administrative authority and compliance inquiries shall be restricted to circumstances where a verifiable neighbor (or resident of the county) complaint in writing and signed by the complainant has been officially registered with the county.

Section 3., Special Circumstances:

Any law, to the extent that it would specifically deny or disparage the Human Rights as described in Section 1. of this Act, (and not withstanding an individual in violation of using illegal gardening chemicals, including but not limited to, certain pesticides, herbicides, fungicides and fertilizers), is to be set aside unless it can be determined that the individual circumstance is occurring within the context of "commerce" related activities as defined herein, or if an individual's violation(s) of Section 2.(a) of this Act are to the extent of violating a criminal statute.

Section 3.(a)

This Act shall not apply in circumstances where (a) private rental or lease agreement(s) (contract) exist(s) pertaining to the occupancy and or use of any private land unless such is otherwise specifically enumerated within said agreement(s) (contract), or unless the agreement(s) (contract) does not specify any conditions or agreement pertaining to outside (or greenhouse) home gardening.

Section 4., Definitions:

(a) For the express purposes of this Act, the word "commerce" shall be taken to mean:
The buying and selling of goods or services in any form, and in direct reference to the exchange of United States currency (or other such legally recognized tender) for such goods or services.

(b) For the express purposes of this Act, the words phrased as "compliance inquiries" shall be taken to mean:

A written and delivered inquiry, and an in person inquiry as to responding to (a) specific complaint(s), and to which access to inspect private property shall only be in circumstances where the respondent has voluntarily agreed to and granted such access, or where on an individual basis, a court order has provided for such access.

(c) For the express purposes of Section 1. of this Act, the words phrased as "to be used for their own needs" shall be taken to mean:
For use as food, medicine, fiber, fuel, building materials, environmental damage mitigation or other environmental concerns, privacy, aesthetics or ambiance, spiritual/religious requirement, (or other) basic necessities of life.

(d) For the express purposes of Section 1. of this Act, the word "natural" and the words phrased as "naturally occurring" shall be taken to mean:
Plant species and varieties of such that have evolved in nature through the traditional pollination and cross pollination processes, be that by wind/weather, or animal (including human) assistance.

(e) For the express purposes of Section 1.(a) and Section 3.(a) of this Act, the word "greenhouse" shall be taken to mean:
Any structure where the sun's light can penetrate at least 80% of the roof (ceiling or top) surface and that is intended for and used for growing plants in.

Section 5., Severability:

If any provision of this Act or the application thereof to any person or circumstance is held invalid, such invalidity shall not affect other provisions or applications of the Act which can be given effect without the invalid provision or application, and to this end the provisions of this Act are severable. The People of the County of Lake hereby declare that we would have adopted this Act irrespective of the invalidity of any particular portion thereof.
 
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